Champion Petfoods and fish "waste" (by-products)?
 

This is all over now.
It appears as though the Freshwater Fish Company used to have their "waste" (minced fish by-products) trucked to a rendering facility. Now they and Champion have an agreement that Champion gets all of it for a large yearly sum.

http://www.freshwaterfish.com/system...ter%202011.pdf

It appears that Champion has somehow gotten around using the term "by-products" (maybe because the fish is fresh?).

I thought their meat was fit for human consumption, so went to the site to reread. Sure enough, here is what they say:

"All ORIJEN fresh meats (chicken, fish, turkey, eggs) are of table quality and passed fit for human consumption before arriving at Champion.

Our chicken, fish and turkey meals are produced exclusively from animals that are certified as fit for human consumption by the Canadian Food Inspection Agency (CFIA)."

So does that strictly mean they were fit for human consumption "before" they arrived, but have since been separated from the other parts and are now a by-product? It says nothing about if they are "when" they arrive.

I mean, there usually isn't going to be a problem giving by-products to dogs, I just find it odd that Champion is most likely doing this and has gotten around it with different terminology.:confused::confused: Freshwater Fish Company does say it is "by-product".

Freshwater Fish is always looking to expand its market
reach and to strengthen existing markets – even non-human
ones!
We recently signed an exclusive arrangement with Albertabased Champion Petfoods, whereby we sell all minced
by-products to them and they in turn buy all the product
we have to offer.
We began working with Champion in 2005 when we
sent them samples of minced by-products for testing after
it was extracted from fish during the filleting process. Prior
to sending the product to Alberta, we had been paying to
have the waste trucked to a rendering facility in Winnipeg.
After the samples were tested by Champion, a product was
developed that met their high quality specifications.
This business brings in several hundred thousand dollars
in revenue for a product that previously cost us money to
dispose of – and we’re thrilled to be building on a relationship
that dates back more than five years.
On October 28 we welcomed Champion Petfoods team members Jeff Johnston (Nutrition, Research and Product
Development Manager) and Andre Minnaar (Quality
Assurance Manager) into the plant so they could conduct
their quality assurance audit and plant tour.
While visiting our facility, Jeff relayed the following
message: “At Champion Petfoods we have been extremely
pleased with the freshness and quality of the raw material we
receive from Freshwater Fish. We are proud to be affiliated
with one of the best sources of raw freshwater fish protein
in the world. Freshwater Fish is one of our key raw material
supply partners and the growth and reputation of our
products is directly related to our high quality raw materials.
Thank you for sustainably harvesting and processing such a
high quality freshwater fish product.”
We are so proud of this success story and look forward to
working more with Champion Petfoods in the future!
http://www.freshwaterfish.com/system...ter%202011.pdf

Yikes. Makes me want to load up on soy and corn instead of fish. Gotta love the innovation of the fish company - they have a new place to dump their garbage and get paid for it!

Before vs when they arrive....that would be some pretty slick wording to mislead customers.

It probably is the same stuff that goes into Mrs. Paul's fishsticks for humans (minced leftovers), but they should not give consumers the impression that they use fresh-caught whole fish when this is what they use. Then there is whole issue of the term by-product.

I think "minced fish" is what goes into food like fishsticks. The by-products from minced fish go to rendering (or Champion). Sounds like it's collars, V's, etc. Waste... If it was edible for human (actual mince), it wouldn't have been sent to rendering previously.

It's probably just fine for dogs, but so many here think highly of Champion and hate by-products, so not sure if they want to look into this more.

That part doesn't bother me. The minced by-product was considered "waste" or "garbage" only because they didn't have a buyer up there in Canada (I'm assuming that this fish company is Canadian), until now. However, Champion shouldn't be passing it off as whole fish in their product.

Now I understand. That is bad.

To be fair, I'd like to hear Champion's side of this. It is an article written by a company. What I see so far really would upset me if I fed it though.

It is this company's waste and the only place for it to go was rendering. I'm sure many dog food companies do similar things, but they certainly don't seem to be saying it was fit for human consumption. It looks like they have a master author that came up with the "before" thing, but I'd really like to see what they say about this.

You raise a good point. Doesn't rendering mean that it is unfit for human consumption? I believe that these animals that are unfit for human consumption or parts of animals (fit or unfit) for human consumption are tagged as such by the USDA. The tagged items are then moved into a rendering facility. Once sent to a rendering facility, they are not fit for human consumption, no matter if the carcass was fit or unfit at the time of death.

So before they arrived to Champion, they were fit at one time. I think it's a word game if that's the case.

Now you have me reading Champion's promotional material. All manufacturers are slick in their promos. This one is loaded:

I believe you are right: if it is headed for rendering, it is garbage.

This is the second place they make it very clear that it may not arrive fit for human consumption. It is certified by the Canadian government, "then" delivered to their door. It makes me not trust them.

Maybe that's where the whole denaturing thing comes in. Pet food meat is denatured. But maybe theirs isn't because it has skipped rendering and gone right to Champion?

I have been meaning to ask about denaturing. Have any good sources on that?

"If" there are by-products in these foods, why don't they just say so.. I think Dr. R says it best, "melodious sounding ingredients concocted by a marketing guru."

Wonder how many companies have dodged putting the real ingredients in their ingredient list now.

I've been wary of Champion since they glossed over their formula changes last year. That really upset me. I understand that companies will have formula changes; however, they readily advertised that the changes would be minimal and most dogs would seamlessly transition from Adult 70/30 to Adult 80/20. Neither of my pups could tolerate the new formula...which coincidentally, went from being chicken-based to chicken AND fish-based.

