Do you see a difference between "for sale" and " for adoption"?
 

I'm having a real problem with these terms. I have a FB friend who has a friend who breeds dogs. I've been reading the posts on this breeder's page and today I just couldn't take it anymore. The breeder says, "I have a dog For Sale, he is..." The responders say things like, "So cute I want to buy IT..."

So I added, "Do you mean "for adoption"? For Sale sounds so cold and uncaring :(

Of course my posts were deleted after a couple of people jumped up and said things like, "some people are so anal, why would she post something like that" and "when people adopt kids or pets they pay a FEE."

I replied that it is all in how you put things. As a picture speaks a thousand words, so does a word paint a thousand pictures. I asked if they would advertise an adoption of a human child as "Child For Sale"? the poster's comment of "fee" proved my point. She didn't say "price." There's a difference and though she didn't realize it, she used the proper term for an adoption :rolleyes:

There are fees, yes, and I get it. So why not say "dog for Adoption...the FEE is..."? And what about that "I want to buy IT." IT!!!!

My reasoning is this; what do you see in your mind when you hear the words "for sale"? And when you hear the words "for adoption"?

Two different things, don't you? You would buy a Coach bag, you wouldn't adopt it.

"For Sale" implies a THING---a purse, shoes, a car, etc. things that do not feel, breathe, hurt. A thing you can put in the garbage or in a closet and forget it. kick it, burn it, do with your t-h-i-n-g as you see fit.

Don't get me started on "it." :mad:

"For Adoption" says to me; responsibility, add a member to our family, dependent on me for protection, nourishment, shelter, warmth, care, love, attention and all the best my heart and my finances could handle.:aimeeyork

The words we use shape our perception of life and everything in it. I can't help but think that maybe the words we use with respect to 'pets' is the link to animal abuse and cruelty. The more people see them as objects, as THINGS, the less people care about these furbabies suffering.

Have you noticed that in order to win customers, pet stores are using the word 'Adoption' and not 'Sale' and puppy-mills/backyard breeders are begining to use this term too...coincidence?

Hardly.

If you were shopping for a house and I told you that there's a beautiful house that exactly fits your criteria, it's large, has a huge backyard and it's in an up and coming neighborhood, which has an increased budget for revamping the area which in turn will attract new commerce.

What if I said, that there's a beautiful house that exactly fits your criteria, it's large with a huge backyard:) But it has a higher than average crime rate, you have to get in your car and drive a few miles to find a store because merchants are not interested in investing in this area until they see real improvement in the sector. The police department is trying their best and we're all hopeful that the increased budget will allow the hiring of more police.

Based on the description of these two houses, which house would you give a chance to? They're both the same house but you got different messages because I painted two different pictures. Words do say so much :(

I don't know...but when I hear words like "Dog For sale" and "IT is cute", the message/picture I get is, "they're JUST dogs, who cares about their torture...it's just like the abuse my shoes get" :confused:

I understand what you're saying about "adopting" living beings and "buying" physical things, but I don't personally have a problem with either description.

The reality is people are selling dogs for money and it's legal to do so... and legally dogs are considered "property" here in America. It's not legal to sell children.

I feel the same way and I would...
 

... of done the same thing!!

I HATE... "they are just dogs" UGH to me BOTH of my boys are more then 'JUST DOGS" they ARE and ALWAYS will be my babies!! GETS my blood boiling when people get that way!! UGH...

In my opinion I ADOPTED my boys NOT bought them!! VERY FRUSTRATING to say the very least!!

I agree whole-heartedly with your post. This is one of my peeves about ALL breeders. As long as, as a society, we view animals as things to be purchased, rather than living things requiring love and nurturing, there will ALWAYS be a "home" for breeders who look at the animals as profit machines. If you took cash right out of the equation, well then, what would be the incentive to breed OTHER THAN for the betterment of the breed?

We have a broken society. I am often reminded of the A.I. movie by Steven Spielberg, which I think can be aptly viewed as a reflection of our society in general. Kids and animals can be cast aside so easily by so many.

I hope that one day all living creatures will be treated with respect, but I'm sure I won't see that in my lifetime.

IMHO, there is nothing as confusing or dangerous as the English language....ugh.

Lots of different perspectives, but I hate it when a bad breeder uses the words like adoption, but you know good and well they will "adopt" to anyone. Traditionally, we think of adopting from a rescue and buying from a breeder, but these are only words, and we have to know the motives behind the rescue we are supporting and the breeder we are supporting. Joey's more than a possession, he's an important family member!

I know, that's reality :( And as long as we keep seeing it like that, the cruelty will continue. We (women) were considered property too, long ago according to the law. We are told that that has changed, but my volunteer work at the advocacy for abused women and children has shockingly, thought me that it has not changed much.

