Lucy - post Bladder surgery
 

Hey guys,

I'm just figuring out some troubling information after Lucy's bladder surgery (removal of several large stones). She also had a massive infection for which she is still on antibiotics.

She seems fine - energetic, etc. What I find troubling is that I had suspicions she was wetting on my bed - but wasn't sure. Tonight - she was laying on her favorite satin blanket - asleep. When I picked her up to go outside - there was a large, wet, pee spot where she had been laying.

The vet thinks she might have started this when the bladder stones were pressing on her bladder and now is a habit? I'm not sure what to do. I have her on special food (Royal Canin SO) and I just put a doggie diaper on her before bed.

Is she sentenced to a life of doggie diapers? Any thoughts?

I think I'd give her more time to heal before going there... She may just need some extra guidance and support over the next few months.

I agree. Her little bladder has had lots of trauma with stones & infection so it needs time to recover from it all. I bet when she's completely recovered all will be well. In the mean time you can put a large plastic lawn & leaf bag on the bed & cover it with towel & her blankie or a pee pad under her blankie to sleep on to protect your bed & furniture.

Poor baby; I hope you guys are right. She is too young for doggie diapers all the time.

Though it's been about a month since the surgery and she's had a bath - she still smells like pee all the time.

I'm just going to wash her blanket and put something down on my bed like you said - maybe I'll use a diaper at night and hope that her bladder recovers. She wasn't ever one to hold it for long - but she never peed in her sleep or on my bed.

Maybe a washable or disposable peepad would be comfy in her bed to sleep on (to cut down on the wash). Tink had bladder surgery along with her surgery for LS, and an infection also. I took her for 6-8 short walks everyday, she relieves herself more completely on a walk... also maybe try pulling her water a bit earlier at night.

Try getting up in the middle of the night to see if she has peed yet...try to determine when she does it.... if it's close to wakeup time, I'd get up earlier to let her out. If it's closer to bedtime, I'd go to bed a bit later and let her out last thing before bed. (I realize you do work... try this on a weekend...) Maybe you can retrain her to wake up to pee. IDK for sure...
Or get a moisture alert like they sell for water heaters that alarms when wet...

Kjc,

Any idea why her bottom is always wet? Something is going on; think I better put a call into the vet.

I agree... that doesn't sound right...

Did they do a culture and sensitivity on her urine? Gabby has recurrent bladder infections and one of the first signs is incontinence, especially at night. It could be that Lucy's infection is not clearing up.

I agree with the C&S... she is still on ABs...

I just wonder if they did one from the beginning. A C & S with MIC is what finally found the right antibiotic for Gabby.

How they found the infection was testing of the stone itself. She was already on an antibiotic after the surgery - then the results came back and they increased the dosage of the antibiotic and increased it to two more weeks. 1 1/2 ml of Amoxicillin twice a day. Today would be the end of the last 14 days so she's been on it like 28 days total - the first two weeks she took only 1 ml twice a day.

I'l calling today. I picked her up last night and this morning and my shirt was soaking wet where her bottom was touching it so she has to be peeing while laying down - otherwise her hair would not be this wet. At least it never was before.

I have a sneaking suspicion that the antibiotic may not be the right one. That does happen!

Yes, it's happened to me before even.

I'll let you know what the Vet has to say. Good thing my baby is getting groomed on Monday - she is stinky and matted back there where I keep having to wash her off; then she just pees on it again.

I think I'll just go with a really short cut until we get all this straightened out! My poor baby; two surgeries at two years old. Ok, one was a spay but STILL.

Is this just amoxicillin or amoxicillin plus clavulanate (Clavamox)?
There is a good chance that things will clear after switching antibiotics, esp. if a culture was done so the vet knows which one to try next (but it doesn't really sound like they did one - just a stone analysis).

She is just on Amoxicillin only. I'm still waiting for the vet to call me back ! The tech said that he planned to re-test her urine one week after she completed her antibiotics to make sure they got rid of the infection.

I told them what was going on and hope he calls me soon.

I picked her favorite satin blanky and it was just covered in pee spots - where she lays. She would never have done that before.

Personally, I would be at the vet...not calling. It is not normal for her to be incontinent like this. I don't understand the antibiotic she is on. Not something I have ever been given for my pups...not saying it won't work, but I would question it. Definitely ask if a C&S was done.

Just the amoxi may work, but it's not something I'm too familiar with because most vets use Clavamox (added drug to inhibit bacteria from making amoxi ineffective). It's generally considered a much better choice in dogs. And sometimes that doesn't work. So then you'd be looking at the quinolones, baytril, the cephalosporins, etc. This is not normal. I would take her in tonight.

Oh poor Lucy. Paris had bladder stones too, not a fun surgery. Hope you take her in and get this figured out.

Well, the vet called me back. He thinks that it is no coincidence that this started with the start of the Royal Canin SO which he states is designed to make them go more often though, ideally, NOT to the point of peeing in her sleep.

He states they did culture her urine and he is going to culture it again next Thursday when she has been off the antibiotics for one week. He states that the antibiotic she was given was specific for the bacteria she had - but that the best news would be that perhaps it was resistant and we could then fix all this with a new antibiotic.

