Homecookers- can I have your opinion
 

Ok- Layla's vet thinks she has an iodine deficiency which is why she isn't loosing weight (I personally don't agree- i mean she may have low iodine but I think she isn't loosing weight because we have been giving her a lot of treats and not a lot of walks- so working on that. Also iodine deficiency usually results in a lack of energy- well that is not Layla! )

So- right now I use animalessentials multivitamin which does not have iodine in it- so fair assessment that she might be lacking. I've been looking up iodine and dogs and what not and from what I can see she needs about 1/4 tsp of salt per 18 cups of food that she eats- so roughly a little less than 1/4 tsp of salt per week.

Her vet wants us to buy a new supplement (from a dog nutritionist that she knows), which i assume contains iodine. It's like 40 bucks (again- no price is too high for Lay- but we did just drop around $1000 on her ultrasound and tests) and I think I have a very good supplement here- that I have been giving Layla for over a year.

Can I not just add the salt to her weekly diet? I know that there are some foods that are high in iodine- salmon ect.

Anyways- I know Layla's vet a) wants the best for her but b) really likes her nutritionist and probably is trying to push her products. My vet knows very little about home cooking and probably that is why she didn't just say- add salt.

Arg- i'm blabbering- can I just add the salt in the amount I know she needs and continue on with the supplement we use?

This is just IMO because I've never heard of a dog having an iodine deficiency until I read your post and looked it up. :)

Do you have the name of what the vet wants you to use?
Does the supplement that you are using contain salt/sodium? No, if I read your post right? It looks like she needs .7mg of iodine per pound of food if my source is accurate.

I don't think your vet is just wanting to use her nutritionist. I think she may be honestly concerned because to just tell the owner to start adding salt could leave room for error. So I would either do what the vet wants or if you really trust your nutritionist, talk to her about the exact amount of salt that should be added.

Out of curiosity though, how did they check for this? Was it is specialized blood panel? How is her thyroid?

Crystal I was hoping you'd see this :)

the vet wants me to use this:

HILARY'S BLEND supplement for home-made meals

but I can't find a list of ingredients- however it is meant for home cooking- which the one I am using is too.

She did not check for this- she sees that Layla has not lost weight (but again- we weren't actively working on that *embarrassed*), her nutritionist said Layla's diet was lacking iodine- she put two and two together and that is what she arrived at.

So you think i should just go with this new supplement?

Can I not weigh out .7mg of salt per pound of food?

crystal- would iodine be listed AS iodine on the list of ingredients or is it called something else?

Well, I don't think it's that easy because you'd be giving her .7mg of salt, not .7mg of iodine since iodine is added to salt. Does that make sense? This is why I just hand all of these things over to Ellie's nutritionist because she has the program (and knowledge) to figure it out. I would be too afraid of making calculation errors.

I wouldn't rush into using the other supplement too quickly just because I have never heard of it. But it would concern me that a nutritionist has calculated all of this and found a lack of something.

But really just because it lacks iodine, I don't think it's that easy to say that she is overweight because of it. And if there has been an iodine deficiency and the vet is concerned about her weight because of it, then IMO she should be checking for thyroid problems.

Ellie's supplement lists it as iodine, but if yours lists ingredeints instead of the breakdown of nutrients, then I'd think it could be under salt or sodium, but maybe I'm really missing something here.

I agree with Crystal. I'd trust your vet. Homecooking is tricky which is why it is important to get frequent bloodwork done to make sure all the nutritional needs are being met. I would also be curious how he detected the iodine deficiency, though.

Are you following a recipe prepared by a nutritionist? Are you adding any other supplements besides the AE Multivitamin? I homecook and use the AE vitamin, but I also have a whole list of other supplements I have to add.

Kelp is an excellent source of iodine.

There's a little on page 9 about iodine needs in a dog:

http://dels.nas.edu/dels/rpt_briefs/...tion_final.pdf

SO- if you wouldn't rush to use the other supplement- what should i use? I am supposed to go to the vet this afternoon to pick some stuff up.....