It's against the law to rape, beat children and women, for example, but it still happens. Most abusers, supposedly, don't see the women and children they sexually/physically/mentally abuse as people. They see their victims as objects, their objects/their possessions. My point.

I cringe at the words used, as I said in my post, not because people are making money selling the pups or because it should be legal or not. It's the message 'for sale' carries. If breeders care about their pups and where they're going, maybe making sure that the people 'buying' understands that they are not buying a purse. That way, chances of the pup being beaten because he wee-wee on the carpet, or being chained to a post in the backyard, or dumped in a shelter would be minimized.

Maybe.

I believe that every little bit helps :thumbup:

I beleive the difference is how you came to own your Yorkie/pet.

For example if you search on line the deference is in the type of words you use has a lot to do with what type of web site you will get. When you search for 'Yorkies for Adoption' rather than 'Yorkies for Sale' you get a variety of difference web sites.

Yorkies for Adoption to me would typically mean to rehome a previously owned Yorkies from a rescue.

Yorkies for Sale to me would mean to purchase a Yorkies from wherever as a puppy.

Either of which is still taking responsibility to care for and to provide a loving, healthy home for them as if they were part of the family and not as your proberty. Although the law says otherwise.

Me too. And it's so frustrating some times I can't hold my tongue :(

I think you said it better than I could :thumbup:. It's the way we view things that need to change. Until we do that we won't see better treatment of the defenseless. I don't think I'll see it in my lifetime either :(

I hate when breeders write puppy for ADOPTION.
I personally think this is a fishy way to attract customers.

BREEDER and ADOPTION CANNOT be matched. it is SALE.

If you see a shelter add, or private rescue - it IS adoption.

I agree, some backyard breeders are catching up and learning about 'marketing.' Now, that's a scary thought---a well informed, scamer :eek:

I hate it when people call Tashi "it" .. it probably grinds my gears more than anything. I'd rather someone assume and call her "him" than "it"

See, there it is...to "own." ;)

My point was that words like that send out a message. Words like, own, purchase, buy, it, for sale, 10% off (I actually saw this discount on Yorkies at a pet store). The message is so loud, my ears hurt, it screams "this is a non-living THING, a THING that doesn't feel pain, fear, hunger, etc., mistreat it, kill it, burn it, throw it out the window---no body cares----enjoy."

Words like, adoption, bring into your home, add a member to your family, sends a message of respect, love and understanding.

Believe me I'm guilty too, I used to use words like that. Until I realize the harm they were contributing :( But as Maya Angelou said "when I knew better, I did better."

I think many of you are missing the point of the OP. Using the word adoption is simply more fitting for all dog and puppy "homing" because you are adopting a new member of your family, rather than buying an accessory to it.

I get the point she is trying to make, and while I understand it, I think that "adpoting" is generally reserved for rehomes, older dogs, and rescues.

I don't see anything wrong with saying you "bought" a puppy. I think "buying" a puppy is absolutely fine so long as you do actually make it a member of your family and treat it as such.

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

I totally agree. I have had this same conversation.
As for my Yorkies, 7 of them I have Adopted from a Rescue Group's, and 3 of them I have Purchased.

Ugh! I feel the same way..."IT" bothers me to no end :mad:

You know what's weird and the reason why I understand some people using these terms or words? My pregnant friend, a kind heart--sweet woman with no history of malice, kept referring to her unborn baby as "IT." and allowed people to do the same. For days I bit my lip and promised myself to keep it together (I love her, I don't want to hurt her). Finally, I did burst :eek:

I know most people don't mean anything devilish, but damage is inevitable.

No wonder I'm so confused :p English is my second language :eek:

To me...this phraseology reeks like a politican.

You can spin words and phrase things however you like...but what is it you are really saying? If you are willing to hand over a puppy/dog/whatever for cash....you are selling it.

I don't believe its the difference in phraseology that accounts for the difference in how dogs are treated or mistreated...its the difference in people. My dog will always be mine for it's life...just like my kids...that's a commitment I personally make. Not everyone makes that same commitment to their pet. Not everyone views their pet as a member of their family.

:thumbup: I agree.

What I am saying is, as long as we continue to refer to dogs, cats, rabbits (or children) as THINGS, regardless of monies being exchanged, these living, breathing, feeling beings will be seen and treated as OBJECTS.

What do we do with objects? We use and abuse objects and then we discard them, quickly and easily.

How do we refer to living things as objects? With words like, "IT", "For Sale", "Buy" and words we use when we acquire non-living things.

You're saying that if a person is willing to hand over their puppy for money, you are selling it? Yeah, agree. So will it be a sale if a person is willing to hand over their human child for money. It is a transaction, I understand that. Yes, the commitment is made by people and people are made with thoughts that were born out of words. Phraseology does make a difference.

