Post Surgery Behavior
 

Hi all,

Charlie had surgery on Monday 6/11 remove 3 stones 2 from the bladder 1 from his urethra, he is home and doing ok but he is so tired still. He is on pain med that he is now only taking once a day and he is taking prednisone and an antibiotic as well.

How long should I expect him to be so tired. he has small burst of energy like he wants to play but they are few and far between. and I DO realize he has had surgery but just so I know what to expect. It is so hard to see him like this he is always wanting to run and jump and play Im just not used to it.

I call my vet everyday with questions they are very good to answer and tell me I am not a bother (when I know I am :( ) but I just want to make sure i know everything I can. its not like Charlie can say "hey mom my belly hurts" and he doesnt "show" pain so I guess I worry if he is laying around is it because he is in pain??? or just tired....

Ugh sorry just has to let some of this out.

Maybe the pain meds are knocking him out... keeping him tired. It can take more than a few days to recover... depends too on how well he handles the anesthesia. Is he eating and drinking and going potty okay? If not, I'd have the vet look at him to make sure he's okay...

No he is eating and drinking fine and no trouble going potty. the pain med he is on is Tramadol it is a 50 MG tablet that he gets 1/4 tablet 2 times daily (if needed) he has only been taking it once a day for the last 2 days tho, I have given it at nite so he can rest comfortably.

Im sure youre right that he is just tired and the pain med plays into it but I just worry so much. This whole ordeal has been something else, very scarey.

It's good that he has been quiet so soon after his surgery... most times they get too active and are at risk of hurting themselves....

The tramadol is what is making him sleepy and tired. That's a good thing though, because he will still have pain and he doesn't need to be running around yet either. I'm betting he will feel much better once he stops taking the tramadol. Surgery takes a lot out of these little one's and it takes them time to recover.

Charlie only has one more dosing of the tramadol. he has been on it for a week, His stitches wont come out until the 25th, Do you think I need to get more tramadol? He doesnt really "show" pain I certainly dont want him to be hurting tho.

I'd wait and see how he does... it won't hurt now for him to be a little more active, he may have to learn that he doesn't hurt as much too. Also, this far out from the surgery, he should be healed enough for very light activity. Coming off the pain meds will help you to be sure he's doing okay.

Did your vet write out discharge instructions for him? These will tell you what to expect after surgery and how soon to start giving him some freedom. If not, I'd call the vet to make sure.... they are responsible for his aftercare too.

Yes they gave me aftercare instructions and things to watch for. it says Moderate activity after 7 days is ok, He has been very good to not try jumping from high places until today. Out bed sits about 3 ft high and I removed his step so that he couldn't get up there and jump off from the top but I went out this morning and he jumped up on the bed. now this was 3 feet he jumped he wanted to be by hubby I never imagined he could jump up that high without his crate to jump on first. I will have to keep the door closed for now I guess... its just to risky.

Hes gone all day today without the pain med and seems to be doing ok. still just sleeping for the most part. he did not eat his chicken this morning but did eat some eggs.

Sounds like the little guy is not going to let this get him down. It is so difficult to gauge the pain level of our pets. They just don't react the same way as humans do. I hope he continues to improve for you. If he made that jump onto the bed he must be feeling at least some what better!

Sounds like he is doing well, especially after jumping on the bed, That is one of my big concerns after Suzi comes home from her spay and dental , how to keep her calm and not jumping on my sons bed, I'll have to keep her out of the room . If your dog is not seeminly in pain, wimpering or shaking, then he is probably ok without it. But if he shows any signs of discomfort I woud call the vet.

Yes he does seem to be doing well. Has anyone had a baby with these bladder stones? we have to wait about a month for the results to come back as to what type they are...future treatment/prevention will be determined by that. :confused:

His body is still healing & recuperating plus meds are probably adding to his lethargy. Some dogs just don't seem very active unless they are 100%. It's still under one week & he still may be swollen & inflamed inside, still healing. I hope he begins to perk up going into his second week post-op & is soon back to his old self.

Stones results are in :(
 

Ok so Charlies results came back for the type of stones that were in his bladder, they were uric stones. Now the vet says these are stones found primarily in dalmatians and since Charlie is NOT a dalmatian we will be doing a blood test to check him for a liver shunt :(

The vet says that if he does have a liver shunt, it can be treated with meds and diet that surgery may not be needed but if it was needed, I was told that University of Missouri Columbia is where I should go. So I called them today to see how much it may cost if Charlie needed surgery.
MAN O MAN :eek:

If he has a shunt and it is extra-hepatic (easily seen on the outside of the liver) it will be between $2800-$3200 if it would be intra-hepatic (not seen and inside the liver somewhere) it is $3000-$5000 I thought I was going to fall over.

My only solace is that the Dr I talked to at Columbia said that it is VERY rare that a 5 yr old yorkie would have a liver shunt.

So saturday, I will take him to have this blood test done he has to fast for 12-14 hours and then they will draw blood he will be fed a fatty meal (a whole other issue with the pancreatitis) and then they will draw more blood to check levels. the turn around is 3-5 days :(

I am very stressed about this I have no idea how I would come up with that kind of money for a surgery. I just emptied savings for the bladder surgery Please pray Charlie does not have the liver shunt.

