Since Ellie squats I just slide a shallow measuring cup under her. I found that things like pie tins are too big around and scare her.

I know that Wet Food has way more moisture, so that's good.

I am not sure about the Chicken. I know that's not good for liver issue dogs, but that's not the case.

I am sure someone else will chime in soon :)

K/D is for the kidneys and heart disease. If the vet is trying to give more moisture then any canned food would work. He might think your dog needs a kidney friendly diet...who knows. K/D is low protein so I wouldn't add much more protein to his diet unless you talk to the vet about it.

TLC - right! The lepto vaccine covers 2 of the 8 strains. The test takes about a week to get back ... I think they have to grow it in a petry dish or something.

If your baby is not eating at all, then it doesn't matter what they eat.

Kidney maintenance specific diets are low protein, low phosphorous. Feeding plain shredded chicken is pure protein. I'd stick to the KD, maybe put a few super tiny pieces of chicken or broth (or tuna juice) if he won't eat the KD.

If this is temporary kidney situation, some KD for a few days, time and extra fluids could be all that is needed. If they re-check the blood, KD and extra fluids may be more permenant solution. The levels and how your baby feels is what is important.

so since he had a level 55 on his BUN could that be normal for him give or take a few ?

i did give him some plain shredded chicken the last night? I am wondering if maybe that is why his levels are soooo high too?

I know it helps to give my baby very small pieces, one at a time.

cindy, if they've never done bloodwork, they have nothing to compare it to. You really need to establish a baseline of some type and check the #'s over time to see if they're changing.

This whole situation needs to be figured out and short and long term plans need to be put in place.

When is your follow up appointment?

One meal isn't going to affect the #'s like that.

so he finally ate something.. he didnt want to eat the prescription diet k/d food so I went to the store and found the lowest possible canned food with the lowest protein.. I gave him the cesars grilled chicken which has 8 % crude protein... I know its not the best food out there but his regular food has more protein and the diet one he was not willing to eat and I needed him to have something in his tummy because of all the antibiotics he is having.... he didnt eat all the amount only about 1/2 or close to it.. he drank some water too so thats good.. before we go to bed I will try to get him to take a couple drinks of the pedialyte also.. anyone have any type of suggestions on other types of homecooked recipes that would work good that he can and will eat? I greatly appreciate this ...

So glad he ate and drank something.

No sure about specific diets for kidney issues.

I have 2 with liver issues. I home cook for them and these are the things that they eat:

scrambled egg (tiny amount)
low fat cottage cheese (tiny amount)
green beans
sweet potatoes
white potatoes
spinach egg noodles (tiny amount)
dried cranberries
dried blueberries
apple pieces (no skin)
and then their supplements too.

I am sure someone will post with other info for you. :(

thank you so much.... this helps some.. I appreciate it....

This site might help you.
http://www.thepetcenter.com/imtop/dm.html

K/D is 13.8% protein on a dry matter basis (it says it on their site). Dry matter means the amount of moisture has been mathematically removed (because water isn't a "nutrient" and canned food is full of it which is good...but it can't be counted as a nutrient). Therefore canned foods that say 8% are much higher in protein. This particular one is about 44% if my math is correct.

Update:
 

When we left the vet, the vet gave him some prescriptions diet k/d canned food to try see if he would like it.. The vet said since he is sooo little that it would probably be a good idea to get him on the lowest protein diet as possible to avoid any future problems in case this WAS a false alarm or not.. pre caution. Well he didnt like it.. so all day he had not eaten anything at all... I had boiled shredded chicken in a ziplock bag but since it is all protein I wasn't sure if it was ok to give him... his regular dog food is Avoderm Lamb & Rice Lite Adult... so.....since it was past 9pm and Petsmart and our other stores were closed I went to my local grocery store and looked through every brand of canned dog food and found that Cesars' had the lowest amount of of Crude Protein 8%.. so I bought a couple of cans of different flavors for him to try til he liked at LEAST one..... well he liked the Grilled Chicken one but I had to lay on the floor and put it on my finger for him to eat some... I managed to get him to eat about a handful which is about 1/2 of the little container and he DRANK WATER! Thank god about that.... so I decided to take him for a walk since he looked so sad and I aksed him, "do you wanna go see buddy? " (Buddy is a neighbor's dog that he loves to play with buddy lives about a block away and is a big old fluffy crazy dog) so he went all crazy and his tail started to wag which it hadnt done all day and we were off... we walked for about 10 minutes came home then went to see grandma for some extra love .... well today in the morning he seems a bit better.... he slept most of the night cuddled by me .... and I made sure every so often that he was not in pain and was breathing.. I kept thinking all night.. Please god, I will do anything , I will be a better person I will do anything but please don't take my little Gizmo... I would rather be dealing with his pain than him... and when he awoke this morning and was giving his daddy a little bit of kisses I cried and gosh it was one of the best moments of my life.... to be honest.... I kept telling Gizmo all night (since I couldnt sleep) don't leave me sweetie, get better, mommy needs you to get better, you can't leave me mommy she won't have anyone to talk to and kiss, what is she supposed to do, talk to daddy? I told him that if he got better soon we would go to petsmart and he can have ANY toy in the store....

