Help with Breeding questions
 

Today 11:14 AM - permalink
Leroy Dennis

Hello all you Yorkie Fans.
My wife, Maureen and I have had Yorkies (as pets) for the past 12 years. We have a bitch that we are considering breeding (4 years old). I have asked a potential breeder some questions concerning the process and have gotten some suspect answers. The breeder told me, when asked, that the stud can rejuvinate in 24 hours to breed again and that only one session is enough for a good breeding. I have been told you should wait at least three days between couplings and at least two couplings were needed to ensure more than one or two puppies. Can someone give me the correct information? In the back of my mind the stud is being overused.
Thanks LeRoy Dennis

I know very little about breeding...mostly what I've learned on here. But I seem to recall reading that 4 yrs old for a first litter can have higher risks attached to it. :confused: You might try posting your question in the Breeder forum, you may get better luck in a reply there.

hi there i dont know much about breeding but i have read very sad stories . so do ur research first , all the best and hope u enjoy yt,

Stringing it out with three days in between is not good. I breed usually every other day starting at day nine for three times. OR sometimes I breed two days straight then forget it. My husband has bred, trained and shown Beagles for forty years. Many times we have had p[eople drive from all over the U.S. to breed to one of our champion stud dogs. They drive in, bred the dog,m then leave usually. rarely has an yone felt the need to spend the night and breed again on the second day. The dogs always had great litters from only one breeding. beagle litters are usually from six to eleven so you see, you have been told wrong about everything. The answers are not suspect but in fact aare very correct.

Would you please respond to them wanting to breed a 4 year old.

yes, I will. Sorry I overlooked that part. A four year old bitch should NOT be bred for the first time. I won't even breed a three year old for the first time. i will have to talk to my hubby about the whys of it but I know it should never be done. I actually have forgotten what it is for sure since I never do it anyway. This breeder you have been talking to should have told you that. It would be way too hard on the bitch. if I were you, I would spay her and let her enjoy her life as your beautiful pet.

Have you thought about the things that could happen as a result of this breeding?



You could end up with a section -Planned or Emergency. We just went through the emergency and the cost was just over 1,500

You could loose your female, her pups, or all of the above Or, you could end up bottle feeding a week or tiny puppy or the whole litter every hour and a half round the clock..



so, lets say all went well and your all ok.. Newborns are blind,deaf and can not moderate their own body temperature.. You must keep them from drafts etc.. They grow and all is well at 4 weeks they start to walk and poooo and poo and poo and pee LOL you get the idea.



Now you go to sell your angels, do you have any plan to ask questions of the people that buy them? How will you keep tabs on how they are?



Do you have a plan to offer a health guarantee? What testing does your female have? At the least she should have a basic blood panel.. Have you tested both male and female for Brucellosis?



Breeding is not easy money and with each litter it is possible to spend thousands and not make a dime of it back...



Also, breeding a 4 year old for the first time is asking for trouble. In my opinion.



This is the short list.

I am not trying to be mean, these things truly do happen.

All that said. I bred one of my girls one time on day 12 and no more. She had a litter of 5. Another girl tied on day 11 - 13 and 14 she had ONE pup.

I would not breed to many days from first breeding to last keep you run the risk of puppies being too large or too small.

Dee, I'm sure your hubby will certainly be able to explain this more thoroughly but I have assisted on a few c-sections due to inability of the pelvic girdle to expand during delivery. If my memory serves me, older small / toy breed and first time pregnancies tended have issues.

Again, I am stumbling here, so correct anything that sounds off... By 18 months the pelvic girdle along with all other bones begin to become rigid... Bitches bred and naturally whelped by 2 yrs old have in place the right amount of give... Bitches that have reached 4 or 5 have very little give and really have difficulty. The fetal mortality rate is increased dramatically (like 20%) per year after 2 years of age with regard to newly bred females.

Once the whelping is done, sometimes older bitches tend to have difficulty with the post pregnancy period. Many will almost abandon the puppies as they are just not able to cope with the move from pet to parent. That is purely psychological but almost impossible to overcome if presented.

That said, it would be unfair to say this always happens as I know of several older females who have successfully whelped.... IMO, the OP just needs to be aware of the possible risks / complications associated with older females whelping and be prepared....

Ouch. And this is why my baby is spayed and her future sister will also be spayed. My deep respect and admiration to the wonderful breeders out there! :)

makes sense to me!!!!!

