Question about finding a stud
 

I've given it a lot of thought, and before I have my little girl Tashi spayed, I want her to have a litter of puppies.

The problem is, she's not a registered Yorkie. The way she came to be in my life was rather odd, and when I got her she wasn't in a very good way. Now, she is thriving, beautiful, loving, and it would mean the world to me to have a puppy of hers.

If I do breed her, I know where her puppies will go. They will be placed in homes with my good friends. I will not charge a dime for her puppies, but I will require they sign something stating that the puppies will be spayed or neutered, and will not be bred.

If Tashi does have a litter of puppies, it will be only one, and then she will be spayed. No ifs-ands-or buts about it.

I know people are going to disagree with my decision, and I fully respect that, but it really would mean the world to me to have a baby of hers and watch it grow up, watch her care for it. She has a "baby" toy that if i throw to play fetch, she wines and takes him to a soft place and licks him.

My question is, how would I go about finding a stud? Would a breeder just laugh at me?
The only things I really care about in finding a stud are that he's healthy, very sweet, and either the same size as her (5.5 lbs) or smaller.


http://i.imgur.com/atUqr.png

That's her, by the way.

Do so with great care. Make sure the stud is tested for diseases genetic and otherwise. I would be cautionous of a stud owner that does not care if the female dog is registered or not. Some people just stud their dogs out only for the money without consideration for the health of the dog.

Thank you kindly for your response. What diseases should I request that they've been tested for?

I understand Tashi will need to be tested for Brucella, anything else I should ask the vet to test her for?

I know I'm in a bit of a precarious position, as Tashi is unregistered.

Ie no patella or other orthopedic conditions ( xrays needed), no tracheal problems, no congenital eye problems, cardiologist cleanance, etc. Both would need to have clean bills of health prior to breeding with normal blood work in addition to Brucella testing. Also the stud should not be breeding females back to back exposing him and then your female to diseases. You will need a stud contract between you and the studs owner.

You said she was in good shape when you go her. Do you know anything about her background ie where she came from originally.

I breed my Cozy- She is an over standard female (10 pounds) to a 3 pound male for her 2nd litter. She had 5 pups- 4 females and 1 male. She almost needed to have c- section and the vet told me to not breed her again because of this. The females were completely healthy but the male had a cleft palate. He unfortunately died after 3 weeks with 24/7 care and vet bills. There was no cleft puppies previously on mom or dad's side. Dad was also neutered due to this.

Just food for thought. Cozy was a great mother but if I could do it over I would not have. She is my pet and famiy member first and foremost.

Good luck. Make sure to really research breeding before you do it and be prepared for the unexpected. A c- section is about $1,000 planned and more if it is an emergency section.

If she already had a tough start in life why put her at risk? I wouldn't but good luck to you.

You also really can't hold the owners of her pups to a higher standard than yourself to neutering/ spaying their pups.

Not trying to be a Debbie downer.

Make sure you have a vet on call if an emergency occurs. I'm a nurse myself and was freaked out when Cozy was having trouble delivering her litter. She also ended up with a UTI and mastitis after she had the pups.

Her first litter was unplanned- only partially my fault. She went to the groomer in heat. The groomer was aware and her staff let her out of her cage to play with an unaltered male. She had no troubles with the first litter.

To find a stud you can post an ad in newspapers or contact breeders with or without a present litter.

I would make sure the stud is smaller than her because under 6 pounds for a female puts her at higher risk to begin with. She could have anywhere from 1 to 6 puppies.

Cozy have 5 both litters. The stud I used for her 2 nd litter and Cozy were both 1 of 6 puppies in their litters. The stud had previously fathered litters of 3 puppies.

Thanks so much for responding to me :) Your response was very thorough and I really appreciate it :D

I will take all of that into consideration, and I am not 100% sure I will breed her, I may decide not to and just have her spayed.

As for holding other people to a responsibility I will not hold myself to, I absolutely will. They are friends of mine with absolutely no experience in breeding animals and I will be giving them the dogs only under the condition that they agree to not breed them and to have them spayed or neutered.