So now I am on a quest to find low protein canned food for awhile til I can find him some low protein dry food.... any suggestions?

He is not in the clear yet , he still hurts I know he's not the same yet but I hope he continues to get better....

Please keep my kiddo in your prayers please , I am taking him back in a week or so to give some time inbetween so that way we can have a second round of tests done and hopefully his kidney levels are down and normal

well I was looking into Natural Balance Duck and Potato? It has 5 % crude protetin?

To be honest I don't know what brand of dog food is low in protein.

As far as homecooking, you can give lots of veggies and brown rice. Since they do need protein for muscle grow, a tiny bit of eggs or cottage cheese is VERY low in protein. Now when I say tiny bit, like 1/2 teaspoon (or less) mixed in with portion veggies and brown rice is good (I feed 2x a day). To 'entice' (that's 'if' he won't eat it) - I have one of those very fine cheese graters. I bought a little block of provolone cheese, b/c it is very stinky cheese and I just put a fine layer of that cheese on top - always a hit and an instant plate clearer ;)

This is about 23% protein dry matter so it is much better than Cesar for what your vet is trying to do. I have no idea if it is a good kidney diet though.

Sounds like things are looking up alittle for little Gizmo and You!! You both are in our prayers!! ;)

Im Praying For Your Baby
 

We Are Going Through A Very Trying Time Ourselves If You Care To Read The Thread!

I Want You To Know You Are Not Alone With Yt Im A New Member As Of Yesterday...

I Am By Far Not A Pro But I Will Say My Baby Is On

Gerber Graduate Chicken Sticks...

He Absolutely Loves It He Also Is On Hunny Toooo

Also When Not Eating I Have Been Told To Give Nutri Cal It Is $10.00

But My Vet Says Treat Your Baby Like A Baby When All Esle Fails And Give Him Or Her Baby Food...

It Works For Us 98 Cents A Jar.. Well Worth It When Your Baby Is Not Eating... I Have Never Had A Eating Problem WITH BLEU ... I Posted This INFORMATION Because My Baby Eats It So It Is Safe.. Please Consult Your Doc And Make Sure Of Any Allergic Reactions To Chicken Or Whatever This Is Just Works For Us....

Blessings To You ..

Suggestions / Advice NEEDED
 

thanks! Well I am not a new member , I've been a member for a long time now but this situation we have with my kiddos kidney levels is VERY NEW to me and I DON"T wish it upon anyone ever!

I went to our favorite Natural/Hollistic Pet Galore and she recommended Innvoa for seniors(canned) it has about 4.4% Crude Protein.. I don't know if Gizmo will like it though, since he didnt like the Innova dry.:confused:
Nutrition:
Moisture........78.0 %
Protein........4.4 %
Fat........3.2 %
Linoleic Acid........1.10 %
Omega 3........0.35 %
Carbohydrates........10.70 %
Fiber........3.6 %
Ash........2.10 %
Calcium........0.14 %
Phosphorous........0.14 %

http://www.onlynaturalpet.com/produc...og/204154.aspx

She also said since he has liked and successfully ate the California Natural Chicken & Rice to try it in canned, and this has :
Nutrition Facts:
Moisture - 76 %
Protein - 9.0 %
Fat - 7.0 %
Fiber - 1.5 %
Calories - 39.39 Kcal/oz
http://www.onlynaturalpet.com/produc...od/204064.aspx

