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-   Sick & Injured / Emergencies Talk (https://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/sick-injured-emergencies-talk/)
-   -   Cerebellar Syndrome and raised pre-prandial bile acids (https://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/sick-injured-emergencies-talk/207405-cerebellar-syndrome-raised-pre-prandial-bile-acids.html)

ladyjane 06-02-2010 02:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carina (Post 3149540)
I took little Fudge to another Vet. And by the way to the person who claimed that I am one of those people that can't afford tests to be done,you are so wrong. The 1st Vet said he might have meningitis and I must observe my doggie for 4 days and bring him back. I took Fudgie to another Vet and he immediately started with a course of antibiotics. I'm taking him back on Friday for the MRI. He's a bit better but still not well at all. I will do anything (and pay anything) for Fudgie to be 100% again.
I am sorry you took it that way! I was just commenting because people were saying the vet was at fault without knowing the full story from both you and the vet. I had NO idea what the circumstances were...nor did anyone else. It was NOT a comment about you personally! You had not elaborated on what the first vet suggested as a course of action, so I could not see blaming him/her.

I am glad you have a vet you are happy with and that tests are being done. I will pray for Fudgie and that he has good results on Friday. Please be sure to update us on how it goes!

lillymae 06-02-2010 09:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carina (Post 3149540)
I took little Fudge to another Vet. And by the way to the person who claimed that I am one of those people that can't afford tests to be done,you are so wrong. The 1st Vet said he might have meningitis and I must observe my doggie for 4 days and bring him back. I took Fudgie to another Vet and he immediately started with a course of antibiotics. I'm taking him back on Friday for the MRI. He's a bit better but still not well at all. I will do anything (and pay anything) for Fudgie to be 100% again.
Oh thank God you got a second opinion. Now I'm really angry, once again a vet has failed the pup and owner. What kind of a vet is going to suspect meningitis and wait 4 days to start treatment???:eek: I am just disgusted to hear these kinds of things and it seems it's happening WAY too often. To the OP, You did good by getting that second opinion and YOU probably just saved your dogs life so give yourself a pat on the back:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup: I will be praying for Fudge to make a speedy and FULL recovery.

lillymae 06-02-2010 09:26 PM
Carina, Please come back and update on fudge as some of us here follow along and worry rite along with you. I am so relieved you got that 2nd opinion. You are a good doggie owner.;)

Carina 06-07-2010 01:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lillymae (Post 3150741)
Carina, Please come back and update on fudge as some of us here follow along and worry rite along with you. I am so relieved you got that 2nd opinion. You are a good doggie owner.;)
Fudge went for numerous tests, they now treat him for liver shunt as the bloodcounts were very high. I am still so worried about him as it seems that he is not getting better. They've asked me to treat him for two weeks on a low protein diet. If there is no drastic improvement, then we have to look at neuro issues... I am so worried about my poor baby!!

TLC 06-10-2010 09:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carina (Post 3154700)
Fudge went for numerous tests, they now treat him for liver shunt as the bloodcounts were very high. I am still so worried about him as it seems that he is not getting better. They've asked me to treat him for two weeks on a low protein diet. If there is no drastic improvement, then we have to look at neuro issues... I am so worried about my poor baby!!
Did they run a Bile Acid Serum test? This shows liver function. If so, what are the 2 numbers (pre and post)?

Carina 06-10-2010 10:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TLC (Post 3158754)
Did they run a Bile Acid Serum test? This shows liver function. If so, what are the 2 numbers (pre and post)?
Yes they did. 148 and 182.... They are treating him now, but he is still very disorientated. Yesterday he was fine and today he is worse again. He is on a special diet as well and liver ensime meds. I don't know anymore!!!

dwerten 06-10-2010 10:02 AM
on this link there are videos of a dog with a liver shunt so check it out.

Please post the bats like TLC stated and if your dog is having neurological signs did they give you lactulose to get the toxins out of the body faster? What is your vet doing at this point?

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/sic...-my-puppy.html

Carina 06-10-2010 10:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwerten (Post 3158778)
on this link there are videos of a dog with a liver shunt so check it out.

Please post the bats like TLC stated and if your dog is having neurological signs did they give you lactulose to get the toxins out of the body faster? What is your vet doing at this point?

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/sic...-my-puppy.html

Yes they did all that. I also refrain from giving him high protien food. The Vet said I must just monitor him for another couple of days in order to give the meds some time to work...

spiritwings1202 06-10-2010 10:25 AM
hope your baby is feeling better soon!