My mom showed Pomeranians while I was growing up and I've been in the operating room while her females were having c-sections. I've birthed small pups, I'm aware of how to clean the sack, how to sling them to get the mucous out of their lungs, and the warning signs to watch for in the mothers that they may be septic or there might be problems with the birthing.

I'm pretty well versed on how to deliver pups and I know that small dog births are particularly difficult. (I saw a fully trained vet sling one of my mom's puppies directly into the floor because he improperly gripped the dog).

While I greatly respect that you believe I shouldn't hold anyone to standards I wouldn't hold myself to, I disagree. There are enough unregistered dogs in shelters as it stands, and because I very seriously want the offspring of my dog to raise and to love, I am willing to go against what I believe in and consider having a litter of pups with her, but I absolutely don't want to perpetuate that into generations upon generations of unregistered dogs or backyard/in home breeders breeding her offspring for a quick buck. That is the reason I will only place her offspring in homes I know personally, and will do so with great discretion and a sense of responsibility. I feel a direct responsibility to ensure that if she does have puppies, I know full well where each of them go, and that they are altered.

While I was very involved in the birthing side of what my mother did (she was great, by the way, she only had 2-3 litters a year. She owned 2 sires that she showed to Champion status w/ AKC and owned 3 bitches. She either sold the dogs as show potential to very good show homes, or pet-only with limited registration and a spay/neuter contract). I was not in any way involved with understanding how studs or stud fees worked, which is why I am asking for help understanding it :)

How old is your dog? Has she had at least one heat? Also, what is your girl's weight? Also wondering what you meant by she had a rough start in life?

Just to warn you, you are probably going to have a problem finding a stud from someone reputable bc she is not registered. Please be careful and do not accept just any stud.

Also, things can go very wrong w breeding. Have you ever whelped an animal? Does your vet offer emergency care 24 hours to help you? Will you know if a whelp is progressing correctly? Are you ready for the financial responsibility if something goes wrong requiring emergency vet care - C sections are common, pups w health problems, difficult whelp, etc.

Just some things to think about. My background is human medicine. I am always surprised by the # of ppl who think birth is a "natural process" and needs no medical care/supervision. Things go wrong. You will need to have someone who knows what they are doing right there to help you.

Hi :) I typed out a very lengthy response to Mika, which, for some reason has to be approved by moderators, but it did include:

Like I said, I'm aware that I will probably have a difficult time finding a reputable stud, because she's unregistered. I do have a vet that I am familiar with, and greatly respect, and they work with a 24-hour clinic. (She once at a chicken bone from the trash she knocked over while I was at the store, and I had to bring her in very late at night. I have photos of her x-rays if anyone's curious/interested. They're really clear and I think they're pretty neat.)

She's 3 years old. What I meant by "she had a rough start" Is that when I got her, she was owned by a friend-of-a-friend's girlfriend. I went over to her house one time and saw that she was being kept in a back yard in Los Angeles (concrete) with two large dogs. When I got her she had a URI, and it was pretty bad. She hadn't been well cared for, and I begged the girl to give her to me so I could take her to the vet. She wouldn't "give" her to me, but she did sell her to me, I took her to an emergency vet the same day, she had IVs and antibiotics, I took her for two follow up visits, blood testing, and she was deemed in good health.

She's a very happy, energetic, and healthy dog now, who shows absolutely no signs of prior neglect. She's my best buddy in the whole world, and she's flown all over the US with me (under my seat). I take her to work with me when I do have to go in, and we've been attending obedience classes just for fun, she seems to really like them :P

Thanks so much for responding to me :) Your response was very thorough and I really appreciate it :D

I will take all of that into consideration, and I am not 100% sure I will breed her, I may decide not to and just have her spayed.

As for holding other people to a responsibility I will not hold myself to, I absolutely will. They are friends of mine with absolutely no experience in breeding animals and I will be giving them the dogs only under the condition that they agree to not breed them and to have them spayed or neutered.

My mom showed Pomeranians while I was growing up and I've been in the operating room while her females were having c-sections. I've birthed small pups, I'm aware of how to clean the sack, how to sling them to get the mucous out of their lungs, and the warning signs to watch for in the mothers that they may be septic or there might be problems with the birthing.

