OK...here it is :D. If the numbers are correct, I can't see how anyone can justify that much killing. It truly is beyond me how, even considering the 'worst of the worst', that only 7 out of over 2,000 dogs could have been saved. Maybe PETA can justify a higher than average kill rate, but to save only 7 out of over 2,000?? I was just kidding about the arguing but I just can't imagine any scenario where such a high kill rate is justified. I will keep an open mind if you can explain this.

Purple: Wow, really? Never? Well gosh, I feel pretty special then.:wub:

Pink: I don't know how you form your opinions but I research before I form mine. If an organization is truthful and supports my views then I like them. If they lie then I don't. Therefore there isn't an instance where what I think doesn't make something true or not.

If that's truly how you understand the article, I don't know what else to say. All I can do is refer you to the site that explains the Asilomar Accords again. It makes it very clear why that article could not have been written by any shelter- not even remotely close actually.

You absolutely have every right to support organizations you feel comfortable with. Your point of view has more power if it is based on fact and not outright lies from a propaganda group though.

Why don't we just agree to disagree then? I really don't care to debate with you as it seems that sharp-tongued repartee' is your first line of defense. Have a good one!! :)

I absolutely respect this because I understand the position from where your opinion is coming from (political).

~~~~~~~

To others - I think what is making this confusing is that people are still slamming the euthanasia/death rate - and that's why some people are asking if the article was even read and/or understood.

I'm not sure where to go from here, other than to ask - since the death rate is so troublesome, what would folks have PETA do? Would you rather they rescue these near-death, totally-beyond-treatment animals and force them to stay alive so the animal can die an excruciating and prolonged, but natural, death? Just so that PETA has a more acceptable death rate?

Look...I have no issues w/ folks who just don't want to support PETA, I get it - feel free to support what feels right. But putting down animals who are in a tortured physical state of health, who are beyond repair, is the kindest thing that can be done for these animals - and I support PETA for being stuck with this awful job of rescuing the worst of the worst. I have a lot of empathy for those people on the front lines who rescue these animals and have to make these decisions. It saddens me to have what they do criticized and misunderstood, but I do understand where that comes from - I do understand why PETA is not an easy organization for some folks to accept.

I do not have an issue with putting down an animal that needs to be put down but 7 out of over 2000 placed in a loving home and the rest put down? I just don't see how only 7 out of over 2000 isn't salvageable?
I do not support PETA and never will but again, I don't have an issue with what needs to be done but I just can't get past only 7 being able to place and the rest put to sleep....propaganda and it is my opinion and I'm entitled :)

Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

Thanks, Ann, for a most reasonable post. For myself, my original post summed up my opinion most accurately. I don't know what the answer is, I just see the numbers as being too high under any circumstance. To take the explanation you are offering seems to take a little faith in PETA's honesty and transparency that I just don't have. I cannot fathom a justifiable 90+% kill rate no matter the source of these animals. Do you really think it's such a clear either/or circumstance in all these cases? Possibly, I suppose, but I guess anyone that isn't there can never really know. I won't quote any more data from 'questionable' sources but folks are free to browse for themselves. I will try to become more informed on the specifics of the issue from all available sources and am open to anyone presenting unbiased information. I try to keep an open mind about any issue and this is no exception. Thanks again for your post. I know that you and I are able to disagree on some things without being disagreeable....Jim

Oh yes, we're all entitled to our opinions - I always support that! :D

Just keep in mind - that "7 in 2000" came from the CCF - one of the *worst* propaganda machines on the planet.

The CCF is against MADD too - why? Because MADD hurts the alcohol industry :(. I just wouldn't put much weight toward any stats provided by the CCF. And I don't mean just for PETA, I mean for anything. So, I just hope you wouldn't base your opinion about anything on stats from CCF - bc those numbers are likely invented. Sadly.

I think that for most people its a lot to take in. Everyone here obviously loves animals and they want to save them all, or give them a chance. I think what people don't understand is the gravity of these animals situation. Those few pictures that go along with the article show 4 or 5 animals that were put to sleep because of their condition. I don't think everyday people can imagine the torment and torture that animals go through every single day because they are living with cancer, mange, starvation, tick fever, anemia, gum disease, severe allergies, tumors, overbreeding, etc, etc, etc. People may not think some of these things are that bad and that the animal can and should be treated, but the reality is that they just can't. By the time PETA gets these animals their disease/problem is so far out of control that NOTHING can be done to save them. I have PERSONALLY seen cases like the ones in the pictures. It is heartbreaking to see these poor animals living in that condition. I have worked with animals for the past 14 years in shelters and animal hospitals. My job was to try to save these animals from the pain and sometimes the only way to do that was with some tears, a pat on the head, a hug and a kiss, and a needle.