In the menatime, I'm to make sure she goes out more frequently, take up water one hour before bedtime and take her outside (and stay with her) right before bed as opposed to 30 minutes before bed. I'm to try this tonight, along with feeding her earlier in the evening, and see how she does.

If her culture turns out fine ~ then we will look at a diet change (and perhaps I'll look at a second opinion).

I took her for a walk today and she peed several times - but she likes to pee whenever Ringo does so not sure that means anything.

The vet called before I saw all your responses. He thinks it is due to the food - she wasn't good at holding her bladder before (true but she didn't pee in her sleep) and that this food with it's high salt content has pushed her to not holding it at all.

I'm at a loss now but have to get back to work.

OK...well this is what someone else said recently here on YT about that food. I personally have never had that problem with either of the pups that I have that are on SO.

As for the resistance to the antibiotic...that makes NO sense to me if he did a culture and sensitivity. That is the very reason to do a culture and sensitivity...to find out WHAT antibiotic the bacteria is not resistant to.

This is very confusing to me for sure. I just hope he is right and it is a non issue.

I just called my vet and spoke with one of the techs. I was baffled by the fact that no one ever told me that my pups would have excessive thirst and urination on the Urinary SO. She said that she has never heard of such a thing....and that they have many, many clients on that food and never have such comments! I asked her about the mode of action of the food and she was not sure but surmised it has something to do with the pH and also the amount of ash and minerals because those are the things found in dog foods that cause stones to form.

I cannot find anything on the Royal Canin site about this, but might take some time to call one day to ask some questions.

I just went through all that with Leo. He's 2.5 yrs old and has been potty trained since he was very young. A couple of weeks ago we were sitting on the sofa watching tv & he pee on the blanket that was on the sofa :( After that he started peeing everywhere in the house. I had no clue what was going on. But I also noted that he looked kind of sad all the time, never lost his appetite though. I took him to the vet & sure enough he had calcium oxalate stones in his bladder. He had surgery 3 weeks ago & is doing great. No more accidents!!!! The only problem now is that he has to be on a special diet. I have 2 yorkies & is kind of hard to feed two different diets. I suppose to take him back to the vet in a couple of weeks so he can check his urine again. Will keep you posted. I hope Lucy gets better.

Thank you; I'm glad the surgery went well for Leo. I guess for Lucy - she started peeing everywhere two weeks AFTER her surgery that concerned me.

It is hard to feed 2 different diets - I have a Westie as well and I have to give him a small bite of whatever Lucy has. I had to squirt water in his mouth from a syringe when I was giving her medicine or he would get jealous that he wasn't getting any.

I sure hope we get Lucy straightened out. Really, I haven't noticed her drinking excessively or anything since we started her special diet. She sure does like that food though. I also started adding water to her morning food and warming it for a minute (she loves that) and she gets only canned food at night now. So, maybe she is getting too much water.

I just don't know! Dogs ~ they are every bit as worrisome as kids when they get sick.

Sending prayers and positive thoughts for Lucy that the changes will help.

Ringo is funny that he wants his syringe "treat" too. :) They are like kids in so many ways.

I hope they can get Lucy's problem figured out. Perhaps it is only something that time will fix. I'll keep you both in my thoughts.

Maybe the first C&S got contaminated somehow and showed the wrong AB sensitivity... or they list the ABs in order maybe the vet didn't want to use the first one listed (for whatever reason).

Maybe too the food is not agreeing with her.... if she's sensitive she may do better with something else.... Usually Kidney diets do contain more salt, to get the dog to drink more, hence pee more.... and less specific minerals and junk for the kidneys to have to process out. That's why when they stop eating, they get SubQ fluids.

Well, we had a better evening and night. I fed Lucy early - about 5:00 pm instead of 7:00 - when we usually eat!

I went out with her each time and made sure she wasn't just hanging around on the deck and made sure she went into the yard and used the bathroom.

I took her out right before bed - put a bunch of pee pads at the foot of the bed - and she woke me up at 5:49 licking my nose. Instead of trying to pet her back to sleep - I got up and let her out. Some days I get up at 5:00 - and maybe her internal clock is used to that now. I might have to get up at 5:00 on all days and just go back to bed.

Anyway, she kept dry. I'm anxious to see how she does today with just my son and Dad here.

Yay Lucy!

That sounds very good! I'm sure it's hard to get out of bed everyday at 5 a.m., but it's worth having a dry bed, plus I'm sure Lucy likes having a dry bottom. It probably bothers here when that happens.

Well, she did fine until today. No wet blankets on her bed and no wet blankets on mine. No wet bottom.

She drank a bunch of water this afternoon and I remember thinking that I should let her out soon. I got distracted cleaning the refrigerator and about 45 minutes later - wet bottom. My fault. I've tried to be very diligent and she even slept until about 6 am today with no wetting.

So. I'm not going to let one accident get us down; she's been doing well. Back to the Vet on Thursday for a culture. I'm hoping culture and sensitivity test are one and the same but I'll ask the vet because he just used the word 'culture'.