When you say your major concern is lepo, do you mean of them getting the disease of them getting the vaccination. It's not a concern in AZ, so my vet doesn't even give the shot and Joey's breeder put it in her contract that he wouldn't get the shot. I realize different parts of the country have different problems.

I wasn't planning to ever vaccinate the boys again unless the titer said it was necessary, now it sounds like I should vaccinate next year and skip titers?

I have never been a fan of Dodds just been scared to say anything because so many people are pro Dodds lol

I really don't know anything about her, but I thought her word was golden on vaccines, now I feel stupid for even mentioning her name to my vet. He really wasn't impressed.

I am a google freak lol. Don't feel stupid you are a very smart lady :)

I've read what Dr. Dodds has said about vaccines, but I've read what Dr. Schultz has said, as well. Ultimately, you need to feel comfortable with what you have done. While I may not be comfortable with all of her practices, Dr. Dodds has done a great deal of good, and I respect what she has to say. I've attached what Dr. Schultz has to say about vaccines.

http://www.americanwaterspanielclub....e_Vaccines.pdf

Well, I'll say it for you. :) I don't believe her views pair well with standard of care.

[QUOTE=Nancy1999;4296183]When you say your major concern is lepo, do you mean of them getting the disease of them getting the vaccination. It's not a concern in AZ, so my vet doesn't even give the shot and Joey's breeder put it in her contract that he wouldn't get the shot. I realize different parts of the country have different problems.

The disease itself...
Ellie hasn't had it in several years and MI is full of lepto. both because the vaccine lasts for barely a year so she is totally unprotected and because the vaccine does not cover all strais it makes me nervous. Ry is faccinated for it and
I'm a bit less nervous for him but haven't decided if vaccinating him is worth it.

You are lucky to not have many cases there.

Yes, I agree, I did feel comfortable, now, I'm not so sure, thanks for the link.

It's pretty simple depending on your vet. Like, this year, Jackson was due for his 3 year rabies and "due" for his 3 year DHP.... when I went for his yearly visit, I got rabies and she asked if I wanted to do DHP today too, and I just said no thank you, we're going to skip those today. :) End of story.

This. I am not going to waste my money in titering, I just don't think it's worth it.

I'm really just not worried about it. Jackson had all the important puppy vaccines and the one year boosters. I am confident he is protected and don't worry a bit. We go to dog parks, lots of public places, pet stores, etc, and I'm just not concerned.

Our past family dogs only had puppy shots, 1 year boosters, and then rabies every year according to law. The dogs went everywhere. Our Airedale lived to age 19 without ever having another DHP.

When did vets start giving them more often?

Lol. Smart.

I'm not worried about what to tell the vet, I'm worried that I'm getting the correct advise, as in what's the safest and what carries the most risk if you do don't do it. Current best knowledge, isn't always good.

That's true. I was just curious if most vets are okay with going that route if that's what the client requests.

I don't know about most vets, you are the boss, but you are also paying for their expertise. If they are really against not giving shots, I would want to know why and then do more research on the matter. I just feel that there are pros and cons to everything, and unless you know both sides of the story, you might not be able to make the best choice for you dog. Location and lifestyle should be factored in when making these choices. I really didn't want to give Joey another rabies vaccine until I heard what happens if he doesn't have a current vaccination and he bites someone.

This link has always been my favorite when discussing titers and their reliability. This link can def say it better than I can :):

Titers

Ugh, my problem is that if I really believe that, then I'm tempted to vaccinate. I don't want a "false" sense of security, I want a sense of security. I certainly won't give anyone else any advice on this matter in the future.

It's really hard, bc we all want something definitive, something we don't have to doubt or wonder about. Personally, I get my security from trusting the DOI (duration of immunity) research -- I do think it's very reliable research. The AAHA seems to do a pretty good job of getting the recommendations out there. Much of the DOI research even leans toward lifetime DOI, so it makes ya wonder why we're even doing it every 3-5 years. But, change takes time, I suppose. I bet one day they'll trust lifetime DOI on some of the vax.

I was thinking about my own vaccinations today and got to thinking...hmmm, why do I trust I'm still immune anyway? It's like I automatically trust the human side, but am way more scared on the canine side. I guess I take it for granted that we've done all the right testing on the human side of things. But I honestly do not even know! :p

I really worry about giving vaccines to such little ones, and that's why titering seems more appealing to me. It's probably a false sense of security, but I worry so much about the long term effects of the vaccines. It's such a large amount of vaccine for a tiny dog comparatively. I don't worry about myself with vaccines, but I am responsible for protecting Katie from harm and always doing what's best for her. I will feel better when they change the protocol to five years. I know it shouldn't matter, but it will to me.

