So I have read all of the points on this thread and totally see both sides. I am guilty of purchasing my baby at a pet store. I love her to pieces and maybe I am just lucky, but she is healthy, happy and behaviourally sound. I feel like I was ment to find her and she just happened to be from a pet store. I think there is merrit to the point that puppies can be emotionally damaged if left in these confined spaces for to long. The ones that have been there for months and months is heartbreaking and probably run a high risk for behavioural issues. My baby was 2 months old and was probably not in the store for very long. I think it depends on the personality or pre-disposition of the puppy and the owner/enviroment.
It sort of does hurt to hear people think I am a terrible person for buying my puppy from a pet store, but she is my baby and I am greatful she is in my life, however that came to be.

Yes, absolutely true!:thumbup:

Likewise, if we think it's cruel to breed tiny females, we need to stop buying tiny puppies. If we buy 'em, they're going to breed 'em. That's the way our economy works.

Does this mean that I'm judging those who got their puppies from pet stores? NO, not at all!

You know, there will not be a point where ever one here agrees completely on this matter... I see now that not every one will understand where I am coming form or others that have their babies from pet stores. And it is hurtful when people are mean or judgmental about it. I want to thank those of you that have shown kindness and understanding to those of us that have pet store babies. I would like to think that people are not being hurtful on purpose but some of the comments are hard to look at any other way.
I don't understand why if you don't believe in buying from a pet store, you got in to LOOK! Then you come on here with some horror story and every one gets all worked up.
There is a thread right now on shutting down the puppy mills... if you are so upset with what you know then DO something about it! I hope there can be peace and respect on YT... I for one would rather not have people dislike me or look down on me. But if you do, there is nothing I can do about it.

I found this and thought it might help!
 

How to stop a puppy millActions anyone can take
[LIST=1][*]Get your facts straight. Know at least approximately how many breeds are raised at the facility, whether or not it is clean, if the dogs run together or are housed separately, whether the dogs have regular preventative and necessary veterinary care, and whether the operators sell to pet stores, brokers, laboratories, or the general public.[*]If possible, get a friend to accompany you to the suspect business for your safety and to corroborate your observations[*]Make notes about the conditions when you return home and be prepared to send those notes to the appropriate officials. Be prepared for bureaucracy to grind slowly and to restate your observations several times. Observations, not heartache, not hysteria, not an emotional outburst.[*]Contact your local humane society and health departments and describe the conditions you have seen as specifically and unemotionally as possible. The humane society can act in cases of abuse and neglect (which in Ohio means lack of food and shelter) and the health department can deal with threats to public health from fecal contamination, dead dog bodies, etc.[*]Contact: Dr. Valencia D. Colleton
US Department of Agriculture,
2568-A Riva Road, Suite 302
Annapolis, MD 21401- 7400
(410) 962-7463
to find out whether or not the breeder has a Class A or Class B license (a necessity if the facility sells to pet stores, brokers, or laboratories and makes more than $500 annually from such sales). The USDA will be interested if the breeder has a license and is not following the guidelines for housing, sanitation, and veterinary care or if the breeder is not licensed and grosses more than $500 per year selling puppies wholesale. If these conditions are not met, USDA can by law do nothing. No matter how much your sensibilities are offended by the plight of overcrowded, undernourished neglected puppies, they can do nothing.[*]Contact: American Kennel Club Inspections and Investigations Department
51 Madison Avenue
New York, NY 10010
(212) 696-8208
If the breeds are AKC recognized and the breeder advertises AKC registered puppies. AKC will be interested if dogs are constantly running together, especially if dogs of different breeds are housed together and the business also sells mixed breed puppies, for this may indicate that record keeping regulations are being violated.
AKC is a purebred registry and can deal only with record keeping and identification transgressions; they can suspend violators from further registration of purebred dogs, but they cannot prevent them from breeding and selling puppies. [More on the AKC][*]If the dogs are UKC registered, contact: United Kennel Club
100 East Kilgore Road
Kalamazoo, MI 49001-5598
(616) 343-9020 Popular UKC breeds that are not also AKC recognized are American Pit Bull Terrier, and Jack Russell Terrier.[/LIST]Raising and selling dogs is a business for profit for many people. There should be no stigma attached to earning money by selling dogs; problems arise when the dogs are poorly bred, housed in poor conditions, denied proper medical care, are sick when sold, or are advertised falsely.
Just what is a puppy mill?

Norma Bennett Woolf

I don't believe it would make a bit of difference.

First of all you aren't going to stop people from buying from opet stores, there are just too many, It's like killing a sanke in you back yard, you aren't making one bit of difference so you may as well let him go.

Those breeders would just sell to brokers.

the laws need to be changed to give the governing magencies more control of the conditions of puppy mills.

Have any of you ever thought how much it would cost to buy a puppy if all the puppy mills were closed down?

I'm not supporting puppy mills, but it is something to think about? I doubt that many of us could afford to buy one.

The agencies just need to have more control over the mills. And the regulations need to be stricter.

Large heated, air condituioned buildings, With acres of fenced land.

They don't have pet stores here in the UK. I wonder if they have fewer puppy mills. I'd put my money on the side that says they do.

I think I will still kill that snake.

