Urate Crystals and Low Protein Diet

[GAOMariposa]

Hello everyone. I hope everyone had a wonderful Thanksgiving. I have a few more questions about my baby's diet.

Earlier I had posted about her being diagnosed with struvite crystals. I wasn't 100% sure about the diagnosis and since the lab didn't find crystals in the urine, I took in my own sample a while later. Well, the vet was wrong and it wasn't struvite, it was urate crystals. I just started her on the Hills U/D food and she's not supposed to have any meat, rawhide bones, etc. in her diet. After 2 months, she's going to be eating the Chicken Soup food, which my vet says is fine for her to be on.

My issue for now is about treats. The vet let me continue giving her these Pedigree brand cookies since they are low in protein. The problem is that I can only find those in Mexico and I bought the only 2 bags I could find before I came back to the States. I tried looking through all the treats at Petco for something low in protein and couldn't find anything. Does anyone have an recommendations?

Also, are the Nylabone Healthy Edibles chews low protein? I read the back and it says 1% protein, but I want to make sure. My baby always needs to have her "pacifier" at night. She always has to chew on something during the evenings. Thank you everyone for your help!!!

[Ellie May]

Ammonium urate crystals could very likely indicate a liver issue. Has she been bile acids tested? She needs to be checked for liver shunt.

[MaddisMama]

My Cat got that and isn't allowed any type of treat Also, my Yorkie has her pacifier too lol. I give her something called a Bully Stick (its not a Raw Hide). You can find them at a feed store (they are much less expensive there than at the pet stores). My Maddi is obsessed with these bully sticks. One will last her 1 week or maby more pending on how often she decides to sit an chew I leave it on the floor with all her toys and she goes to it when she wants. It helps keep her teeth clean too! Several of her doggie buddies love this treat too . Only Problem is that they stink haha so I don't let her chew it when in bed cuz i dont want to smell it . Good Luck with your baby!

[GAOMariposa]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

Ammonium urate crystals could very likely indicate a liver issue. Has she been bile acids tested? She needs to be checked for liver shunt.

Hi. She had blood work done in May before she was spayed and I did discuss this with her vet when he gave me the diagnosis. It was most likely the Innova Evo that she couldn't tolerate. She doesn't have any symptoms..not even urinary issue symptoms. She tries to mark up the whole neighborhood when we go for walks. But her AST and ALTs all looked well when we did the blood work in May. But I'm still keeping an eye out just in case.

[GAOMariposa]

Originally Posted by MaddisMama

My Cat got that and isn't allowed any type of treat Also, my Yorkie has her pacifier too lol. I give her something called a Bully Stick (its not a Raw Hide). You can find them at a feed store (they are much less expensive there than at the pet stores). My Maddi is obsessed with these bully sticks. One will last her 1 week or maby more pending on how often she decides to sit an chew I leave it on the floor with all her toys and she goes to it when she wants. It helps keep her teeth clean too! Several of her doggie buddies love this treat too . Only Problem is that they stink haha so I don't let her chew it when in bed cuz i dont want to smell it . Good Luck with your baby!

I did want to give her the bully sticks, but they're pure protein. So I guess that's out. Good thing I didn't buy a lot of them like I wanted to earlier this year. Thanks for the suggestion!

[Ladymom]

Originally Posted by GAOMariposa

Hi. She had blood work done in May before she was spayed and I did discuss this with her vet when he gave me the diagnosis. It was most likely the Innova Evo that she couldn't tolerate. She doesn't have any symptoms..not even urinary issue symptoms. She tries to mark up the whole neighborhood when we go for walks. But her AST and ALTs all looked well when we did the blood work in May. But I'm still keeping an eye out just in case.

Urate crystals and an intolerance to a high protein diet like Innova Evo are symptoms of liver disease. She needs a bile acids test asap to rule out a shunt.

[MaddisMama]

Awww well thats all I got haha. To bad cuz every dog I come across loves those. Sorry I couldn't help you at all. Good luck!

[GAOMariposa]

Originally Posted by Ladymom

Urate crystals and an intolerance to a high protein diet like Innova Evo are symptoms of liver disease. She needs a bile acids test asap to rule out a shunt.

You're scaring me. I worried about this earlier when I first found the crystals. I looked up the symptoms of liver shunt and she doesn't have any of them. She's 1 year, 8 months old and she had never had any issues before. She's always been active, eats well (once I stopped feeding her the Royal Canin), and apart from the crystals, no other major issues.