TLC 06-10-2010 10:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carina (Post 3158775)
Yes they did. 148 and 182.... They are treating him now, but he is still very disorientated. Yesterday he was fine and today he is worse again. He is on a special diet as well and liver ensime meds. I don't know anymore!!!
Oh yes, those BATs are high, they are in the Liver Shunt range.
What is the food you are feeding? What is the supplements?

Liver Shunt dogs do "better" when you feed 5 to 6 small meals spread throughout the day and into the night.

He should also be on an Antib and Lactulose, which will help rid his body of toxins thru waste. e should be pooping 2 to 3 times a day, and it should be like soft ice cream.

dwerten 06-10-2010 11:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TLC (Post 3158824)
Oh yes, those BATs are high, they are in the Liver Shunt range.
What is the food you are feeding? What is the supplements?

Liver Shunt dogs do "better" when you feed 5 to 6 small meals spread throughout the day and into the night.

He should also be on an Antib and Lactulose, which will help rid his body of toxins thru waste. e should be pooping 2 to 3 times a day, and it should be like soft ice cream.
yeah sounds like a shunt :(

here is some info i found today that I think is really good

WHAT ARE PORTOSYSTEMIC SHUNTS?

do they do shunt repairs there?

I think your pup needs lactulose :(

does your pup act like pup in those videos on the link?

Carina 06-18-2010 03:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwerten (Post 3158852)
yeah sounds like a shunt :(

here is some info i found today that I think is really good

WHAT ARE PORTOSYSTEMIC SHUNTS?

do they do shunt repairs there?

I think your pup needs lactulose :(

does your pup act like pup in those videos on the link?

Yes he acts like those pups. I took him back to the Vet, they have now done ultrasound to establish a liver shunt. They could not pick up a shunt!!! They suspect the shunt may be only a small one. Fudge is booked for an operation in two weeks time to see if they can find a shunt. If nothing, then I don't know what else can be wrong with my baby....

TLC 06-18-2010 06:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carina (Post 3167172)
Yes he acts like those pups. I took him back to the Vet, they have now done ultrasound to establish a liver shunt. They could not pick up a shunt!!! They suspect the shunt may be only a small one. Fudge is booked for an operation in two weeks time to see if they can find a shunt. If nothing, then I don't know what else can be wrong with my baby....
An ultra sound is only about 60% accurate in finding a shunt, therefore not a good tool to determine whether or not a shunt is there.

He could have a large or small SINGLE shunt. OR he could have lots and lots of microvascular shunting throughout his liver called: Hepatic microvascular dysplasia (MVD)
MVD

If he has a single shunt, they can repair with an amorid constrictor

If no single shunt, they can biopsy different parts of his liver and the results may come back saying he has MVD. If this is the case, nothing can be done except Diet and Supplements.

Either way - Please understand this is NOT a death sentence, he can live a perfectly normal happy life, with special care to diet and supplements.

Honeslty though, with his symptoms, he should be on Lactulose and Antib's to help rid his body of the toxins that are causing the HE acts.
Please speak to your Vet about this.

Here is a good group to joins as well:
DogLiverDisease : Dog Liver Disease

dwerten 06-18-2010 06:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carina (Post 3167172)
Yes he acts like those pups. I took him back to the Vet, they have now done ultrasound to establish a liver shunt. They could not pick up a shunt!!! They suspect the shunt may be only a small one. Fudge is booked for an operation in two weeks time to see if they can find a shunt. If nothing, then I don't know what else can be wrong with my baby....
did they do scintigraphy as that is way more accurate than a ultrasound as usually i say skip the ultrasound go straight to that after bats are done

What were the bile acid test results pre and post?

Before going straight to surgery please post the bats so we can see what they are and also please have scintigraphy done but once we see those bats we will know more

Was the ALT high on bloodwork ?

I just do not want you to put your dog through surgery if the bats are below 100 so please give us all the info to help you understand better :)

TLC 06-18-2010 07:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwerten (Post 3167339)
did they do scintigraphy as that is way more accurate than a ultrasound as usually i say skip the ultrasound go straight to that after bats are done

What were the bile acid test results pre and post?

Before going straight to surgery please post the bats so we can see what they are and also please have scintigraphy done but once we see those bats we will know more

Was the ALT high on bloodwork ?

I just do not want you to put your dog through surgery if the bats are below 100 so please give us all the info to help you understand better :)
See post #34
the BAT was 148 and 182


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