No, but it's Googlable. I guess meat unfit for human consumption is dipped in something to signify that. That is denaturing. Some things used to denature are highly questionable.

I think they got a good deal on that fish. lol
I've never loved them. And I'm beginning to hate most small dog food companies.

This food thing is driving me nuts. Like I said last night I understand what my vet is saying about comparing the larger co. that has been around along time with the smaller ones, but, I just can't go the by-products. I am just going to stick with Welliness. I did buy 2 cans of white fish a couple of months ago to see if they would eat it and the smell almost made me puke. I still have the other can which I am going to throw away because I can not stand that smell. They eat it but was not crazy over it. Last time I buy the fish. Makes me sick to my stomach the products that are put out, not just food, but other things that could harm our babies. Its all about the dollar. They could care less about them and how much we love and want the best for them. I for one don't want mine eating garbage.

Champion replied to somebody on another forum. I'll just post the link:
Did I expect to much of Champion Petfood? - Page 2

Their fish passes fit for human consumption (they say their ingredients are produced exclusively from animals fit for human consumption). It comes from these animals, but no longer would be considered that when reaching Champion (IMO). I've never seen where they have said that their products "are" fit. They always say something like "have passed" (as in, they were par of an animal that was, but may not be anymore).

They say they pull the remaining meat and fat off the carcass. It is this that they use. "a very high quality ingredient - the same fish that goes into human grade fish cakes". They think their meat/fat that is pulled off is a high quality ingredient (for dogs, it probably is). Then they say it is the same fish that goes into human fish cakes. Notice they didn't say it's the same "ingredient", but the same fish (do they mean type of fish)..? They also use bone which is also fine. But it sounds like what they are using would be called by-products if any other company used it...

I wonder if this Freashwater Fish Company sells minced fish or has a market for it. If they do (would have not need to render it), then that doesn't look good for Champion.

Anyway, this email didn't do anything for my suspicion. I hope somebody emails them again and asks more specific questions. Also, the terminology does get a bit weird with fish because less of it seems to be considered waste.

Wow... this is very interesting. I am glad that I had chosen another brand any way... but it just is starting to feel like all dog food companies have some form of 'sketchy' behavior and none of the foods is great... just some are slightly better than others.

Yes, lots of word games in that email.

This is what it boils down to. Ha, boils or renders. :p

It is interesting.

Looks like they send fish around the world:
Products | Species | From Lake to Plate

So if it was considered something humans would eat, it wouldn't have goneto rendering (all while company was paying rendering to take it).

wow is all I can say, I guess I didnt expect that from the so called "best dog food company around" Im so glad I switched back to SD!

:rolleyes: Because SD never lies, either.

I said I wasn't going to comment on anymore food threads but here I am lol.

So now let's all be SD worshipers until one of their recalls occurs or they beat around the bush about something. Because it WILL happen and it HAS happened in the past.

SD is not the almighty dog food makers and neither is Champion. I think they are both doing the best that they can, for what it's worth.

This it totally my feeling. All companies have their skeletons in the closet. Just the way it is. You are never going to find a 100% everything company in any industry, but especially dog food industry, where lots of terms are unregulated and misused, etc.

Brit, you're passionate about dog food and you should talk about it.

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I think there should be an automatic red flag when a fish based, high protien kibble is only $3 a pound. Good fish runs several dollars a pound and it is much more concentrated in dog food. A food that is mostly fish protein really should be much more expensive.

Anyway, there is no problem with using these parts of fish in dog food whatsoever. But that's just it. Lots of companies use by-products and people hate them for it. What Champion is doing doesn't look much different. So maybe by-products aren't always bad and maybe we have been too hard on some other companies for using them.

Ellie doesn't eat SD. And for my other pup, we will go through the brands one by one putting safety procedures and track record of the food first. Then we will make our way to smaller companies if need be. He may or may not stay on SD depending on what HE does well on.

I think I'm starting to agree about by-products. They always grossed me out. But, really, feeding a dog raw meat would... on my personal "gross" scale, be up higher than by products, lol, I think. Doesn't mean I think it's wrong to feed a dog raw meat at all, but I'm just saying that for me personally, feeding it, touching it, and looking at it, would gross me out more than even knowing by-products are in my dogs food (but maybe that's just because I can't physically SEE them). lol.

With everything said, I still think highly of Champion. I think when it comes to "high end" or "holistic" dog food, they are one company that I trust the most.

I pay 89 cents per pound for a 40 pound case of Tilapia. I would not necessarily rule out bulk purchases of superior grade fish at something under 3 dollars per pound.

Every dog food manufacturer has a slick marketing campaign with descriptions of their products that can be criticized, including both Champion and Science Diet.

I don't believe anyone here wants every pet caregiver to start feeding 1 or 2 brands of dog food. Diversity and competition in the marketplace are good. When a company gains too much of the market share, there is a risk that the company gets too comfortable and grows lax (or more lax) in their standards. I believe that is what has happened to Merrick.

Discussion on this topic is good; diversity in ideas is good. Informed pet caregivers/consumers are the best means to motivate manufacturers to improve their products, their manufacturing, and their marketing.

I don't believe it is anyone's goal here to have everyone think exactly alike. The goal is to think critically and to keep an open mind.

Not everyone here would give my food choice their seal of approval. That is okay, and I hope they would not hold back criticism of Fromm just because I feed it. I would appreciate the info and weigh it accordingly.