Urination Problems (any ideas?)
 

I will recap Ellie's issues for those who don't know and for those who do you could go right to paragraph 2 and read that.:)

Ellie was urinating in places that are unlike her in the spring of 2007 (on the couch...). Urinalysis showed slight infection. She was treated with clavamox. This didn't seem to clear it up and/or it came back. The vet couldn't get a sample this time so she did an xray to look for stones (found none) and put Ellie on Zeniquin. Ellie seemed okay after this but she still seemed to have accidents in places she shouldn't be. A few months later (fall 2007) the problem started getting worse again. The vet did another u/a and urine culture. Everything is fine. Ellie was spayed and was still urinating in places she shouldn't afterwards. The vet asked if I wanted to bring in a sample. I said no.;) They aren't finding anything anyway. She said to get pH strips and test. Her pH is 7.:rolleyes: After her last accident flairup about a month ago, I thought she was fine because it has been about a month since she has peed on the couch, bed... Well, last night she peed on the bed. I was gone so I thought it was separation anxiety (the vet has been saying possibly behavior problems since fall). Then this morning she went outside to pee and then there was also a spot in the living room, so I don't know what is going on.

So my question is, what is the next step if u/a's keep coming back fine and an xray has been done. It is not incontinence because she squats even when she is having an "accident". I know it would be good to do a u/s to look for stones but that is so expensive and I don't think the vet thinks it's necessary. I guess I will have to get her thoughts on this. Anyway, the vet will do any tests I ask her to do, so are there any we should be doing? The vet's next thought is diabetes insipidus but Ellie doesn't drink too much, so she thinks behavioral. I just don't know. Any thoughts?

Hmmmmm, this isn't really my area. But, did the xray comfirm that "structurally" she was okay/normal? Does she go frequently or just normal frequence? If there is frequency and urgency, there's just got to be a reason. If it's not frequent/urgent, then it does appear to be behavior or just that she smells the old spots and wants to go. I wonder if she has some odd sub-clinical infection that doesn't really show up on tests but does cause some symptoms.

Have you tried giving only purified water (vs. tap)? You've probably heard me blab about that nutritionist I've used - Susan - and I checked her page; she does work w/ UTI patients. I'm linking you to the UTI "supplements" page - I don't know if any of these products will "ring a bell" for you, but maybe something could help....? I'm not much of a help here, but I did want to say that I hope you find a solution!

Thank You:) Where is the link?

I don't know about giving her supplements (although it is a possibility) because usually you give one for acidic urine and one for alkaline (depending on your dogs problem). I don't know the problem, so I don't know if I should supplement.:confused:

The xray looked just fine. During Ellie's spay the vet even looked at her bladder and said it is normal. We are all very confused. She has had a couple of blood panels lately and they are normal...:confused: :confused: :confused:

As for frequency and urgency, she usually pees about five times a day (I would say that is very normal). Some days she may go six or possibly (but rarely) seven. Six times a day is too much for her and this happens when she has a lot of moisture (which is fine) or when she goes on the furniture. She had gone maybe three times in three or four hours about two months ago. This happened a couple times. When she goes on the bed, couch... it makes me think she can't hold it. When she pees in the house it is usually in one of two spots and if it's not there I know there's a problem. She has peed in four places that aren't normal for her in the last month. The last two times (last night and this morning) she shouldn't have had to go (especially this morning).

I am glad I'm not the only one who thinks this is strange.

OOPS!!! :D http://www.askariel.com/pages.asp?pid=uti

Ya know, even my Wylie (3 yr old) will pee on the carpet out of nowhere at times. It used to be MUCH worse - so, it's better but it's still frustrating and odd bc he knows how to ask to go outside. So, it IS weird....and frustrating not to know why.

If there are times when she simply just can't hold it, it makes me wonder if one of her urinary sphincters is a bit unsound. When she goes on the bed, is it a normal amount - or like a "oops" amount (like a smaller amount slipped out)?

I couldn't tell you how much but it is more than a few drops. I had thought about this but wouldn't she NOT squat then? I mean, unless she only has a one second warning and no time to get down. She is not really well trained and will go on the floor sometimes but she hadn't started going pee on the furniture (after puppyhood was over) until her first UTI last spring.

I think I would be totally willing to forget it and relax but it concerns me because kidneys are delicate and if something is wrong it has to be treated.:(

Is it possible that because she's had accidents on the couch and bed in the past, she thinks it's ok to go there? I'm certainly no expert, it's just a thought. Maybe she needs to be retrained? Again, grasping at straws here:)

LOL, she needs to be trained, PERIOD. Not retrained.:p

I would say it is possible but I don't understand why she went on the liviing room floor this morning when she had just gone pee outside.

Well, it makes me think of humans who have incontinence issues - where one feels something about to come out, and there is a bit of control (in early/less severe incontinence, that is) - but you "gotta go quick". So she could, theoretically, still have time to quickly squat.

The peeing right after going outside also reminds me of prostate issues and some female urinary issues - where you go, and then, right after, you STILL feel like you have to go. So, then if there is no infection - it does kind of make one wonder if it's structural.

