inbreeding
 

is it ok to mate brother and sister from the same litter?

I am not a breeder or close, but don't think it is okay.

NO :thumbdown

NO!!!!! I am not a breeder but i know that this is not a good idea.

Go to amazon.com and order Anne Seranne's book, The Joy of Breeding Your Own Show Dog. It explains inbreeding and when it is a good idea and when it is not.

Inbreeding is used to strengthen a trait in a particular pup you're trying to produce. Dams and sires that have the same recessive gene shouldn't be breed because you'd be producing pups with the recessive gene.

The book explains it really well and is a great investment if you're really wanting to know about breeding.

Lisa

inbreeding
 

Thanks to all for your answers

article
 

Article in the lastest Yorkshire Terrier Magazine...

"Inbreeding was once a valuable tool in shaping today's breed. As these have now reached a high degree of homogeneity, it has lost its importance and turned into a fatal and disastrous habit"...

This is an excellent article and would recommend any breeder write for a copy of this months issue..

Pat:

Thanks for the heads up on the article!

Lisa

I'm not a breeder either but I was got into a heated thread about this subject as it applied to horses and there were a lot of hurt feelings. I don't think it is a good thing.

Never !!! Never !!! Never !!!
:thumbs_do :angry: :thumbs_do :angry:


If you want serious problems this is how.

ewwwww, gross! i would think NOT! :eek:

Father And Daughter?
 

Is it ok to breed father and daughter? My parents use to have springer spaniels and we use to breed the mother and son. I have a male yorkie and I want to breed him to get another baby girl. I'm unsure if I am even going to breed them after I get another one. All I want is two. I am probably going to have Caesar fixed after I breed him once. I have been told that he is the perfect male to breed, and not to have him fixed, but I don't want him to start spraying. He is 3.3 lbs. fully grown at 9 months old. But back to my question....Is it ok to breed father and daughter?

NO! Father to daughter and mother to son but NOT brother/sister!

A brother to sister breeding is true inbreeding.

It reduces the number of individuals who contribute to the litter's genetic make up by 50%.

It is a breeding strategy that has been used successfully in the past to imprint "type" or a certain look, etc. in a line. It brings the very best traits as well as the very worst traits to the phenotype where we can see them.

This is not a wise breeding strategy for the novice or small hobby breeder.

JMHO

CJ

Hi, Pat:

I read that article, but that's not what I took away. Dam!!! Now I'll have to go find it again.

CJ

Brother and sister never. I have always heard its ok to use the Grandpa and some times the father. But I wouldnt.

article
 

The article is titled.."The Downside of Inbreeding"...It's Time For A New Approach"...
It starts with the quote I posted in my first post and ends with this quote...

"Inbreeding gave us the many breeds of dogs we enjoy today, but its time is past. If purebred dogs are to remain viable into the next century, breeders need to rethink their strategy and work toward their goals with more emphasis on over-all health and concerted efforts to reduce the level of inbreeding in their dogs.." granted the above sentence is a mouth full and should perhaps be two..but that it is anti-inbreeding, yes, no??

One thing I found interesting is the part about wild animals..."Nature goes to great lengths to discourage inbreeding. Related animals rarely mate, which prevents genes for diseases and defects from coming together with any great frequency. Wild animals have a variety of behaviors which will eliminate or severely restrict inbreeding....

Another quote..."A common result of inbreeding is "inbreeding depression", typified by small litter size and difficulty producing or rearing young....

Anne Serane
 

As to Anne Seranne and many other show breeders..and I include myself as I have inbred...the time has past. Inbreeding was quite common and necessary to set type some years ago..but I think with all the genetic problems, we as breeders need to rethink our breeding programs as the article states.

Some of the older books still hold true to this day..but I have read a few things in Ethel Mundays books that is just no longer true or done..no different then many books written decades ago.

Pat I read the same article, what confuses me is days gone by it was a norm and many many breeders continue doing it today.

What just woke them up?
What made them question what has been done for so many years? How can a breeder successfully create and solidify a look without it?

I have never inbred or line bred but I cant say I would never JMHO

article
 

In the beginning breeders bred "Like to Like"...then came "inbreeding" to set a type. A type can be set by going back to breeding "like to like"...we have to remember the earlier breeders did not allow the weak to survive .Now we try to save them all..and many will go ahead and breed them.

I was talking to a vet last month who knows breeders who have had liver shunts repaired and then bred the dogs. I thought I had heard it all, I guess not.
Modern medicine is saving many,many pups who never stood a chance 25 years ago. Early breeders did not bottle and tube feed..the pups either were strong enough to nurse or died. We have discovered we can save many pups with suppliments..is this good or bad? I feel it is good, but I would not keep one for breeding. JMO
No one tried to repair a cleft or disemboweled pup, same with repaired knees, hernia and livers. Yorkies with open fontenels are regularly used for breeding now..(smalls males).

You can create a solid look with linebreeding and like to like, I see no need to inbreed with so many genetic problems now.
I inbred Rothby and got liver shunt..so I took my Rothby and bred to others who had that look, but unrelated..the type I love is still there, but not the inbreeding.

OK Pat==its going on 2 years now; and I'm still waiting on you to write your book I requested:

Jerry

I know someone who had two yorkies from the same breeder, The breeder said that the dogs were not realted. So she breed them. The bitch had 4 beautiful pups. One died on day 1. The second died on day 2. The third had to be put down because she did not had a rectum. And the fourth survived. The vet said it was probably because they were closely related, So, In my opinion, why take the chance. :confused:

You mixed it..... It's father and daughter, AKC accepts
Sister & Brother is not accepted through AKC. This combination causes serious problems.
This is info I learned years ago not to do.

:) Jerry, I would only need one copy..you are the only one who would buy it! LOL anyway, remember I said what I know would only fill a couple pages..LOL

I am going to ask AKC about BRO/SIS breeding, if they accept it...I have seen this inbreeding on peds. If AKC does not register this breeding, the unreputable breeder can name another stud as sire, they can ask a friend for their studs numbers..DNA means nothing unless it is checked and when is the last time you heard a pet owner paying to find out..rarely?

This has been a superb thread!

Thanks for all the valid information from the breeders that are so valued here.

Lisa

Pat, i would buy your book too, regardless to the amount of pages!

Ok where do I place my order for Pat's up coming book!!!???

Here, here...maybe we should start a campaign. Do you think if we harrass her she'll do it
:luvu:

I'm not a breeder and have no plans to ever breed, but I would like to see a book from Pat just to have her expertise on hand in a pinch!

book
 

Do you guys have any idea how many Yorkie breeders I know would be laughing their butts off to read this thread...LOL