Butcher just warned me off chicken wings...
 

I went to the butcher to get some bits and pieces for Millie. He advised me against chicken wings. He said they are fine for big dogs but not small ones. He says if the bones splits, or is bitten a certain way, it will rip the dogs insides, even if they are raw. He said even when they cut the wings up, some of the edges can be sharp enough to slice their fingers.

He said about a small dog (not sure what breed), that was luck to live after its intestines (i think) were ripped inside by a raw bone. The dog didnt choke or show any signs that he was having problems with the bones.

Quite scary!

chicken
 

I have no idea about Irish chickens..but here in the USA, you must be very careful with any raw foul...salmanella is a problem. Uncooked chicken wings and legs are sharp as a razor. I realize wild dogs eat bird bones, but wild dogs are not the size of toys..

If I had a penny for every myth I hear......
 

Hi!
I'm a prey model raw feeder and I constantly hear stories about raw bones ripping up intenstines etc.
Unsubstaniated rumors! I once asked a butcher for chicken livers and when he found out that those would be going to my dogs raw, he told me if I did that they'd die the next day!:rolleyes:
The myths and misconceptions about the raw diet are rampant! Chicken wings for big dogs is NOT recommended because they would just gulp it whole and potentially choke. Always feed raw meaty bones that fits with the dogs overall size, aim for pieces bigger than the mouth. I have a tiny girl (1 1/2 pounds) who can only muster chicken wings and things of that size. One will have to actually watch a raw fed dog eat to understand how they eat it. Any dog has the jaw and teeth to adequately handle bones. A dog will sit/stand and gnaw on his meaty bone. He/she does not bite it off like a person would eat a hot dog for example.
But I will say that you could do a lot better than chicken wings for your dog as there's little meat on it. Better would be chicken drumsticks! ;)



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Apparently you have never had to have surgery on a dog due to eating raw meat with bones in it. We did several years ago and it was a Beagle. My vet is dead set against feeding raw meat of any kind to domesticated pets..

raw
 

I was not talking about the raw diets..know nothing about them

..I was talking about chicken bones... I had a Yorkie get in the trash and eat a chicken leg bone, the bone splintered and a sliver of bone got between the gum and tooth...I noticed the dog was pawing at her mouth, but I saw nothing..vet had to put her under and remove the bone shard..
Had another get into a trash bag waiting to go tot he curb...and choked on a joint knuckle..that time I was able to pull it out of her throat with a clamp..
I have never had any luck with my dogs and chicken bones, cooked or raw..so they are off limits.

cooked poultry bones can be very dangerous. Actually any cooked bone can be dangerous as they are dry and will splinter. This is why bad things happen when dogs get into the trash and consume cooked bones. Raw bones are soft and pliable though and do not splinter like cooked bones will. Carnivores, including dogs, were designed to eat raw meat and bones. They have a special tough lining to their stomach and first part of their intestines that protects it as carnivores depend on raw meat, bones, and organs to survive in the wild. Our domesticated dogs are designed no differently than their wild counterparts, as wolves and dogs were actually reclassified as the exact same species (just two different subspecies).

Sugar's Mom,
I'm not sure why my comment is being met with your hostile response. I'm an experienced prey model feeder who has done extensive research and in contact with breeders and owners alike who feed a prey model diet by conviction and great success!
Thousands if not millions of us are feeding this way, many of them for over 25 years and never had a single problem. We all know that kibble has only been around for a 100 years or so. If raw was such a dangerous food, why would mother nature have carnivores evolve to eat a food that was so dangerous? Why aren't many more dogs dying all over the world who eat raw, meat bones? I could also tell you several stories about dogs choking on kibble, had salmonella or other types of poisoning from kibble or dogs who died because their homecooked diet was overly supplemented. I'm not surprised your Vet is dead set against feeding raw as I have never met a Vet who was pro raw. I'm very sorry to hear about your Beagle and without knowing the exact details to the circumstances, I will hold off on my comment about that. Let's just agree that each and every method of feeding comes with certain risks. I did not mean to target anybody or speak to anybody in specific other than the OP and her experience with what her butcher told her. I respect the choice that everybody has, to feed whatever they wish to feed their dogs and I would ask the same in return! Thanks.

Hasn't kibble only been around since the 1940's or 1950's? That would only be 60-70 years whereas dogs have been eating raw for thousands of years in the wild. Many many dogs have died due to aflotoxin poisoning in kibble and the big China kibble and canned recall last year. I'd say raw has proven to be much safer than the commercial kibbles on the market. Luckily, more vets are starting to take an interest in nutrition and you can find those that have done their research are recommending raw and homecooked diets more and more. Hopefully more vets will see the value of a species appropriate diet in the future!