For DRY FOOD, she said to try Natural Balance PLAIN.. she said alot of her customers that have kiddos with tummy, allergy or kidney, liver problems eat one or 2 of these....
http://www.naturalbalanceinc.com/dog...tml#Guaranteed
GUARANTEED ANALYSIS
Crude Protein 23.0% minimum
Crude Fat 13.0% minimum
Crude Fiber 3.0% maximum
Moisture 10.0% maximum
Omega 3 Fatty Acids 0.5% minimum
Omega 6 Fatty Acids 3.0% minimum


So does anyone have any previous experience on any of these? I am soooo scared to go with the wrong one thinking it will be ok... my vet wants him I think on the Prescription Diet k/d but alot of people are against this type of food they say that it will cure one problem and another one will arise, reviews on this food say that their chemical makeup on this food is all wrong and too much for a 4 lb yorkie..... plus gizmo DOES NOT like it AT ALL.... geez.... why can't he talk? Or why can't I undestand dog language?:(

The senior canned Innova has the least (dry matter) protein out of all of these. I am not sure about phosphorus levels and I don't know the optimal amount for kidney problems.

well I called the VET... and the levels for the following were normal:

Creatinine - normal it was 0.6
Phosphorus- normal it was 3.7
Red Platelets were NORMAL
White Platelets were NORMAL....

sooooooooooo I am wondering now if possibly the reason his BUN level was at 52 was because he had eaten chicken (full of protein) not enough water and they say from my hours of research that in order to do a accurate BUN reading they need to be fasted for at least 12 hours.... any input guys...?

The way the machine works, from what I hear ... is that they put the blood in and there are test cartriges that are in the machine.

The machine could handle exact same blood different each time. The machines also have a margin of error.

Fasting is not required. To do accurate tests, they would need to be hand verified (analyzed), or sent to a lab with more better, hi-grade equipment. Re-tests are needed to see if the levels are moving dramatically.

Since the other #'s are normal ... a re-test should ideally show more normal BUN level. I can't say this enough ... re-test, re-test, re-test, re-test, re-test, re-test, re-test, re-test, re-test, re-test, re-test, re-test, re-test, re-test, re-test, re-test.

http://www.dogaware.com/kidney.html

thanks! yes I have been looking at that website.. hence y I called back to the vet to get the levels on the other things.... today during lunch he was alot better than the morning.. so I am just hoping that it will get better with time... I will have him retested though.

Cindy ~ I personally know two people whose yorkies BUN tests levels came back elevated. Worried them sick and all for naught because the second tests showed no elevation.

I hope it's the same in your case.

thanks! I hope so too... god knows Im praying ...

I know both of those owners considered the culprit of the elevations to be what they were feeding their yorkies. Neither ever got a definitive answer on that. One's vet just said...it was wrong. Sometimes tests come back wrong.

Sounds like she is improving :)

Btw one of those owners was gonna go the baby food route and learned commerically prepared baby food has a lot of sodium in it. I know that she decided to just feed her homecooked chicken breast.

They're members here but don't post regularly...I'll direct them to your thread...maybe they can help you.

hmmm and I though chicken breast was bad for them in general since it is all protein?

Do you want to homecook?
I have a recipe here for Ellie that is 24% protein which is quite low (no where near as low as the K/D though). It is fine to give chicken but you have to add things to it to bring down the protein amount.

1 ounce white meat chicken (boiled and I take off all skin and fat)
88 grams carb (brown rice, oatmeal... these vary in calories so be careful)
60 grams veggies (boiled or steamed and mashed up)
1 tsp oil for fat (olive, canola)
Supplements

Mix it all and serve. I measure each day's feeding and free. I measure ingredients separately to be accurate.

Dogs need about 40 calories a day per pound. This varies from dog to dog (especially after being altered). If you want a higher calorie meal you could use steel cut oats (1/4 cup is 140 calories) and if you want lower calories you could use brown rice (1/4 cup is 54 calories). This recipe was formulated for a dog between 5 and 6 pounds. I started using the steel cut oats because they have more calories and Ellie is skinny. When I was using brown rice she wasn't getting nearly enough of them. Hope this helps you.

This is a liver friendly diet and may not be a kidney friendly diet.

I read this thread from the beginning and you should listen to Mogli's advise ...
I'm going through the same thing with Royce he has early renal insufficiency and his bun is at 20 and has been stable for the last year ..the key here is to do complete check ups ( blood work, ultrasound ( to look for stones )urinalysis follow ups as requested by ur vet ... Royce is monitored very closely every 3 months and thank god his values are stable .