I'm glad... b/c some days nothing makes sense to me.... :D

Why is it that when someone comes here asking questions about breeding, there is always someone, a breeder themselves, that tells them all of the horrible things that can happen?

Why do they believe that they, themselves are so much better equipped to breed than the next person.

Why not merely suggest to them that they talk to other breeders so they know what they are getting into, so they can be prepared. Rather than to talk to them like they are a couple of 13 year olds who have decided to get pregnant.

Sugarsmom addressed the issue of the 4 year old dog. That was all that was needed on that issue.

To the OP, Good Luck to you if you decide to go into this. Please take the advise of Sugarsmom on the 4 year old. Get a new girl, and take your time researching.

I agree. People come here asking honest questions and those questions need to be answered simply and in a way that people can understand. Because we try to answer them does not mean we condone what they aare going to do. I am grateful to SET YORKIES for her imput. I couldn't remember why for the life of me. But the other long rambling post has no place. The OP didn't ask for permission to breed. Sometimes I think when breeders do this, they are afraid that some of these novice breeders might turn out to be really great breeders with a little help and therefore competetion. Competetion never hurts any of us but SHOULD make us all strive harder to be honest ethical breeders that try to produce nice healthy pups.

I agree with theory.

I would never be so arrogant as to think that someone else could not be as good at something as I am.

In addition to the pelvic bones becoming set by four years, the uterus will not have the elasticity it needs. The uterus tends to thicken up with each successive heat if the bitch isn't bred so there can be issues there, too.

4 yo is really a bit old for a female to have a first litter...at least without increased risks of complications. At that age, her skeletal structure will be "too set" to accomodate easily for the litter as it grows.

For future reference, skipping 3 days in between ties is too long. I personally prefer 3 ties, one per day, within a 4 day period. The key is knowing when that appropriate time for her to be bred is. When in question, have progesterone testing done. If you can assure you are breeding her on her most fertile days, only a few ties should be needed. Also, the goal should be to produce a healthy litter, which is not necessarily related to the number of pups in the litter, if you catch my drift.

the key is knowing both the good and the bad
 

I think there is certainly a multi-fold answer in that many want a lot less competition and would like to see a great deal fewer breeders out there. Others truly want to educate but sometimes come off a bit rude b/c their passion for the breed gets all tangled up the their posts. I think, too, a straight forward very dry response can come off rude as well... I'm certainly guilty of both at times... Well, and some folks are just not very nice.... but I degress... I've posted the following story before, and I think it may give the OP a healthy perspective on breeding and also explain why sometimes seasoned breeders can be a bit sharp....I know I've responded at times with this story in the back of my mind and could have been more diplomatic and gentle with my answers.... It isn't always rainbows and butterflies, but for some its the best thing they've ever done. Learning, reading, researching are all key to breeding; but, nothing can replace experience.


Every breeder on this board started somewhere….You certainly have the right to explore this endevor... Let me tell you the story of our humble beginning as something to consider. I had an excellent mentor full of knowledge and experience (how lucky was I?)…. My second litter was due…. Talk about a textbook pregnancy…. 42nd day ultrasound showed 6 very well proportioned, small puppies…. Delivery started…..no distress….easy labor on the first puppy… then nothing….and nothing… I was prepared…. I had read all of the books…. Not to fear, middle of the day, no emergency call…. We headed to the vet just to be sure (12 miles)….she died in my hands as I walked through the office door…. I called my mentor she offered me lots of advice, understood my grief and said, “you’ll know in a few weeks if this is really for you.” …. She said that because I had 6 very tiny puppies (5 saved through c/s) that needed to be nursed every two hours for weeks….I buried my Gizmo where our new kennel stands today and got started with her babies…..I would hardly close my eyes b/f it was time to feed again….two weeks into it, one just didn’t thrive….now I was at wit’s end….three days later one aspirated on the feeding tube….I was done, called my mentor and told her to come get them all… she said, “no, this was your choice and it is your responsibility”…. 20 or so weeks later of round the clock care, One by one, these tiny replicas of their mom, of whom I had become a surrogate mother, were picked up by new owners. To this day, I still grieve for my Gizmo, to this day I still check up on every puppy I sell… I’ve shoveled truck loads of poop, dried gallons of pee, built kennels, torn down kennels, delivered puppies at 2:00 am on every holiday celebrated by man (even my kids birthday parties which I had to miss)….Breeding is a complete sacrifice of everything else when the moment counts b/c your female is counting on you for everything….If you bring puppies into this world they are your responsibility and yours alone. What I learned that winter about myself has carried me through a great deal of difficult days.... Since those early days, we've certainly had lots more good than bad. If you have the ability to deal with the difficulties with the same passion as you delight in the rewards, this could be the blooming of a wonderful new endevor…one that I love more with every pooper scooper full….