What do you use to teach your child to respect and treat with kindness those that can't defend themselves? Words. Which words do you use? his/her teacher?

My phraseology 'reeks of a politician'? Thanks, you have no idea :D. Only I'm not running for office or selling anything, other than what most of us complaint about so often...the cruelty to animals to end. I'm offering my little, itty, bitty grain for that huge mountain that most of us wish to see one day, called: no more torture and cruelty to defenseless animals.

I'm in marketing and sales, trust me, words do make a difference. If you don't believe me ask yourself why you buy one brand of XY product and not the other. Marketing has told you what you want to buy ;) You and me and 99.9% of the world, we are not as independent in our thinking as we wish to believe, we have been conditioned with phraseology since birth.

What I would love to see is a REconditioning to allow people to see the pain and suffering of those who can't defend themselves :thumbup:

Very well said. I do understand some of the mixed feelings people have over the phases. I bought...purchased..paid for my dogs. The reality is someone bread them to sell. When someone ask, I mostly say " I got her from ******". I dont focus on the purchase but I would never say adpot because in my mind that woulde be a rehome or rescue. I will most likely adpot my next fur butt

What is important is what I did afterwards. They are my fur babies !! They are loved and cared for.

I would like to add.
I think ownership of a pet...a animal is Not something that will change soon. What must change is how we value life... Be it human or animal. To be honest I am close to being a vegetarian because it bothers me to kill an animal eat it. I can't even imagine abusing one of my pets. But I do own them, they can not earn money and provide for themselves. That is my responsibility as their owner..and a the human that loves them.

I think the "it" is sometimes used when you don't know the gender ... I Agree it is a bit insulting

I hadn't thought much about this until reading this thread. I understand everyone's feelings, but am not yet sure how I feel - need to think about it. But, and this is a little off topic, the discussion reminds me of how outraged I do get when I hear some guy refer to his better half as "THE wife". Makes me see red! Talk about treating someone as property!!

Buy a Dog ? Adopt a Dog ?
I am a writer. I agree words paint pictures. I use them myself to create the right 'feel' for my story. Professional sales people do too. Like an old Saturday Evening Post cover, a Norman Rockwell illusion, the word adopt makes us think, we are doing something selfless and honorable. Adoption conjures up a young child or animal, with no parents or home. We even feel like we should do something like provide a home, protection and maybe even love.
I prefer to use the term adopted myself but, admit I use it because it makes me feel good, and expresses how I feel about my own Yorkies. They are not just dogs to me. They are certainly more important than a thing, to me.
Adoption is both a noun and an adjective. It is a 'nice feel good word that is misused quite often. We do not legally adopt animals. We own them. They are property according to the law. That may be changing here in the USA because dogs are rarely property to pet owners today. We don't buy dogs to solely, do a job for us the way we would a dairy cow or pack mule. We want a personal relationship with our pets. Deep down I know that Fee and Buy are not the same thing. Maybe only non-profit placement agencies or non-profit breeders should use the terms Adoption and Fee, all others should use Buy, Sell and Price ? Something to think about ...............

I beleive there is a difference.

Breeders put dogs (puppies) up for adoption (with an adoption fee) Greeder put dogs (puppies) up for sale.

Now having said that, the real difference is between a breeder & a Greeder...

Interesting topic. Looking at my own usage of the two words, and the underlying beliefs they surfacely portray, I'd use adopt when referring to a legitimate rescue or shelter, save when I've literally saved a puppy from an abusive situation personally, and buy/bought when purchasing from a breeder.

Looking at the first two situations my underlying belief is that I am rescuing a dog from harm, be it death or a lifetime of neglect on a varying scale. The placement fee is minimal and easily in reach of many folks. I expect no or little support from the shelter/rescue especially over the long term. I am prepared to receive a pup that may have temperament and varying kinds of health issues over the long term.

When I buy from a breeder, I am investing a significant amount of money to secure, a dog that is purebred, healthy and an excellent example of the breed, with great temperament/character. I am buying more than the pup, I am also buying the breeder's help knowledge, and life long commitment to both her pup and to me as the new owner. I am entering into a very important relationship.

I also like other posters don't want to see the term "adopt" misused (more than it already is by questionable breeders and some out and out pupmills.

hmmmmmm questioning myself & my opinions based on another one of your postings....

Those pup ills use some pricey marketing tactics don't they?
Pulling at heart strings & confusing the uninformed...almost as shameless as the Greeders who paste "Jesus & his father" all over their sites talking about their holiness etc etc trust God, trust me...send deposit via paypal...very deceptive in the worst way.:mad:

I agree with you 100%