Invitation!
 

I would like to invite everybody to come join discussion on this thread!
http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/yor...odel-diet.html

Many people have contributed and shared their experiences and questions. Many things can be answered there, just reading through posts. It's a fun thread and there are also great resources posted on info regarding prey model diet!
Thanks!

Great posts!
 

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup: I second all of your posts here on this thread!

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

How many dogs DIED last year from poisoned kibble and why isn't your vet against that?

Dee, I ask that you please keep your posts respectful to those who feed raw, whether you agree or not. :)

YEP. Kibble was invented in the 1940s by some fella who was trying to think of a way we could save money after the war. His solution was to STOP feeding our pets REAL MEAT and instead, feed them a bunch of grain and rendered animal offal that was left over from the rendering plants - it was cheap, it was LEFT OVER, it was available - it was INVENTED and MARKETED as "pet food" - alas, kibble was invented FOR US. Not for our animals. Brilliant. Ever since, our pets' health has been in decline.

Oh my god, someone get me a pill - my blood just boiled right out my ears. LOL!

Dogs don't have a problem with salmonella like humans do - the only time it's a concern is if a dog has a compromised immune system. :)

Mine are not allowed any bone no matter the size. I also just cannot get passed the raw meat....weak stomach. However I find it very interesting feeding raw and I'm gonna read up on it. Maybe someday....when I get a stronger stomach:D I'm just the type of person that if I see blood I pass out.

You may want to look into freeze-dried raw then. That is what I do and my vet heartily recommends it!!!!!

You might want to try one of the premade raw diets first. Like Nature's Variety, Primal or Stella & Chewy's. There isn't any blood in it and they come in frozen little nuggets that you defrost and then you just have to break it up into pieces with a fork. Bone in meat has a little more blood but the blood comes from the bone marrow not the meat!! It takes a little while to get used to it but when you see how happy your dogs are to eat, it will make you happy too!!

RawfedYorkieLuv, I was told that a chicken neck was ok to give Joey, he's a 5 1/2 pound Yorkie, after I removed the skin, I gave it to him, but I was really afraid he would choke to death on it, and that has been the last time I did this. With a chicken leg, do you remove the skin? Do you give a small yorkie a whole leg? This seems like a lot of food.

Chicken necks?
 

I personally don't feed chicken necks, unless it's attached to the whole bird as it doesn't offer enough meat and if small enough, could potentially pose a choke hazard. I, too have a 5 1/2 pounder, my Gia. For her, I do take the skin off sometimes because she can't handle it too good and vomits it back up if she gets too much of it. So it depends on the dog. My other two don't have a problem with skin. Size wise, the bigger the better as to achieve adequate chewing time and to minimize gulping! *Most* dogs will walk away when they've had enough, little porkers may have to have their food taken away or you'll end up with a little butterball, lol, but for the most part, prey model fed dogs learn to self regulate after a short while!
A chicken drumstick is ideal for toy breeds up to 15 pounds, I'd say! Whatever your dog can't finish, put it back in the fridge and offer it up at next feeding. My Gia will eat the equivalent of half of a drumstick per feeding but she is very active....

Thanks for the information. I wish I had read this before I gave him the neck. So much information out there, it can be overwhelming when we just want to give out dogs a healthy diet.

No problem.....
 

...you're very welcome! ;)
I understand about your fears and questions as I've been there as well! I'm glad your Joey is ok!!!!!! When a proper prey model diet is given the choking hazard is pretty much 0! If and when it does happen, dogs will cough and vomit it back up, and it's not pretty to watch and it happened in the first place because the dog is a gulper and a piece too small for his mouth was given! Why don't you join us on the prey model thread as there's lots of info there! :)

I have read it and several other things as well, I only tempted because he seems to love the smell of raw chicken so much. Right now, I have no complaints with his health, and he seems to be doing great. I hesitate to change much, because he is doing so well. However, the information is always nice to have.

Initially I switched because my senior yorkie Toy (12) was pretty much a lost cause at that point (among other things, chronic systemic yeast infection) and I've seen first hand what kibble and over vaccinations has done to him. After he was getting better I got my second puppy and and I didn't see a reason why she shouldn't also benefit from a species appropriate diet as I didn't want any health problems for her in the future. Her and my third puppy have never had the need to see the Vet for anything other than a URI when they first came to my house. If and when you're ready to make the switch, great advise is waiting for you! There are many raw feeders here who'd love to help including myself! ;)

Sorry, I hope this isn't too much off topic!



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