Actually, I have experienced many pet owners that bought from pet stores that did not get very good quality purebreds especially for the money they paid and often spent quite a chunk of money on health problems especially in the first year and the owners were lucky they pulled it through and still had a live dog. THose issues stayed with the dog. The puppy, usually was a very sweet dear little thing and loved by the owners except the impulse buyer who soon 'got rid of it' when dog ownership was way more trouble than they thought.
There is also another consideration about pet stores. As you have read many times on this forum, no reputable breeder would ever sell a puppy via a broker or pet store. So, as you have guessed they are coming from puppymills be it whether a large commercial business or 'private breeder' that does have a lot of dogs, a lot of different breeds and needs those puppies out of there as more are coming. THese breeders do not want the public on their property buying a puppy as then you will know who they are and the conditions these puppies are coming from. You might ask What do they have to hide? A heck of a lot I would think.
You have no idea what the parents would look like, the conditions the poor dogs are kept in.
Now think about another consideration. Puppymills sell their wares via pet stores. There is supply and demand as with any business. If there is no demand, no one will rise to the occasion of supplying a demand that isn't there. Ergo, if no one will buy a dog or puppy from a pet store their goes the venue for puppymills to sell their wares.
What's left? Auctions and brokers. If no one buys from auctions and brokers, there is no demand to warrant their supply. Most Auctions however, are catering to puppymills and those are usually the types that buy there except for the odd rescue organizations that manage to raise some money to get some of them out of the puppymills.
These suppliers are all about money, so you have to look at it from the point of view of basic Business Economics. Unfortunately where a live animal is concerned, it is hard to look at it from that point of view as we worry about those puppies in that situation from no fault of their own.
Personally, I would love to see legislation in Canada and the US that makes it illegal to sell puppies via a pet store. That would kind of put an end to the cycle.

Not me I hate mosquitoes

I look at it this way, I've never been bitten by a snake, but have been by plenty of mosquitoes.

So I figure more snakes = less mosquitoes

Puppy Mills
 

It would be great if puppy mills would be state licensed, but they are not so the state has no way of regulating a puppy mill without a license as they have no idea where they are.

I know a lot of breeders who are not State Licensed, also no one regulating them, I have a State Lic. and renew it every year, i also have a special use permit to raise yorkies where I live, it cost well over 10,000.00 to get a special use permit, i am allowed to have no more than 15 dogs and 2 litters per year. While every one else in the county can have 4 dogs and as many as 8 litters a year. None of these breeders are State Licensed, I tried to do the right thing and got screwed big time, and spent a great deal of money to abide by the law!!!!! I don't get the county, they still want me to be state licensed, but when having two or less litters a year you do not have to be state licensed. Of course i am going to appeal, it will be a while as i do not have the money to open the case again. I do not know any breeders in my area that are State Licensed, or that have a special use permit to raise puppies, when you try to do the right thing and get screwed, and everyone else out their is supposed to be State Licensed and are not and can have as many as 80 large dogs per year, and a little Yorkie maybe has 2 to 4 puppies, they are saying i can spend 10,000.00 for a lawyer, another 1200 for and engineer to do a drawing of our property of 4 acres, backing to BLM, and 800 for the County to read my request for a special use permit! They also said i have to have all my puppies off the property within a 120 days! Most of my puppies leave at 4 to 6 to 9 months, depending on size, depending on how they are doing. You know this is not fair, I know it is not fair and they know it is not fair, and i have no more money to appeal. I fought this for over a year, and i would say i lost big time! I am the kind of breeder who goes buy the rules, I am out to only better the breed and have the best quality of yorkies i could get my hands on, Champions costing well over 5,000.00 each to get finished. It is so dishearting, to know their are puppy mills out there, brokers, and breeders who don't care where their puppy's go and are just in it for the money, God knows i will never make a dime on my babies, that is not why i got into the business, i just was tired of getting sick yorkies with bad knees, bites, structure, and coats, i will continue to raise the best quality i can and will keep them as long as they need to be here with me and their mom. I know their are a lot of wonderful, wonderful breeders out their and we all try to make a difference, but with all the puppy mills that are not legal it is an uphill battle. Hard to compete when brokers can get their puppies for very little, and jack the price way up! I would love to picket to get rid of puppy mills, but first you have to find them, and that can be quite diffucult!

Sorry to have gone on and on, it just makes me sad when i hear the word puppy mill, it is a breeders worst nightmare that one of their babies could end up in one. All my puppies are sold on ltd. reg. and i only sell to pet homes, and only sell to people who i have meant and who have brought their whole family to my home. If they are out of town they have to fly out here to pick of their baby, as i need to meet them and know that the puppy will like their new owners.

It seems to me that Yorkies are being so overbred, everyone wants to get on the band wagon as they think these breeders are getting rich, i want you to know a good breeder who takes excellant care of their babies is lucky to break even, i have yet to do that. However i will continue to do my best, to get the nicest dogs out their that i can. I will also do my part in trying to find puppy mills and get them closed down, rescue the babies and continue the uphill battle!

:eek:

I couldn't agree with you more, it should be illeagel to sell to pet stores and brokers!!!!!!! Well said!!!!!!

Im sorry your all my friends and I dont want to offend but Ive seen this same thing with private breeders because they stuck the word kennel does not make them any better I have seen piss poor conditions at bredders home they hide it better there puppies live in little crates there brood bitches and studs live in little cages with little or no attention till breeding time this is at least a good chunk of so called kennels the problem is not the stores its the lack of inspections for all breeders

Donna Jean

Man you did get screwed big time.

That is terrible, because the fine for not being licensed is probably no where near that much.

The whole system is screwed up. Which is probably why most breeers don't get licensed. As long as there are no complaints against you no one ever investigates.

I bow to you you are a diamond in the world of rocks and if I purchase a pet again it will be from you