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-   -   True Biewers. (https://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/breeder-talk/29797-true-biewers.html)

jakeepaper 01-29-2006 07:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by shelbysmom
I have to ask again. Can you or anyone name a new breed that was started strickly from a fault in the standard of it's original breed? New breeds are usually intentionally created mixing breeds aren't they?
The English Bulldog is a genetic mutation...the original
Elizebethan Bulldog with achondroplastic dwarfism

The real point is the Biewers are here. In order to gain AKC recognition, it must be decided by the "powers that be" whether to allow them to be shown and recognized as Yorkies or as their own breed. If they are to be judged as Yorkies, then it will not matter whether they are Biewer/Biewer or Biewer/Yorkie. If they are to be judged in their own "breed" then it will. I may have my opinion but surely no one making the decision cares what I think....lol.

goldenray 01-30-2006 06:02 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jakeepaper
I am waiting confirmation from my breeder who only breeds Biewer to Biewer, but it is my understanding that he has 5 lines of direct Biewer descendants, he does not mix with standard yorkshires and he does not have puppies that die at 7-8 years. New breeds are created from changes (ie mutations) from old breeds. In fact, the Yorkie itself is descended that way, something to ponder, hmmmmmmmm?????
Hi Lori. Actually there is numerous breeds in the makeup of the Yorkie way back in the beginning.

jakeepaper 01-30-2006 06:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by goldenray
Hi Lori. Actually there is numerous breeds in the makeup of the Yorkie way back in the beginning.
True, I stand corrected. The genetic mutations were in breeding them down to yorkie current size.

YorkieRini 01-30-2006 06:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by goldenray
Hi Lori. Actually there is numerous breeds in the makeup of the Yorkie way back in the beginning.
That is so true. I reread 'The Complete Yorkshire Terrier Book' last night to refresh my memory about the History. The history of the Yorkie was never agreed upon, there are several theories. It mentioned Maltese being back there too :eek: .

goldenray 01-30-2006 07:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by YorkieRini
That is so true. I reread 'The Complete Yorkshire Terrier Book' last night to refresh my memory about the History. The history of the Yorkie was never agreed upon, there are several theories. It mentioned Maltese being back there too :eek: .
History is not agreed upon. Possible Maltese was thrown out by someone, not Wildweir but another to account for possible coat texture. It is kind of a guess like we guess on the Biewer. This could be a possibility, although a proper Yorkie is a much better coat, but who knows for sure. It would account for the tri, since Maltese carry the piebald gene, but if Maltese was in our breed that far back, all of us would be seeing some tri. Or maybe not since I do not ever breed soft coats. Didn't realize until Sue's post that Biewers were created from 2 black soft coats anyway. Once again this is why there is a standard.

shelbysmom 01-30-2006 11:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jakeepaper
The English Bulldog is a genetic mutation...the original
Elizebethan Bulldog with achondroplastic dwarfism

The real point is the Biewers are here. In order to gain AKC recognition, it must be decided by the "powers that be" whether to allow them to be shown and recognized as Yorkies or as their own breed. If they are to be judged as Yorkies, then it will not matter whether they are Biewer/Biewer or Biewer/Yorkie. If they are to be judged in their own "breed" then it will. I may have my opinion but surely no one making the decision cares what I think....lol.
The English Bulldog was bred with a working purpose and it was long before the AKC was founded. It's not the same as trying to establish or create a new breed out of the faulty color that is already designated against the standard. It would be the same thing if someone named Smith wanted to breed for white German Shephards and call them Smiths or Smith Shephards.

If the Yorkie didn't already come in the same Tri Colors that disqualify it from the standard this whole new breed thing might be more acceptable. I would think YTCA would have lots to say about this.