And the supplement is Canadian- maybe that's why you haven't heard of it?

I am using a recipe provided by a nutritionist- I use the AE mutltivitamin and a calcium that is meant for home cooking.

I have kelp here at home- i used to make my own supplement (dr. pitcairn) but when Layla started having her pancreas issues- i switched over to the one that she recommended

How much kelp do you add?

Lady can't have kelp since she is on thyroid medication.

Did Susan Davis prepare your recipe? Can you call her (or whomever prepared it), fax the bloodwork results and get her to tweak it if she thinks it is necessary?

Was a thyroid panel done?

No thyroid panel was done- my vet is "speculating" and again, i think she is wrong- and i'm dreading that when Layla looses weight because we are exercising her and lowering her treat intake- her vet is going to think it is because we started adding iodine. but whatever- as long as she is healthy.

I can email Susan (yes she did it) and see what she thinks.

I would talk to your own nutritionist if you aren't comfortable with your vet's.
It's a supplement that I would look into, but I don't know a thing about it, so I can't say I'd use it. Yes, I don't know about Canadian things except that I want to go 5 Pinning. lol.

LOL 5 pinning- that is so funny- i did not know it was a Canadian thing :p I've only done it a handful of times

I am so overwhelmed.. .lol

It isn't that I don't trust my vet's nutritionist- i'm sure she is GREAT- it's just the conflicting info that is making my head spin.....

I think I might go with her supplement- it is formulated with recipes which the vet is giving me for free..... It is worth a shot- and i can get my money back if i don't like it.... it just seems like the most reliable to ensure she is getting what she needs.

Honestly, I'll tell you what I would do. I would make both nutritionists tell you how they are formulating their recipes, where they come from, and what organization's supplement guidelines they follow. Do these recipes meet AAFCO or NRC guidelines? If not, why not? Ellie's recipes are formulated to meet AAFCO, but of course no feeding trial was done on them. If they aren't following some type of (proven) system, then they are out there with their own ideas which is really scary. lol

And I have never seen a place to 5 Pin in the US. I'll have to check Port Huron, but I think it's a CA thing.

Well, now I am confused....wouldn't be the first time!

Are you following a recipe prepared by Susan Davis or the recipes your vet is giving you for free?

Crystal, do you think the Hillary supplement might be similar to Balance It?

If it were me, I would follow Susan Davis' advice. Vets only get about four credit hours of nutrition in vet school. Ms. Davis is far more knowledgeable.

I can't imagine why your vet is just speculating and not recommending a thyroid panel, though.

lol you are confused- i am VERY confused... lol

RIGHT NOW i am following Susan. Our vet showed Layla'd diet to a Canadian nutritionist who said- she is lacking iodine- which it looks like she is- JUST by looking at the supplement. her nutritionist has very high credentials- i just didn't know she existed- or i probably would have gone to her first.

Layla's vet wants to see if adding iodine to her diet will help her loose weight-before doing a thyroid panel.

i do NOT know what Susan bases her diets on but i do know that this new girl is AAFCO guidelines.

Okay, I think I've got it now!

I agree with you, though. A $40 supplement does seem extreme when iodine is the only thing the AE multivitamin is missing. Animal Essentials is such a well known and highly regarded supplement, I'd hate to substitute an unknown for it. Besides, Layla may be getting all the iodine she needs in her food. Fish, eggs and yogurt all contain iodine. Lady's recipe contains both fish and eggs and she gets yogurt everyday. I have to add a salt substitute to her recipe and she gets AE vitamins, so there is no added iodine in her diet. Her bloodwork is perfect. She has a thyroid condition she takes medication for, but that started long before I switched to homecooking.

I agree with your original question.....why can't you just add iodized salt? That's what commercial dog foods do.

I'm curious to hear what Susan Davis has to say.