I'm pretty well versed on how to deliver pups and I know that small dog births are particularly difficult. (I saw a fully trained vet sling one of my mom's puppies directly into the floor because he improperly gripped the dog).

While I greatly respect that you believe I shouldn't hold anyone to standards I wouldn't hold myself to, I disagree. There are enough unregistered dogs in shelters as it stands, and because I very seriously want the offspring of my dog to raise and to love, I am willing to go against what I believe in and consider having a litter of pups with her, but I absolutely don't want to perpetuate that into generations upon generations of unregistered dogs or backyard/in home breeders breeding her offspring for a quick buck. That is the reason I will only place her offspring in homes I know personally, and will do so with great discretion and a sense of responsibility. I feel a direct responsibility to ensure that if she does have puppies, I know full well where each of them go, and that they are altered.

While I was very involved in the birthing side of what my mother did (she was great, by the way, she only had 2-3 litters a year. She owned 2 sires that she showed to Champion status w/ AKC and owned 3 bitches. She either sold the dogs as show potential to very good show homes, or pet-only with limited registration and a spay/neuter contract). I was not in any way involved with understanding how studs or stud fees worked, which is why I am asking for help understanding it :)

Among the many, many reasons I didn't ever consider breeding my Sophia the top of them was this: I did not want to risk her life. She means the world to me. Sounds like your girl does too. :)

Instead, when the time was right, I bought my Peyton. Now, I can't imagine loving any other puppy more.

Your next dog does not need to be related to your current dog. For me, the risk of losing my Sophia would just be something I could not stand. Especially if I caused it with breeding her.

Good luck to you. I hope you make a wise decision.

You want to breed your unregistered bitch. How? To another unregistered stud, that's the only way anyone would agree to it. And for money's sake only. Ok, then you have the pups already spoken for, how do you know the new owners don't see dollar signs in their eyes? Or what if one of them gets loose before they are altered? Someone else can keep them and use them as a puppy machine. Like you said, there are plenty of unregistered dogs in rescues and pounds. Why are you adding to them?

You having your baby have a litter makes you a backyard breeder, fact. Do you know how much it will cost you to breed and whelp the litter? Will you get rid of them as soon as you can so you won't "waste" anymore money since you are giving them away for free?

Do you know how uncomfortable you are going to make your baby by forcing her to give birth? Do you know that many first time mothers end up killing their newborns?

You are used to seeing your Poms have c-sections? Why did they have so many c-sections?

You said your baby had a hard start in life, why are you continuing it? Let her be a pet, a princess for the rest of her days. Why not get her spayed now? The sooner you do it, the less likely she will have a chance of getting several types of cancer as well as pyometria.

I got your PM. I think when you first join so many posts get reviewed first before they post. Eventually, the mods do not do that.

I am glad you are thinking about this and asking ppl. I'm also glad you shadowed your mother's breeding. You would be surprised how many ppl post here, dog already pregnant, soon to deliver, looking for a mentor - never saw a birth in their lives and have no $ for C sections or other complications.

It is ultimately your dog and your decision. My concern if I were you were the inability to find a quality stud for my beloved little girl. I'm sure you are quite attached to her after rescuing her from those deplorable conditions. Please let us know what you decide.

What were the deplorable conditions she was rescued from?

I reposted her replay about her coming from someone's backyard w an infection for you.

Nooks I soooo want to answer that...

OP,
Tell your friends to get rescue...there is no reason to breed a dog whom doesn't have full AKC registration.

Are you prepared to have your female die so your friends can have puppies?

Sorry it's harsh but that's the reality of the potential risk in breeding.
Are you emotionally prepared to loose your bitch & or maybe both a litter of pups?

Are you financially prepared for the high medical cost, for your females pregnancy, a CSection, sick pups up to 4, 6, 8 sick pups?



Her toy is not a puppy, adopt a puppy from a reputable breeder who has their bitches CHIC OFA (CERF) certified, knows their pedigree, and knows how to match, care for a pregnant female & whelp pups. Someone who can afford the high cost of breeding and thus you can pick a pup that looks just like your female.
Especially someone like you who has already opened their heart to rescue, you should consider doing another Yorkie in a bad situation a loving home with you too.