ARe there any other breeds that were created by traits that make it disqualified in it's original AKC breed?

whispersmom2 01-30-2006 08:33 PM
In my gallery and avatar, you will see a pic of an adult black, white and tan dog with a topknot. That is Remi, my AKC reg. parti marked male. There might be other pics of him but if not, e-mail me and I will send more than you could even want from 6 weeks til now..He looks like the Biewers IMO with his markings, etc. He has sired a gorgeous litter with my Biewer female and there is a male in that litter that will knock your sox off. The little female is 3'7" and is the spitting image of her Biewer mom. The male is just like his daddy.
I have not checked my gallery-there are 3 pages- so there might be more pics of him....

red98vett 01-31-2006 03:55 AM
2 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by whispersmom2
In my gallery and avatar, you will see a pic of an adult black, white and tan dog with a topknot. That is Remi, my AKC reg. parti marked male. There might be other pics of him but if not, e-mail me and I will send more than you could even want from 6 weeks til now..He looks like the Biewers IMO with his markings, etc. He has sired a gorgeous litter with my Biewer female and there is a male in that litter that will knock your sox off. The little female is 3'7" and is the spitting image of her Biewer mom. The male is just like his daddy.
I have not checked my gallery-there are 3 pages- so there might be more pics of him....

HERE is REMI that gorgeous boy :love:...and a Parti at 10 weeks....

I have a folder of Rini's Gang...so I'm posting this for her

whispersmom2 01-31-2006 08:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snow Yorkies
Yes, this is what she is saying... When you are line breeding you have to bring in new lines and since their are not that many lines if you continue to line breed as in any breed you are going to start having problems... Someday this breed will hopefully be able to stand on it's own but you have to remember what all is involved in line breeding. ( I know you have the this knowledge... :D) Sit back and reflect on line breeding and this will all make sense. This is such a young breed... :p She states that in the 3rd to 5th generation is when they have seen the problems start to develop if a new line isn't started. I can't pretend to know all that is involved here. That is one of the reason's of traveling to Germany this Oct. But until then I have every intention to follow the German's lead on breeding this lovely little dog.
So, Sue, would that make my Remi partis and Chrystel's Biewers a valuable tool in introducing another blood line? I mean, they wouldn't have to worry about a splitter cause the puppies are already marked properly. That is an interesting concept and one I had nt considered..Do you think Nancy might know the nitty-gritty of this??

yorluvr 01-31-2006 08:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by whispersmom2
In my gallery and avatar, you will see a pic of an adult black, white and tan dog with a topknot. That is Remi, my AKC reg. parti marked male. There might be other pics of him but if not, e-mail me and I will send more than you could even want from 6 weeks til now..He looks like the Biewers IMO with his markings, etc. He has sired a gorgeous litter with my Biewer female and there is a male in that litter that will knock your sox off. The little female is 3'7" and is the spitting image of her Biewer mom. The male is just like his daddy.
I have not checked my gallery-there are 3 pages- so there might be more pics of him....
I am curious, how did you get AKC to register a parti since that is not an acceptable color by AKC or YTCA?
Julie

whispersmom2 01-31-2006 09:46 PM
Julie, I really had no problem at all. I sent 4 pics, mom and dad's pedigrees, and his application, and left the colors and markings boxes vacant. The color committee considered the info and he was registered. I had a friend who does peds do a 5 gen one for him with his pic on it..I LOVE it!!!
Parti is not considered a color but markings..it means his coat is basically white with readily visibly other color(S). His colors are black and tan with parti as the markings..

whispersmom2 01-31-2006 09:47 PM
And, Villette yes that puppy is Remi...Isn't he sweet?

red98vett 02-01-2006 03:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by whispersmom2
And, Villette yes that puppy is Remi...Isn't he sweet?
YES HE is :rose: I thought it was him as a baby... but didn't want to say it unless I was completely sure and it's one of my FAVORITE Pictures of your kids Rini....He is a total doll ...I mean ...LOOK at that face on him !

yorluvr 02-01-2006 06:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by whispersmom2
Julie, I really had no problem at all. I sent 4 pics, mom and dad's pedigrees, and his application, and left the colors and markings boxes vacant. The color committee considered the info and he was registered. I had a friend who does peds do a 5 gen one for him with his pic on it..I LOVE it!!!
Parti is not considered a color but markings..it means his coat is basically white with readily visibly other color(S). His colors are black and tan with parti as the markings..
Thanks for the response. So, mom and dad were correctly marked/colored AKC yorkies? Has there been any other tri-color puppies born in the pedigree that you know of? Wouldn't both parents have to be carrying the white gene for your puppy to be marked this way? Remi is cute, BTW.
Julie

sabrinasmom 02-01-2006 07:35 AM
I just love the colors and they are such pretty pups. I can't wait to see them in the show rings down here.


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