Breeding = money

[Cares4Dogs]

Originally Posted by PrestigeousYT

Yes it is a very expensive venture.
We have a lovely Champion female that never produced the first surviving offspring.
I have a lot of money invested in her show career etc and when it came time for her to whelp, we lost the first litter. We did try again as she delivered naturally.
Second time around CSection and problem with her uterus so we had her spayed as she was our first priority. We lost the pups.
A lot of money and alot of disappointments/heartaches and a lot of work. But a lot of pride and joy on the accomplishments we have made over the years.
Good luck to you

Sounds like you've had the best and worst of both. Glad you we're able to keep on truckin and be proud of your accomplishments.

[phfgkl]

Originally Posted by kelkiss5

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I'll try and keep this short.
I got into breeding myself without any help from anyone. I did my years of research, looked into the breed, all the negatives and positives.
Then I felt I was ready for breeding.
My girls have international and Irish champions in their blood lines, and I am not talking about from centuries ago..
A couple who show yorkies and have had many champions bought 1 of my puppies, and are hoping to show her.

So what I am trying to say is, that you don't necessarily have to be a show person to breed show quality yorkies.
So I think this little BRB (as most would call me) has a lot to be proud of.

And I'll add an honest answer and tell you that yes I have made money from breeding. And I find it hard to believe that nobody else here does!!!!!!!!!1

I'm sure glad I read what you wrote, because, I want to be an excellent breeder, but no intentions of showing. You're not a byb, you're a hobby breeder, and that's all I want to be

[kelkiss5]

Hey thanks, and I am sure that 1 day you will be. If I can do it there is hope for us all .LOL.

[DanielleAllen]

This has given me a lot to think about. I was thinking about breeding at some point.

[scrapindee]

Originally Posted by Cares4Dogs

Thank you, but please dont assume I need a schedule of shows and dont have an expert close by who can help me. I'm here looking for friends and the occasional questions I may have. I've seen a lot of people jumped all over on these forums over assumptions and I dont want the same happening to me. That is however great advice you offer and thank you for posting it.

I know what you are experiencing and I am always happy to talk dogs, biewers, breeding, or potty habits (LOL). Feel free to call me or email me at dee@houseofwags.com

Sometimes it takes getting burned and experiencing the bad. I've bought puppies that were supposed to have AKC papers and didn't; supposed to be 5-6 pounds and were bigger or smaller. I stand by my dogs, and I will be there for the buyers in the future....I try hard to be the breeder I would want to buy from. And it sounds like that is what you want to do or want to be--welcome.

[Sugar's Mom]

Altho i do show some, there are many ethical, reputable breeders that do not show. Either for lack of funds or just not interested so to say an ethical breeder ALWAYS shows is just wrong. Showing is very expensive. A good breeder is always trying to better the breed .

[Micah my love]

Originally Posted by Sugar's Mom

Altho i do show some, there are many ethical, reputable breeders that do not show. Either for lack of funds or just not interested so to say an ethical breeder ALWAYS shows is just wrong. Showing is very expensive. A good breeder is always trying to better the breed .

I totaly agree and you said it so well

Betty & Micah my love

[JJC]

I wish you luck in getting a good quality breeding program going. I'm not a breeder so I don't have any words of wisdom about the subject but I do understand their frustration. It sounds like you have really put thought into this and want to do it the right way. Good for you for trying to go about it the right way.

I'm a photographer and there are "Uncle Joe's" everywhere that think that just because they have a camera they are a professional photographer. Meanwhile I have spent a huge amount of time, money, and effort into learning to do what I do. I've lost jobs to "Uncle Joe" because people see a cheap price tag and don't see the crap quality until it's too late. Then they wish they would have hired a real professional and not gone for the bargain basement price tag. --- Sorry... "Uncle Joe" is a raw nerve right now for me.

[wildcard]

Originally Posted by kelkiss5

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And I'll add an honest answer and tell you that yes I have made money from breeding. And I find it hard to believe that nobody else here does!!!!!!!!!1

You have been lucky then. I don't breed yorkies, but have been breeding papillons for several years now. I think it is very important to show and finish dogs before claiming you can produce show quality. That is the whole point of dog shows, to have your dogs evaluated by people who have studied structure, movement and your breed's standard, and who have been tested on it, before determining whether a dog should be bred. I am not saying that a dog has to be a finished CH in order to be bred, but rather that showing and also observing dogs in the ring bred by others can help to insure that you really are meeting the breed standard, and not just your concept of the standard.