The vet in Mexico told me to buy the U/D food and since I was going to come back to the States, I didn't buy the food over there (customs won't allow it). I bought it at my puppy's vet in the States, but since I didn't have a prescription, I took him the lab results and he didn't tell me anything about testing for a liver shunt. I'll give him a call tomorrow and see what he recommends. The vet in Mexico ruled out a liver issue. I'm really worried.

[Ellie May]

Most vets seem to rule out liver issues when they see normal enzyme level. Problem is, those don't necessarily go up until the liver is significantly damaged. If your Yorkie isn't showing many symptoms, it could be nothing at all or MVD. It sounds like with crystals and protein intolerance, this should be taken a bit further.

[Ladymom]

Originally Posted by Ellie May

Most vets seem to rule out liver issues when they see normal enzyme level. Problem is, those don't necessarily go up until the liver is significantly damaged. If your Yorkie isn't showing many symptoms, it could be nothing at all or MVD. It sounds like with crystals and protein intolerance, this should be taken a bit further.

You can't rule out liver disease without a bile acids test and, if indicated, a protein C test. Many vets don't see enough cases or keep up with the changing protocol on diagnosing and treating liver disease.

Did you know that Dr. Center recommends all Yorkies have a bile acids tests once they reach 20 weeks since liver shunts are so common in the breed?

[GAOMariposa]

Thank you everyone for the replies. I will discuss this with her vet. My baby isn't a Yorkie, actually. She's an adorable Chihuahua (please see my avatar). But liver shunt is also an issue with other toy breeds as well, correct?

[GAOMariposa]

Excuse my ignorance, but what is MVD stand for?

[Ladymom]

Originally Posted by GAOMariposa

Thank you everyone for the replies. I will discuss this with her vet. My baby isn't a Yorkie, actually. She's an adorable Chihuahua (please see my avatar). But liver shunt is also an issue with other toy breeds as well, correct?

Chihuahuas aren't a breed that has a high occurrence of liver shunts.

What breeds are commonly affected with shunts?

Small breed dogs tend to have shunts that form outside of the liver ("extrahepatic"). In the United States, Yorkshire terriers have almost a 36 times greater risk of developing shunts than all other breeds combined. Extrahepatic shunts can be seen in any small breed but are also reported commonly in schnauzers, Maltese, dachshunds, Jack Russell terriers, Shih Tzu, Lhasa apso, Cairn terriers, and poodles. Large breed dogs tend to retain the fetal liver shunt (patent ductus venosus), or "intrahepatic" shunts. In the Netherlands, about 2% of Irish Wolfhounds are born with intrahepatic shunts. Intrahepatic shunts can be seen in any large breed dog and have been reported in some small breed dogs (especially poodles); in the United States, we see them most often in Labrador retrievers. Australian shepherds, Australian cattle dogs, Samoyeds, and Old English sheepdogs are also commonly reported.


Portosystemic Shunts FAQ

[GAOMariposa]

Originally Posted by Ladymom

Chihuahuas aren't a breed that has a high occurrence of liver shunts.

What breeds are commonly affected with shunts?

Small breed dogs tend to have shunts that form outside of the liver ("extrahepatic"). In the United States, Yorkshire terriers have almost a 36 times greater risk of developing shunts than all other breeds combined. Extrahepatic shunts can be seen in any small breed but are also reported commonly in schnauzers, Maltese, dachshunds, Jack Russell terriers, Shih Tzu, Lhasa apso, Cairn terriers, and poodles. Large breed dogs tend to retain the fetal liver shunt (patent ductus venosus), or "intrahepatic" shunts. In the Netherlands, about 2% of Irish Wolfhounds are born with intrahepatic shunts. Intrahepatic shunts can be seen in any large breed dog and have been reported in some small breed dogs (especially poodles); in the United States, we see them most often in Labrador retrievers. Australian shepherds, Australian cattle dogs, Samoyeds, and Old English sheepdogs are also commonly reported.


Portosystemic Shunts FAQ

I was just reading this same site about 10 minutes ago. Would it still be recommended to go ahead and do a bile acid test? Or should I just try the Hills U/D for the 2 months and then see how she reacts to that? She doesn't have any symptoms, apart from the crystal thing. I don't know how relevant this is, but when she was younger, she had juvenile vaginitis. It cleared up after her first heat. I don't know if this could be causing the issue was well? Thanks for your help and the link!

[GAOMariposa]

So any thoughts on the Nylabone healthy edibles being okay? Is there a cookie type treat that I can bake at home without using dog food? I really don't think my mom will let me put dog food in her new oven. Lol!!! Thanks for the help and suggestions everyone.