It is estimated that there are 90 million cats, and 70 million dogs in the USA. PETA euthanises 2000 a year. That's 2000 dogs and cats out of how many millions that are suffering, because we all know that those 90 mil and 70mil are not living in happy and healthy homes with owners who would do anything for them.

I understand where those numbers would be a shock. I also understand folks not having faith in PETA's transparency - PETA is very alienating to a LOT of people and I really do understand where it comes from.

I think the issue w/ the numbers/stats is their source - the CCF is kind of...I don't know how to label them really - but they kinda scare me. And, I know :), PETA scares you and others :p. What scares me about stats from CCF is that they've been caught before inventing stats, so I just fear anything they present as fact.

I do expect PETA to have a rather unimaginable death/euth. rate bc their investigators will actually *sneak* animals out, if they must for the worst, during investigations - they've done stories about this. So honestly, even if they had a 90% euth rate - it wouldn't totally surprise me based upon the level of severity in the cases they attend.

At the end of the day, any death rate is sad - I guess all we can do is offer support according to our comfort level and keep hoping someday we'll be talking about "euthanasia rate" like we now talk about 8-track tapes, which don't really exist anymore. We can hope anyway. :)

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

Great firsthand insight! So sorry, Kellie, you have to live w/ these memories. :(

I just can't see why PETA would come to dog shows and let dogs out of their crates on purpose....how is that keeping an animal safe? Why does PETA have to come picket dog shows because we are the bad guys? Saying we mistreat "OUR" dogs? This is a small portian I know in the grand scheme of things...but if PETA supports and looks out for animal welfare then why turn a perfectly healthy dog and probably treated better than some humans and let them out of crates because they think it's inhumane? Sorry...I can't support an organization that thinks this way....even this article doesn't change my mind towards PETA....I eat meat and I guess that goes against PETA too....I wear leather, UGGS so I guess it's inhumane huh? I love my animals but again PETA does nothing for me....I probably trust my animals more so than humans....and I will still not support PETA :) But, if those choose to support them it's your choice and that's the beauty of living in the USA we have that right :)

Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

oh i agree completely with this. PETA is overly ridiculous with some things. I don't support a lot of things that they do. i too eat meat, wear leather, uggs, etc, but with this particular situation i do have to thank PETA for helping these animals.

I don't support turning dogs out their cage, not one iota. That is not something I would ever support. I support good breeders and always will. I believe in what you do.

I don't eat meat (not for ~16 years), but I embrace your choice to eat meat; my hubby eats meat. If you came to my casa for dinner - Donna, I'd cook meat for ya if that's what you wanted :). I don't want to force my choices on anyone - that's not my place.

My biggest concern is cruelty and I hope we see less of that - in every arena of the world's industries. For me, PETA is a part of that movement, but I support your choice not to support them. There are plenty of other ways to support animal welfare. :)

Oh my best friend doesn't eat meat LOL...she cooks for meat for her hubby too LOL...
PETA doesn't support breeders. As Woogie man stated PETA and HSUSA has a $150 million ( I think ) in their budget and they do not use it for what it's meant to be used for....that could go to donating to shelters and causes in my opinion...that money could be used to help stop cruelty and they do not use it for that...it's used more for media campaigns, literature ect...and right out propaganda....JMHO....
I would love with all my heart to stop cruelty to animals and would hurt someone physically if I EVER saw them mistreat an animal but in my opinion PETA again is too extreme for even this total animal lover :) Until HUMANS get a heart and soul and stop beating their own kids, murdering others then maybe we'll see less animal cruelty.
Again, PETA needs to really practice what they preach as in not coming to dog shows and letting our animals out of a protective crate and just leaving them to escape, get stolen, and possibly get run over I just see fire when that happens....I've been to a dog show where they've let these dogs out and I have to see these poor owners having to try and locate their beloved dog just ticks me off to no end :(

Donna

For those interested, here are the actual euthanasia stats, via the government, for 2007 for PETA; it appears the euth. rate is 22%:

VDACS Online Animal Reporting

The same data is available for 2008 (but not yet on this site, as far as I could tell) and it appears to show a euth. rate of 24%.

:):):)

I'll bet they don't tell you anywhere about the ones that they euthanize that are perfectly healthy and could be placed in good homes. Just like the girl that was part of the PETA org that was caught going into shelters and rescues and saying that she could find good homes for some of the puppies they had, then taking those dogs out to her van and euthanizing them right there, then taking the bodies and dumping them into the trash at Walmart, whic is how she was caught. Or how they visit dog shows and put antifreeze into the dogs water dishes so that they die a terrible painful death because they feel that dogs should not be owned.

I feel that they are a terrible organization that tries to fool people into thinking that they do good.

IMHO, this is blatant exploitation. They play on the emotions of those of us who love our pets passionately for the purposes of fund raising and politics. To read Newkirk's article, you would think she was the only one in the US who could end a life humanely. I think there are 10s of thousands of Euthanasia Techs in the country who might disagree. The vast majority do their jobs with competence, compassion, respect and profound reverence. The life they end will never again suffer.