You want to answer what type of deplorable conditions my dog came from?
I hope you're not implying in any sense that she's in deplorable conditions now. I've taken every word of advice on whether or not to breed her to heart.


I hadn't really thought about the possibility of Tashi dying during labor. I'm not sure why, I realize it is a possibility now, and it does make me question the entire thing. My mom never lost a mother in birth, then again, at the slightest sign of complications, my mom took them to the vet.

As for being financially capable of covering any complications, yes, I am. I was not in the past, which is why I never even considered breeding her.

If I were to breed her though, it wouldn't be for my friends. I think I may have not been clear on that. It would be so that I could have another dog related to her. I was just stating that the puppies I didn't keep wouldn't be sold for profit or placed in unfit homes.

I understand you wanting a baby from your baby. I bet you imagine she will have the same sweet disposition, the same gorgeous brown eyes, that little cute swing in her step that your current pup has. With such a nice image in your head, who wouldn't want to breed? I would! But, let's get back to reality for a second. Let's say your dog has a litter of 4. You keep one, and your 3 friends each get one. They sign agreeing, and swearing they'll neuter/spay their dogs. Time goes on...

All the puppies develop the cute features that make your baby unique. Your friends all fall in love with their dogs, and just can't bear it. They want their dog to have puppies too. Without your consent they breed, just the once. They do the same thing you did. They swear they're doing it just the one time, and just so they have one pup from their current dog. Same thing happens, and history repeats itself.

The dog you currently have is an unregistered dog. Meaning, someone with a registered dog that did not have breeding rights bred their dog just to have a puppy. The story continued and your dog came to be. I have just one question, when does the cycle stop?

Before joining YT, I would have done what you wanted to do in a heartbeat. When my dog came home, he was unaltered at 12 months. I did not have breeding rights on his registration, but there was nothing in my way if I wanted to breed him. Really, what are papers when all I want is the one cute puppy? After becoming friends with many of those that rescue on YT, I decided the cycle ended with me. Kaji was neutered on the 4th day he was home.

Just food for thought.

Oh and we lived in the OC too for a short while. :p I was living in Irvine when I got Kaji. I so miss living out there.

Just to give you something else to think about.... The stud fee if you are able to find one, wii probably be between $500-$1000. Then vet fees for testing as well as visits for mom after the breeding and then follow up visits after the delivery, visits for the pup or puppies after they are born & for the first 2 sets of shots (at least) all of which will probably cost at least another $500. Then add in you whelping supplies - at least another $200 if you go the cheap route, Now you are at somewhere between $1200-$2000 and that is with no complications. Add in a c-section and it will probably run between $1000-$2000. I don't know your work schedule, but you should also plan to miss a week or two of work, at least and remember that it's like have a newborn, you need to be up every few hours checking on things. Since you are planning to give any additional puppies away, this means that your one puppy could cost as much as $4000+ and that is for an unregistered puppy. Breeding yorkies can be very rewarding if you go about it the right way but it's not inexpensive especially when you do it right. Personally, I would not breed an unregistered dog but you have to make your own decision. Just be sure to do plenty of research and make sure that you are well prepared....

This puts it into perspective as far as costs. If I did things, even the right way (ie testing, etc) on an unregistered pup, and it costing me about $4000, I think I would just buy a puppy from a respected show breeder for much less than that and I would know how the pup's temperament and look would be like for the most part.

Thanks guys. I appreciate your responses. I have decided not to breed her. It's not the cost that got to me so much as the thought that what I do could perpetuate, and as someone who's worked a lot with rescues, I would hate to think that something created by my beautiful little girl could eventually be a baby-making-machine. And I spent all day thinking about how much I would miss her if she weren't to survive childbirth.

When she ate chicken bones and I had to rush her to the vet I almost lost my mind. I can't imagine staring at her for 2 or so months, every day, trying to figure out if her pregnancy was ok. I could do it with my mom's Pomeranians, but like you guys said, she's -my- baby. I don't think be able to forgive myself if anything were to happen to her.