I found a self test for iodine. Might be worth trying.

How to Self-Test for an Iodine Deficiency

1. Dip a cotton ball into USP Tincture of Iodine. (You can get iodine at the drugstore for under $1.)

2. Paint a 2 inch circle of iodine on your soft skin, like the inner part of your thigh or upper arm.

3. Wait. -- If the yellowish stain disappears in less than an hour; it means your body is lacking crucial iodine and has soaked it up. If the stain remains for more than four hours, you iodine levels are fine.

How to Self-Test for an Iodine Deficiency

This would be my deciding factor personally. If Susan uses a proven system, great, let her decide on the iodine issue. If not, then I'd switch, but that's me. :) I would want to see a lsit of ingredients in this other supplement though.

It says on the website that one bottle will last a month for a 40 pound dog, so maybe it won't be that expensive to use for a little Yorkie.

It used to be called The Balancer according to the website, so it must be similar to Balance It.

I still don't get the fact that your vet is speculating on an iodine deficiency with no testing/thyroid panel. A thyroid panel isn't much more expensive than that first bottle of supplement. He seems to be putting the cart before the horse IMO.

I agree with you, that too many treats are more likely the cause of Layla's weight issue. The same thing happened to Lady when I first adopted her. A regular sized treat for a toy breed is practically a whole meal. I really had to learn proper portions for an eight pound dog.

I couldn't help noticing your post as I have been considering home cooking route and came across it. It appears that the Hillary supplement is a proprietary (ie. secret) recipe according to the website. Therefore, I do not think you will be given the specific makeup of the supplement. It further states on the website that it is intended to be used WITH HER specific recipes and only then the nutritional needs of the dog are met. As someone already posted, salt (ie. Na+ aka sodium) is not the same as iodine and not all salt is iodized. You may not want to add extra sodium as it can compromise electrolyte balance which affects kidney and cardiac function also. If you have a supplement and diet you like, I would ask your nutritionist how to incorporate the iodine needs into her recipes /supplements. JMO.

Ok- so I went to our vet and sat down and looked at a)the ingredients (all are listed on the outside of the jar- if they weren't- i wasn't going to give it to her) and b) the recipes. I think this girl REALLY knows what she is talking about. Next to every recipe (which the vet gave me for free) is an analysis of every vitamin and mineral- and next to that is what the AAFCO recommends- so her recipes are dead on.

The one thing I did not like about Susan was her lack of knoweldge on ratios and what not. When i emailed her about iodine- she wasn't comfortable giving me an answer and watned me to do what my vet said. So for now- that is what we are going to do.

Lady'smom- you are right- the supplement is going to last a LONG time!! hahah.

Her recipes are not that far off from what I was feeding Layla- so i don't have to buy a lot more stuff.

Thanks for ALL your help. I feel very good with what i have decided to do!

Sounds like a good plan. :thumbup:

Sounds good to me.
I have never seen a guaranteed analysis or nutrient breakdown or anything from any of Susan's recipes, so I would not go that route myself. But that's JMO. I only use veterinary nutritionists because I think it's the safest.

Glad to hear you got the information you needed and that this recipe/supplement combo gives the specifics and AAFCO recomendations. Sounds like an informed decision. Best wishes in keeping Layla on a healthy track . :)

at the time- I thought Susan was great- and i STILL do- for some things. But seeing what this nutritionist gave me- i think she is leaps and bounds above Susan. She seems to really know what she is talking about.

I think they are just two different things entirely.
While I would get my recipe and supplements from a vet nutritionist, there can be room to use different ingredients and change it up. If I had a pup with a health issue and didn't know what might sit best on its stomach or something and my nutritionist was more concerned about the vitamin part, then that is something I'd consider asking someone like Susan.

Glad things are working out for Layla :)

And just to throw something else into the Pot :p I found this site and product and wonder what you all think about it?

Cook for Your Dog! - Economical Vitamins & Minerals