I was slow to understand that PETA changed, and I feel duped by them. I was never a big donor, but I wish I could have the money back that I sent them.

Since most everyone who has posted in support of this thread has backed up what they were saying with a link to an independent source, I think it would be great if those that have bad stories about peta would do the same. I am honestly interested it's just difficult to sort urban legend from fact without a source.

People forget these facts unfortunately and the fact that PETA does what they do at dog shows, letting them out, putting antifreeze in water bowls ect... PETA does NOT support responsible/reputable breeders and would do away with us altogether and just have it to where there were no pets period.....so normally I don't get into a debate with PETA members because they believe in what they want just as much as I believe in what I do and NO ONE will change my disgust with PETA!

Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

I took it as a response to those who have adopted the mantra, "PETA Kills Animals" after being the recipients of a good brainwashing by the CCF. It is obvious from this thread that there are plenty of people who do not support peta and have seen through that campaign but their are many people out there who haven't.

I think most people who have to handle euthanasia are absolutely incredible and much stronger than I am. Most shelter workers are heroes IMO. This was just a personal article about a personal experience. That kind usually carries a big impact.

I've been at the dog show where PETA pickets, has turned them loose PERSONALLY!!!!! I've attended dog shows were we've had to have security hired and put locks on our crates just so PETA members wouldn't let our dogs out....
I think that is pretty much an independent source as one can get.

Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

If it is true what you are saying about PETA putting antifreeze into dog bowls can you please post a link to this information? I have said before that I link to arm myself with as much information as possible and would personally be outraged if any organization including PETA was causing pain and suffering to any animals!

Yep, it doesn't get much more credible than an eyewitness report- thank you.

I wasn't accusing anyone of making something up, it's just hard to differentiate between a fact and someone passing on something that they heard form who knows who, who read it who knows where. Sometimes people have the best of intentions and pass on false information unintentionally.

As a dog lover, obviously I think that is deplorable to let dogs loose.

Yes I would like to see a link to that also because this is the first Ive heard of this

I"ll have to find the link....but I've personally been and witnessed dogs being let out of crates and some get very ill after PETA members attended dog shows to create havoc....so I guess seeing in person kinda reaffirms my disgust in PETA!

Donna Bird
Brooklynn's Yorkshire Terriers

Ann thank you for posting this. I hope it doesn't get missed with everything else that is being discussed.:thumbup:

An independent link is so helpful because though I believe you 100% that people participating in a peta demonstration have caused problems for participants of dog shows you have attended. Here is the problem; I have participated in unrelated demonstrations and have never met a protester who would do ANYTHING that would harm an animal. I have also participated in HSUS events- we are talking serious animal lovers who would hurt themselves before an animal. This is my personal experience. Actions like you have described would absolutely horrify anyone I have ever met who is associated with either group. Now, I'm not saying nobody would ever let a dog out of a crate. You said you witnessed it and I believe you. It's just without an independent report it is very hard for me to believe it would be sanctioned by peta.

That is exactly what I was thinking, Nikki!

Does PETA's administration actually organize the protests at dog shows and the release of the dogs?

Or is it PETA supporters with their own agenda and way of "demonstrating" things?

There are always going to be a few crazies associated with every group! I've seen a few on YT too!!!

I think that ANYTHING in the way of preventing cruelty to animals and ending suffering is heroic. I have been a pescaterian for a little over 10 years now but I live with a carnivore:rolleyes:. No leather in my car or on my clothing and I do what I can to help my local shelters and rescues. Wish I could do more.

OP THANK YOU for posting the article, people need to see what happens to unwanted and unloved animals, maybe instead of getting all nuts about it on here, you can take your writing skills and put them to good use writing your Representatives about shelter overcrowding, animal population problems and low cost or free spay and neuter programs. Or support your states HB's regulating laws on puppymills.

There are 2 kinds of people in this world people that care for animals and those that don't. I think everyone on this thread is an animal lover, weather the support/agree with PETA or not! So with that being said get to work on those letters!!!!!

If dogs were poisoned by anyone at a dog show, that would be a criminal act - there would have been charges, arrests, media reports. I can't imagine any animal lover or animal welfare worker poisoning a dog. If someone can provide a police report or news story, I'd like to read it.

I could see, sadly, someone trying to pretend to be an animal activist and then harming animals, just to hurt the animal rights/welfare movement. I'm sorry to say that, but it's true. Just bc someone is wearing a PETA t-shirt, it does not mean that PETA condones their actions - nor does it mean they're from PETA.