The AAHA protocol document already mentions every 5 years as an option.:)
My vet office is switching any time now.

Thank you, Crystal. I have a very happy and health little girl, and I'm so lucky. Still, I always worry about her and always want to care for her to the best of my ability.

Right, this.

I don't see why you would have a false sense of security because... well, there is just so much research and evidence pointing towards vaccines lasting 7+ years to a lifetime. Titering wouldn't change my mind to be honest or give me any more sense of security so I probably won't waste my $$$ unless necessary.

I mean, really, when babies are infants they get... measles, mumps, and rubella (MMR); diphtheria, tetanus, and pertussis (DTaP); hepatitis; and sometimes more.

For humans, you're given DTaP at
At 2 months
At 4 months
At 6 months
Between 15 and 18 months (can be given as early as 12 months as long as it's at least six months after the previous shot)
Between 4 and 6 years old
A booster shot at 11 or 12 years of age (called the Tdap)
And then that's it. Do you even think about these for the rest of your life? Do you have any reason to believe you're not protected anymore?


In the scheme of things, that's the same basic schedule as a dog, taking into account a dog's shorter lifespan.

Why do we feel the need to vaccine over and over again in a dog's short life? It's not going to make them any more protected giving the same thing year after year. You're either immune or you're not.

I have been over-vaccinated. When I went to work in a hospital and couldn't provide records of my vaccinations, I had to have them all done again. :eek: I had boney arms at the time and the nurse jabbed the needles in so hard.

The only thing I worry about is tetanus. Haven't had a booster in recommended 10 year intervals.

The article Ann linked said that titers give a false sense of security, that's what I was referring to. I wish I could be as sure as you are, I'm just not that sure that giving no shots is the right thing. So you don't believe in giving ANY shots after the first year booster? I've been told by others that after 5 years of age, they don't give any shots. Lots of people I know in real life get yearly shots for life. I also feel like it's more important for me because my dogs are around other dogs quite a bit and I don't want them making other dogs sick either.


I guess I don't understand the comparisons with humans, we don't tend to sniff poop and I guess I thought because of this behavior, dogs seems more at risk at contacting contagious diseases. Personally, I take better care of my dogs than I do myself and I pretty much do what the doctor tell me to do, unless I hear otherwise, and then I try to learn more. I guess I'm old enough to know that I have listened to trends and authorities before and have later learned they were wrong, because I didn't have the full picture or didn't understand all the exceptions to the rule. Getting the titers use to make me feel safe that I was doing the right thing. Now I don't feel that way.

I think it is also so hard for us because we all love our pups so very much and want to do what is best for them and keep them safe.

LOL, we don't sniff poop, but our hands come into contact with tons of germ-ridden things everywhere. We even shake hands with each other. We breathe the same air.

Polio was transmitted by drinking or swimming in contaminated water.

Small pox is transmitted by breathing in infected saliva, like when someone coughs or sneezes.

Owwwwie! I hate shots. I hate tetanus shots the most! I have had two that I remember one was because I was in the woods and chasing one of our baby goats trying to get him and stepped on a rusty nasty nail that was in a bored hidden under leaves thanks to our neighbor who threw all his trash in our yard. Ruined my favorite shoes too my foot swelled so bad I could not even put a shoe on so went to the doctor one or two days afterwords and they gave me a tetanus shot that sucker hurt.

Major ouch! I'm glad your foot turned out okay.

I do remember the tetanus shots are painful.

That nurse who gave me my vaccs acted like she was stabbing me. She did it overhand.

Oh my goodness :eek:

I don't like following trends or using new products either. ?but DOI studies have been done for many years.

It comes down to trusting DOI (proven by challenge) and realizing no vaccine is 100% effective or trusting titers.

I understand being nervous to stray too far from every 3 years or less because owners are so programmed to vaccinate vaccinate vaccinate. But for those stilll doing annual distemper/parvo...yikes.

FWIW, I forgot to mention above that while the kids don't play with strange dogs they do shadow with me sometimes, esp. Ellie. This consists of her being in a kennel near ill animals, interacting with staff after they have touched other animals all day, getting cuddled by me after petting random puppies. The only thing I wouldn't do is handke her if I knew a dog had something really contagious or let her share the isolation area with a sick dog, but that is common sense.

BTW, I am current on tetanus..bc the DOI is questioned if it has been more than ten years. I'm not anti-vaccine.