I'll probably just start looking for a baby for her to "raise" after 12 weeks or so. I'm pretty sure she would take to them as though they were her own. She loooooves kittens :D

Which leads me to another question (sorry >.<) Her color is kind of a bonkers color, and I'm -sure- it isnt to standard, but do you know of anyone who has/breeds pups in any way similar to her color or if theres a word for it or anything? I think she kinda looks like a little German Shepherd :P When I do buy a puppy, it'll probably be 6 months from now or so, but I might as well start researching :)
(she looks sad, i promise you she is just irritated with me for giving her a horn)
http://i.imgur.com/OCoYP.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/aImpb.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/CDPiY.jpg

And!! Here's her X-Ray photo in case anyone is curious what chicken bones in a tummy look like :P

http://i.imgur.com/99iR5.png

I really appreciate you talking to me about this and making me look at it sensibly. It might have turned out ok, but then again, the "what if" is a pretty huge one.

Thanks, I lurk a lot , and haven't posted much, but I really appreciate you and this forum.

So glad you took all the advise to heart. That is what makes this forum work...people seeking information, getting it, and then putting it to use! :thumbup:

I hope you have good luck finding a really good reputable breeder. I believe the saying I've heard here on YT a lot...you buy the breeder first, then the puppy.

Best wishes to you and your sweet girl!

She's adorable!!!! She looks a lot like my Kaji, black saddle and a few blond streaks through the face? My 3 year old boy looks like that too. I'm sure even reputable breeders get throwbacks and have darker puppies sometimes. Just be patient. :) She's lucky to have you. Not everyone puts their pup before their own personal desires.

My BF's altered female had been altered as a pup, she was about 8 years old when I got my female puppy and she took her in like not only did she know she was a puppy but she treated her like her own pup.

We were so amazed because we okay me, I literally was scared his dog would eat my puppy...no in fact she just taught her every dirty trick and bad habit she knew!

Yes, there is also the thought even if you give the pups to great homes, who's to say even between friends differing ideals, moral won't end up with a pup you created from your dog being given to another sub-par home, going to a shelter or being used to have litters also perpetuating the problem, not to mention just taking away a great home to a rescue already in existence needing a home.

Nookie (LOL Noonie, does rescue and could probably turn you on to quite a few recourse to finding a pup if you go that route)

I was *just* gonna say her coloring reminded me of Kaji (dvlshangel's pup), also one of my current fosters Smokey is still really dark too and he's 5 yrs old. sometimes they just stay dark. She is really cute, and I really like the "horn" we do that with Uni a lot too.

I am really glad that you asked for advice and did the right thing. Many times people come on here "asking" for advice, but really they were looking for support for something they had already decided to do. In the end, I really am happy that you are going to just spoil your pretty baby as a princess for the rest of her life.

Nowadays, since so many are down in this economy, a lot of families have to surrender their pups, such as Chloe and Smokey I am fostering now. There are healthy, happy, well adjusted pups in rescue right now, and even some young pups available.

My Gidget stayed dark also. She never quite cleared. I think it's cute.

I wish you well in finding a breeder. You might want to check the Yorkshire Terrier Club of America's website for their breeder referral page. They have breeders who agree to a code of ethics listed from different states/areas. I got mine from one in my area. Of course, they never will be "show quality" but I think they are adorable.

Your little girl is very cute! :)

Thanks everyone :D I think I will try to find a breeder I adore first and then cross my fingers that she gets on off-coloured dog and wait :D I'll look in my area, but I'm also fine with flying in and flying my baby back under my seat. I fly with tashi quite a bit.

I saw one of Patti's baby that I really like the colour (http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/pic...ictureid=88685) and also Tazzi's color is so amazing. I'll probably just watch the forums here and see if I can't find someone I fall in love with ^_^

Thanks guys, you really are great.

Gidget is absolutely beautiful!!

Careful looking at dog's for sale on YT just because a breeder sells on Yorkie Talk it by no means implies they are reputable in the least-in fact it has been discovered some pup mills are advertising on here as well.

Us the threads to get to know people and see who's actually who and the breeders of reputation they will refer you to in your area.

I refereed you to Capt. Nookie (LOL) because she's closer to you than many of the other people here.