I sat down and came up with having "invested" just over $40,000.00 into our breeding program thus far, including the price of the dogs, leasing bitches, finishing AKC CHs on them, whelping supplies, vet care related to breeding (CERF, Cardio exams, progesterone, 2 ER c sections), and including just one year of routine vet/food/toys/crate/misc for each of our finished dogs. It does not include traveling/entries/expenses for the performance events (which it should as my first show dog is a CH/MACH/UD/RAE which makes his get more desirable to me and others), and it does not include show related expenses or regular routine care for the dogs I am currently showing or are puppies, nor does it include caring for some older dogs that were not able to finish CHs for whatever reason and just did performance work. If you included the costs related to the works in progress or the "flunkies" LOL and then considered all of the dogs routine care over their lifetimes, including my oldest dog who has a heart condition and who has been taking $100 worth of medications on a monthly basis for 7 years now (that is $8100 alone), you are probably looking at closer to double that or more. I also have not included the costs of remodeling our homes and yards to make sure that the dogs have plenty of room and are comfortable, at two houses that were remodeled at probably $7500-$9000 each (fence is expensive!). Also not including the agility or obedience equipment and supplies... and not including the motorhome and its insurance and upkeep (I don't even want to go there!).

Over the last several years, we have produced a grand total of 16 puppies, of which we kept 6 to show. The remainder were placed at a pet price.

Believe me, the costs of this hobby FAR outweigh any income, at least for me. I am not complaining about it, but I want to support the original poster as she is absolutely SPOT ON.

[my2boyz]

Originally Posted by wildcard

Believe me, the costs of this hobby FAR outweigh any income

I agree...but, only when it's done the correct way. I'm just starting with my Biewers and it's not been cheap. I'm holding one boy back who has show potential...we're keeping our fingers crossed!

[Ladymom]

Originally Posted by wildcard

You have been lucky then. I don't breed yorkies, but have been breeding papillons for several years now. I think it is very important to show and finish dogs before claiming you can produce show quality. That is the whole point of dog shows, to have your dogs evaluated by people who have studied structure, movement and your breed's standard, and who have been tested on it, before determining whether a dog should be bred. I am not saying that a dog has to be a finished CH in order to be bred, but rather that showing and also observing dogs in the ring bred by others can help to insure that you really are meeting the breed standard, and not just your concept of the standard.

I sat down and came up with having "invested" just over $40,000.00 into our breeding program thus far, including the price of the dogs, leasing bitches, finishing AKC CHs on them, whelping supplies, vet care related to breeding (CERF, Cardio exams, progesterone, 2 ER c sections), and including just one year of routine vet/food/toys/crate/misc for each of our finished dogs. It does not include traveling/entries/expenses for the performance events (which it should as my first show dog is a CH/MACH/UD/RAE which makes his get more desirable to me and others), and it does not include show related expenses or regular routine care for the dogs I am currently showing or are puppies, nor does it include caring for some older dogs that were not able to finish CHs for whatever reason and just did performance work. If you included the costs related to the works in progress or the "flunkies" LOL and then considered all of the dogs routine care over their lifetimes, including my oldest dog who has a heart condition and who has been taking $100 worth of medications on a monthly basis for 7 years now (that is $8100 alone), you are probably looking at closer to double that or more. I also have not included the costs of remodeling our homes and yards to make sure that the dogs have plenty of room and are comfortable, at two houses that were remodeled at probably $7500-$9000 each (fence is expensive!). Also not including the agility or obedience equipment and supplies... and not including the motorhome and its insurance and upkeep (I don't even want to go there!).

Over the last several years, we have produced a grand total of 16 puppies, of which we kept 6 to show. The remainder were placed at a pet price.

Believe me, the costs of this hobby FAR outweigh any income, at least for me. I am not complaining about it, but I want to support the original poster as she is absolutely SPOT ON.

A dear friend who bred the top Llasos for many years had this to say recently on the same subject:

"If you haven't been into showing, then you probably don't have the necessary knowledge to know the pedigrees and the genetics of the various dogs. Being knowledgable in this area is, imo, key to being a reputable breeder because only that knowledge enables you to select the right 2 dogs to breed together to enhance and better the breed. You need to know what problems, both health issues and confirmation issues, have been thrown by dogs in a particular pedigree. That enables you to learn what to avoid as well as what will enhance when breeding."

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by Cares4Dogs

Over the course of all of this, I have really come to understand why some breeders seem uptight about people breeding their dogs on these forums. Just like marriage, its not something to enter into lightly and I must give a round of applause to those who do it and do it right. Those who step up to the plate and say "are you sure you know what your getting into".....and to get criticised for being the one who just wanted to educate those who are going into breeding blindly.

I thought your whole post was dead on correct, but this part in particular stood out to me. It's always good to know there are people out there who really do "get it."