I'm pretty new to YT and every single thread I open up somebody is complaining about another person's advice or opinion being to harsh or out of line. I dont see what the problem is. People come here for advice whether good or bad nice or "mean". Hopefully we are adults here and can consider the fact that people are gonna have opinions whether we like it or not. People spend too much tme worryng about how the person responded and not the informaton in the responses. I have yet come across an "out of line" response to a question just honest heart felt opinions. Some things you just cant take to heart and think that they are attacks. If it was verbally said i'm pretty sure it wouldnt come off as harsh or out of line, it would just be two or more people having a discusson or debate about some thing that touches them deeply. Take what you can out of the answers to the question people ask. Nobody says you have to agree with what is being said but we are entitled to our opinions. The reason for this forum (at least that's what I thought) was information, opinions and what you can learn from others experiences whether negative or positive. It's not about who's better than who or the competition, it's about the knowledge whether good/bad. Take what you can out of all the answers. If everyone agreed with each other this forum wouldnt be interested and there would be no growth in the knowledge you can get from here. Stop all this complaining and get to the real deal which is the fact that people are gonna have opinions. Agree to disagree.
I wonder what the Yorkies are thinking about this nonsense.:rolleyes:
P.S. Dont take this as an "out of line" comment, it's surely out of good faith:D

You read the post you quoted wrong. The OP did not come here asking for tips or lectures on whether or not to breed altho someone saw fit to do just that. That is what we are complaining about. The questions he wanted answered were not even addressed in that big long lecture he got that he didn't ask for. Some of us tried to answer his questions and provide him with the info HE REQUESTED. And yes, I do think your post is out of line to those of us that did try to help him. Are you a breeder? Did you come to the thread to try to help? To learn? Everyone on this thread is an experienced breeder so far and hopefully, we were able to help him before the thread went astray .

Your post in no way pertains to what the OP asked. However, neither did several of the other responses I suppose. It strayed off topic before you posted. That being said though, I completely agree with what you've stated. :)

Agreed. :thumbup: I think that the OP got the answers he was looking for (regarding how to space out ties) and some other helpful information on top of that that he likely didn't know but desperately needed to be aware of (regarding a a first litter for a 4 yo not being ideal).

Generally speaking, I like to see people receiving the information they are looking for, but also, if something else presents itself that others can offer advice on, that's good to see too. For example, I would HOPE that if someone posted up asking for advice on some specific detail on breeding a 3 pound girl, that someone would have the gall to speak up and advise against it...whether it was specifically asked about or not.

In full disclosure...I have absolutely no interest whatsoever in breeding. In fact, the one year I taught a primary grade, I gagged every time a child pulled a tooth and proudly stuck it in my face so I could join in their celebration and their excited anticipation of the tooth fairy.

I don't even remember now why I wandered into this thread but the concept about not doing a first breeding at 4 years caught my interest.

I do want to tell you though that your description of your first experience as a breeder is profoundly touching. In fact, I wish there was a section where a post like that could be saved for easier access such as when a sticky is attached (for lack of a better description). Perhaps a "hall of fame" for great posts, if you will.

The story of your experience gives the most heartfelt and detailed explanation of why one should approach the subject of becoming a breeder with full knowledge and acceptance of how difficult the job can become. You mentor should be very proud and your story would well serve those who need a more balanced view on breeding.

It is quite apparent to me that breeding Yorkies is a bit like teaching. From the outside looking in it doesn't appear to be that difficult especially when observing someone who knows what they are doing. However, from the inside looking out it is the most difficult job you'll ever love because if it is your passion, nothing could keep you from it...not even the scoops of poop as you so expressively state!

Kudos to you for a fantastic post about your experience!

hi to all i wud just like to say when someone comes on and asks for advice on breeding they shud get it in a way that is friendly, when someone is harsh in the answer the op will not listen to cheeky but true advice, sure i dont think that the op has even answered back. i believe there is a way off talking to people and getting ur point across to which they wud listen:rolleyes: