Breeding Information Wanted
 

Hello,

I'm new to this forum, I have just gotten my first Yorkie puppy. Maverick is a male, should reach around 8-9 pounds. I’m an Animal Science major in college and I’m about to graduate this May. I currently raise horses, so I’m used to staying up all night waiting for babies. I am considering getting into breeding Yorkies. What I am planning to do is to get a female this summer, I’m hoping for something at least 6 months old or older, then she will be the same age as my current puppy or a little older. Then I’m planning on breeding one litter when she comes of age, and if things go well and I enjoy it I will try to buy a few more females. If it doesn't work out the pair will be spayed/neutered and still be my pets.

I haven’t been able to find any Yorkie specific dog breeding books. Does anyone have any references or links? Or even a book on just breeding toy dogs? I’m starting my research early to make certain that I know what I’m getting into. I would want to breed the larger sized Yorkies, around 6+ pounds. It seems like there is so much health trouble with the smaller ones and lots of heartache in loosing the smaller puppies. What my plans would eventually be if things went well would be to keep the breeding quality female puppies that I had, and then eventually buy a new male to use as a stud, smaller around 5 or 6 pounds.

I have a few Yorkie specific questions that I haven’t been able to find answers to, if anyone here has any experience and could help I’ll list some of them.

How long after whelping does a female generally come back into heat? Is it ethical to breed on the first heat after pups? A female horse comes in about 7 days after foaling, and carries the foal for about 11 months, so they are usually bred once a year for one foal a year. How many litters per year can a female Yorkie have without running them down and affecting their health?

What size litters is the average for a larger female? Are there less birthing problems with a larger female? I’ve heard that a female under 5 pounds probably shouldn’t be bred. If you have a larger (8 or 9 pound) female and a male about the same size will the pups be about the size of the parents? Does a large female with a smaller male give some of the smaller Yorkies but still allow for a healthy litter, or are some of them the tiny ones? How much does the large size affect the price? Is there still a good market for the larger pups?


Thank you.

Whitney

Breeding
 

Your male will be over the standard size for breeding. You will need to have an oversized female and from those parents you will get even larger pups. Many breeders are not interested in the standard, but that is what makes the Yorkie a Yorkie. If you do not follow the standard you might as well breed mixes. Five to six pounders are what 50% of the people want who contact me..50% want smaller, around 3 to 4 pounds...about once or twice a year I get an inquiry for a larger pup.

Average litter size is 3-4 pups. Thats a great size, one of my females had 6 puppies, too big a litter! One died, one is being supplemented.
I have two large females, 9 and 10 lbs, but I bred them to an alot smaller dog to try to bring them to standard ( he needed a small step stool)
Im afraid if you bred your larger male to a smaller female you may have some problems.....such as the need for c sec. MOst people do want a yorkie between 4-5lbs also..........I think some have been told thats what they most likely are getting and have recieved a much bigger adult weight.........they love their baby but thats not what they originally wanted. If you bred to a bigger female you are most likely gonna get bigger pups and they are harder to sell.
My advice would get a small male or get a nice female and find a small male to breed to in your area. You will probably end up with some small, some larger.
Most dogs come in 6 months after the beginning of their first heat, with or without puppies. I do have one dog who comes in 6 months after her puppies are born.
If I have a female who is in very good shape I do two litters then one heat off.....but every other is best. Gives the female time to recoop, overbreeding cause alot of problems.
Hope this helps some, Im sure someone can add more or have different views.

So you guys are saying that if say the male and female are are 8 lbs, the puppie will be bigger than that? (Sorry just curious)

No Im not saying that.........I was just saying a bigger male to a smaller female COULD lead to problems.
I think Pat was saying (correct me if Im wrong pat!) that since the male is large, routinely you would need a bigger female to breed to him (to try to avoid to large of puppies and possible problems)
Most breeders breed a smaller male to a bigger female.

Hello,

So YorkieRose and luvdorkyyorkies, what are good sizes for a male and female to use?

I wouldn't use my larger male on a female that was smaller than him for fear of birthing problems.

Thank you.

Whitney

size
 

Breeding two 8 pounders does not guarantee you will only get pups in the 8 pound range..same as with two 5 pounders. You have to look at the bloodline and see what size is behind them also. I had a small girl at 4 pounds who was a free whelper..gave me 3 litters of 4 pups each..but Candy's sire and dam were twice her size. I was a new breeder and could not figure out why, when bred to my 5 pound stud Candy would have 6 to 9 pound pups at adulthood.
I had a 6 3/4 pound male champion who had a both a 4 pound sire and dam...he sired mostly 5 pounds and under his entire breeding career..it is tricky. Most often when a Yorkie is 8 or 9 pound they are from a line of bigger dogs and you can get pups over 10 pounds quite often.

Right now I use a 3 pound sire with my girls in the 5 to 7 pound range. I will use a 5 to 6 pound male with them on occasion...I am not opposed to breeding a female over the standard size..you can reduce the adult size by using a smaller male, but I have not seen it work very well in reverse. You would need to use a 4 pound bitch with an 8 pound male and that is very risky. I don't advocate breeding females under 5 pounds for the most part.
The bigger the bitch, the bigger the litteris not true. I recently had a stud client who has a 5 pound female delivery 7 pups...one died. I have had 7 pounders produce one or two...dog breeding is not a science, it is an art..and Mother Nature sure is hard to predict.

Right on Sister! It sure is hard to predict!
My 10 lb female is a "throw back" she came from a line of small dogs and her mother was 6 lbs daddy was 4! She was the biggest dog ever produced per her breeder in the history of the mother and father.(Ibought her at 8 m)
So only time will tell what her litter will be because I dont know her litter history because this is her first litter. Truth is I wont know a whole lot until 1 yr really as far as im concerned. Im a new breeder too and have a lot to learn, truth is I think yorkies are a tricky breed and even experienced breeders learn something new often...
Thanks Pat for the info.

learning
 

I have bred for 30 plus years and I am still learning..just when I get close to learning all I need to know, they change the rules..LOL

Hello,

Thank you both for the help. So the larger females are fine to use with breeding, but I would want to look for a smaller male, around the 3-4 pound range?

Are there any good books or links on breeding toy dogs? It will be a while before I try my first litter, but I want to try and do all the research that I can.

Thanks,

Whitney

size
 

Depends on how large. Weight is not that important to me..the frame is what I like to look at..frame should be in proportion to weight. I had a 8 pound champion female and she looked wonderful..not oversized at all. I like a balanced dog..9 pounds on an compact 7 or 8 pound frame can look good...9 pounds on a long, lanky frame can look like a small pony. We all have our preferrences and I perfer a bitch from 5 to 7 pounds..but would never say no to a quality 8 pounder..quality and pedigree come first, size comes after, unless it is a tiny.

I have two books I used...I will look in some boxes..just moved to FLorida..I can not remember the exact title and authors...you will find very little about breeding Yorkies as a breed...you will find alot about history and care...there is only so much you can learn from a book..it is like a doctor reading about surgery, they need to actually cut to be a surgeon...you need a mentor! LOL

Book
 

The Standard Book of Dog Breeding....By Dr. Alvin Grossman. This book was recommended by the Yorkie Magazine a few years back..good book. I can't find the other just yet..it is more into the actual breeding, pregnancy,whelping, puppy care..As I recall it is called "Canine Reproduction.

Hi,

I'm hoping to get in contact with a local vet who deals with a lot of the small dogs, or preferably lots of Yorkies. I think that talking with them would help, and maybe they could put in contact with an experienced breeder. Plus give me an idea of the costs if a C-section or other emergency procedure would be required.

Thank you for the info on the books. I just moved about a year ago, and I still have a spare bedroom and shop with boxes in it. I just moved about 45 miles, I would hate to move further!

Thanks for all the help, I'm sure that I will be back later with more questions!

Whitney

fees
 

Vet fees depend on the area you live. I have talked to breeders in the Midwest who pay $40 for a c-section..honestly!!! In Maryland I had a long time vet who charged me $350/450 tops..but the ER started at $1400. I never had to go there, but a friend did and it was $1800. The most I have heard is $2200 in NY. Most breeders learn to do as many things as they can..not only for save money but to prevent taking pusp into a clinic full of sick dogs. My vet taught me to dock tails and give shots when Parvo surfaced some years back..we stayed away from places with dogs period..even stopped showing for a year until they found a vaccine.
Ask about fees, most vets have a price list..I tell new breeders to start a bank account for dogs only. Breeding has become very costly and many pet breeders can not afford it..that leaves the puppy millers and show breeders..the dog world needs caring, pet breeders who breed quality pups..that statement got me thrown off a show forum 3 years ago! LOL

Hi,

I live in Southwest Missouri, and vet fees are generally pretty cheap. I can usually get a vet to come out on an emergency trip to my farm for a sick horse for under $200. And they drive and show up at your place, sometimes on a weekend for those prices, plus the actual treatment.

I can give shots for vaccinations, but I don't know about docking the tails. Does it hurt them when it is done young? I gave my pup his puppy vaccine and he whined and was a pretty big baby. I'm having a vet do it next time so that I don't have to put up with him looking at me like I'm mean. LOL. Plus I want to get him weighed with a good scale, it's his 12 week shot that is due. That is something I hadn't thought of on taking the little puppies to a vet clinic with sick dogs.

My college education is in horses, there wasn't anything available for dogs. So I have a good understanding of things like the estrous cycle and horse genetics, just not specifically for dogs.

I think that I could do a good job with raising the puppies. I read so many horror stories about puppy mills and people getting sick puppies, and I know that I could give them lots of love and care. I think what I would want to do would be to start small with a few females, and then if things go well maybe dabble in showing.

pups
 

Tail docking is a debatable subject. I know cutting/stitching is painful..mine screamed and it was a bloody mess. I learned the English method of clamp and twist..the pup has very little reaction and there is no blood lost at all. Using a rubber band is painful also.
Vet fees are no doubt reasonable in your area, but puppy prices are also lower..it evens out.

WhitneyM- Hey i was just curious where you lived, I go to Pitt State. There are a few breeders that live around here I could give you there phone numbers or e-mail addresses, to possibly get info from them. If you want this information just PM me okay.

I went to my vet and he taught me to dock tails and remove dewclaws......in fact he encourage me to do it myself instead of bringing them out and exposing the pups.
Truth is I hate this part of breeding!! I will never ever get used to it! Why cant they be born with short tails?............lol Be as sterile as possible, or very clean about it. Have a vet show you with your first litter.
Nothing pretty about this procedure. I found docking their tails at 2 days is better then 6 days. They seem to feel more later. Yes They do feel it for sure.
C secs here in Illinois for me run 150 to 200, as of yet (knock on wood) no need for the service.
THe english meothod? They dont react? Gotta know how its done, I hate the reaction I get! WIth the cut method.

I know this is highly ignorant, but why do their tails need to be docked?? Is it necessary even if you arent going to show the dog?? And what about the dew claws? :eek:

tail-dewclaw
 

tail docking is a tradition show of the breed standard in the US and Great Britain.

The dew claws are removed for sanitary and safety. That back nail if not removed can catch on things indoors and out and get caught up, get infected or even worse get ripped off.

Please spay your male as he is above standad. REsponsible breeders AT LEAST breed for the standard york. A 8-9 pound male is definatley not standard and would require a larger female to breed with. Way off. =)

The English method----please explain---no litters to date. To be honest I just want to know if I can handle it. And HOW do you remove dew claws? My Lexi is 4.8 pounds and I just bought a male out of a line of 3-4 pounders so I am hoping he will be smaller. I will breed but probably her 3rd heat. I'm just taking in a lot of info right now. My vet will DEFINATLEY do these the first time but IF I can handle it, I might try.

declaws
 

Lexi's mom..why not let the vet do it the first few times until you find your sea legs. You will be stressed out with the whelping..best wishes

Hello,
I was wondering if any of you sell dogs for breeding purposes....
I'm having alot of trouble in my area finding someone without a breeding contract.

Can someone give me some info?

Thanks

Oh, trust me. I will. I just thought hearing the details may stamper my interest in trying it alone. If I do it i will probably be at the vet's in case I can't handle it. I'm a big softy. =)

MgM- Don't just breed. Do research first, look at pedigrees then think about it beofre just buying 2 dogs and breeding them. I HATE THAT! I am buying from a breeder in Texas with full- breeding rights for 1240 but they won't just sell to anybody. If I refered you--they'd be so mad at me. If you e-mail me with your intentions I may but please research this first. These are man made dogs and sometimes you run into a jam with the delivery or other things. I would be happy to help my e-mail is lovefor3yorkies@aol.com. I will try to answer any questions you have. =)

my intentions are to care for a yorkie but not be limited to just that since they are sooo expensive.... i would not mix breeds, and not just intending on whipping 2 dogs together(yorkies) just to make some dough..
But later on, who knows, i may want to try to breed and with a contract against it they would penalize me and + they would not be recognized as purebread in canada due to the breach of contract.
At this moment I am still researching them, I'll email you when im fully informed.

by the way,
Thanks
(people here are pretty friendly)

Fair enough. =) Just shoot me a private e-mail when you feel you're ready. The males are 1240 which includes shipping and the females are 1500 includes shipping also. These puppies will be between 2-5 pounds.

So thats means just different blood lines, correct?
Im still a noobie so any help is greatly appreciated.

NO--You need different "good" bloodlines. Also genetics plays a big role. Your pups will need to be tested for many different things in order to be a respectable breeder at least. The most important I feel being prtalsystemic shunt (liver shut). Line-breeder is sometimes a good thing but too much is bad. Just depends on the lines. There's a lot more invloved than people are aware of. And when you don't do all the necessary stuff you take big chances. You need a contract and an adoption process that potential buyers must go through. This is very important if you care about the dogs and their offspring--you should never put a pup on this earth and not know where it is! IMO