It sure was not an encouraging report. Has he always eaten well without bouts of vomiting and diarrhea? Has his weight always been good? There are various forms of liver shunt. I mean the degree of deformity can be any where from small to large.
Thankfully I have never had to deal with stones. I'm sure there will be someone that has some knowledge about them. There may be something in the library.

Actually no he has had problems eating and with diarrhea due to the pancreatitis he was dx with that last year. I almost lost him then. he can only eat boiled chicken turkey.. things with no fat, I have to be very careful with treats dry food etc only vet approved things for the most part. The columbia Dr said that he could have small shunts in the liver that may not need surgery but I guess I have to start with the blood test and go from there.

Oh no! Praying for good test results! Some Yorkies with mild cases of Liver Shunt aren't diagnosed until they're older. Here's some info:

Portosystemic Shunts FAQ

Thank you for this link. It is so much to take in. you know Charlie is a very playful active pup. he doesnt have most of the symptoms on the list of things associated with a shunt. really only the stones and occasional diarrhea but none of the others. I just pray it is not a shunt, I just dont know what Ill do if it is.

My Gracie was a small puppy. Kind of the runt of the litter. My vet was concerned about liver shunt. She told me to watch for vomiting and diarrhea which are also symptoms of pancreatitis. There are various levels of severity with liver shunt so not all symptoms would be evident in a dog with the problem. I hope they are able to diagnose and treat him properly very soon.

Charlie has never been small he weighed about 5 lbs when I got him and he is 12 now. He doesnt vomit and he rarely has diarrhea but his stool is soft rarely a firm stool. He does have a confirmed dx of pancreatitis the trouble is those stones.... they are just not the kind a yorkie should have. I have just been sick all day knowing we have to have the test tomorrow. and then to have to wait 3-5 days for results. He does get his stiches out tomorrow so that will be good he needs a good groom he has one front leg they shaved part of and one back leg they shaved part of he kind of looks like a hobo or a really fuzzy pear of slippers :D

Please keep him in your prayers tonight. He cant eat after 900pm so im gonna make sure he gets something tastey :)

I'll be thinking about and praying for both of you. Please let us know how things go.

I will, thank you

Live profile
 

Well I dropped Charlie off for the shunt test have to pick him up in a couple hours. He was so happy and playful this morning I just cant believe he could have something so awful

He was not happy about getting in the car though, I think he knows everytime he gets in that its going to be a Dr visit :(

Keep him in prayers for good results. :)

Praying for good results for dear Charlie...

I hope it isn't the liver but they need to know why he is producing that type of stone. Hopefully this will rule out the liver or give them a way to treat it.

I'm praying for sweet Charlie & for you. I know the waiting will be terrible. Try to keep yourself distracted with any other thing you can.

Well the vet said in the scheme of things she is hoping that the issue IS a small shunt. the reason being if it isnt... then there is another reason for the imbalance of the PH in his urine thats causing the stones, she says that is much harder to treat Since charlie doest have the signs of a "regular/large shunt she feels it could be esaily treated with meds and diet.

I did ask about the diet since he is on a chicken diet for the pancreatitis and a shunt diet is low protien she says that if he has the shunt that the pancreatitis is most likely a secondary effect of the shunt. she didnt want to go into great detail since we dont even know yet but she mentioned a "white diet" it included things like cottage cheese and he would eat smaller portions of chicken.

Has anyone heard of a "white diet"?

Results are in but not good :(
 

Well Charlies results came back today there was no waiting involved. His bile levels were way off the charts both fasting and after he ate.

Normal fasting Bile acid should be <13 Charlies was 30.3
Normal post meal Bile acid should be <25 Charlies was 71.3 :eek:

Normal BUN is 6-31 Charlies was 32
Normal Neutrophils is 60-77 Charlies is 78

All other labs were normal

But this means that he has a shunt and that he should have surgery to correct it but I just dont know where I would get that kind of money. The surgery to remove the stones wiped out savings.

The vet has changed his diet to a food called prescription diet l/d and I will start him on a supplement called Vetra SAM-e it is supposed to help clean the toxins from his system like the liver should be doing.

An ultrasound with doppler can be done to see if they can visualize the shunt but there are no guarantees if the shunt is intrahepatic it would not be seen on an ultrasound. surgery is also very risky ( I knew this) but they made apoint to tell me that.

They say that the diet and supplement could buy him time but that he would probably get the stones again and be in the same place

I think I am going to repost this by itself to see if anyone has gone through this surgery I just wanted to make sure you all were updated since you have been following along with me in this.

Any suggestions or advise is welcomed.

It seems like your vet kind of prepared you for these results. I'm so sorry. It's so difficult to believe that a 5 year old healthy looking fella like yours would have liver shunt. The chemical imbalance in his body does indicate his problem though. I'm so sorry you are facing this.
I know of a person on another forum that is facing much the same issue. Their dog is on the small size and had to have stones removed several months ago. It wiped out their extra money and have been facing the fact that once he gets filled with stones again they would have to have him put down. Their vet did not investigate the liver though. I don't remember what his stones were composed of though
I hope there are others on YT who have some assistance for you. I know there are others that have been faced with this. I think there is a pet credit card that can be taken out to help pay for some expensive treatments but I'm not sure if it will cover liver shunt. I know there are others on YT that would have more info on this.