That said, I've had crazy potty training issues (esp. w/ Wylie) and we are actually ripping up our carpet bc of it....so, you're not alone if it turns out to be just behavioral or a training issue. Can you "wall off" all your carpeted areas? We have done that for looooong stretches - it's a pain, but it helps w/ retraining. :D

We pulled the carpet.:rolleyes: :p Yorkies, you gotta love 'em. There is one carpeted room she goes in and rarely pees in it. I have to talk to her vet next week so I will run all of this by her and see if she has any other ideas.

I have similar problems with Roxy. However, she does have anxiety and nervious behaviors so I always seem to blame it on that. First she has the excited pee - which we have really controlled. She also like to mark things ex: everytime I wash the bathroom or kitchen throw rug, Roxy must pee on it. The cycle never ends :mad: - But Roxy will also run to her box to pee a tiny drop when she is under stress. ex: I am leaving (during weekend time).
Roxy also has the cycle of peeing and not peeing. There are a few months when she only pees in her box. Then there are times when she will contantly pee in the box and on all the thorw rugs and even on the tile. Most instances it's only a little bit and she is 'purposly' doing b/c she is in her pee position.

I too have brought in samples and everything is ok. So being that I know Roxy does have some behavioral issues, I have to say that is what it is all about.

I hope you can get to the bottom of it :(

Okay, here is my theory. Roxy, TJ and Ellie are related.:)
TJ might have liver problems but probably not, just like Ellie.
Roxy might have bladder problems but probably not, just like Ellie.
Isn't it Roxy who loves to eat? So does Ellie.

I totally KNEW you'd get to the bottom of it in no time! :D

Btw, what-didja replace your carpet with? We wanted hardwood, but still not sure that's best for dogs - so we may go laminate in one room and then textured concrete in another. Oh my....

Ya know, we might have something here....Mine came from a hell hole called: Brylaur Puppies they are located in Maine :D

It is something called vinyl planking or vinyl-wood planking. It is vinyl (not wood) and comes in strips. It looks like real wood. The only thing is that the strips are peel and stick and that glue doesn't hold really well, so you have to use your own glue also. I like the look and it is so easy to clean (doesn't hold pee smell) but I really can't recommend it because it has the potential to get scratched easily and it seems to dent (from heavy objects). And even with your own glue added, the strips tend to wanna lift. It works well for us though and it is only 98 cents a square foot.

Ellie didn't come from there (well who knows). She came from a "breeder" in Michigan who goes back and forth from Missouri...

Besides urination problems and her liver thing she also is so off standard, has roach back bad enough that it looks painful, is allergic to corn and is sensitive to a couple medications/vaccines. And we won't even talk about her behavioral problems that happen when they leave the "breeder" too early.:rolleyes:

I do love her though. :)

hello,

i have the same problem with my Rocky for a few days now :( i really dont know what is going on, becasue it never happened before. And i must say i didnt think that it may be caused by some health issues..
he urinates at home mostly during night, but this is not a rule. it is quite cold outside so maybe he is sick or something ? i will surely check it with his vet!

and one more think - could you please tell me about this allergy ? unfortunatelly it seems that my Rocky also has some allergy, but i still dont know to what! :( anyway, how does this allergy appear ? my Rocky is caughing and chocking, just like he couldnt take his breath and i am really worried that something may happen to him :( what medicines did your vet prescribed ? my vet gave him some inhalation medicine and he gets shots every 2 weeks..
Thank you!

Yup, it is best to check with your vet anytime urination patterns change, they go in the house or they go on furniture if it is not "normal" for them.

Which allergy are you talking about?:)

Ok, here is my take: I think she is marking. Yes females will mark too. And if she was never 100% housebroken, then she will mark in the house. Even after she has gone outside.

I know that Millie can go for a walk and squat to pee and will squat to pee every few feet shortly thereafter. They will hold some urine in the bladder to mark as they go along. I will take Millie for a 1/2 hour walk and she will not run out of urine until the end of it.

So if there is any residual urine smells on the couch or on the bed, she is just staking a claim on the bed and couch for herself.

You very well may be right. Ellie does mark (I think it's funny that people only think it's males who do it). She does it in pet stores and on walks.

The thing that is odd here is that she is not a furniture pee'er. The first time she did it in years is when she had a UTI. That is why I'm not sure she is doing it on purpose. You are right though. She could just smell what she did before and do it again.

The females are little buggers :D

Yes Roxy is a BIG TIME marker - OUTSIDE - that is ALL she does, over and over and over, then the 'moon walk'.

It's funny b/c I trust TJ 99% that he would not mark in someone else's home. He does full pees inside but on the pee pad. And outside he'll mark a little here and there.

But Roxy - NO ONE - she is 100% UN-TRUSTABLE :(

Case in point: This morning while making their AM meal, I had to run up stairs to get some sinus meds for me. Well, when I came back into the kitchen Roxy pee'd on the her towel placement, where when their food is ready that's where I put their dish down. :mad:

- Also, probably for the past year now, Roxy doesn't go to the pads to pee when she first wakes up - it's so bizzare, she can really hold it in for another 20 mins or so, until finally after forcing her (putting the baby gate up in that room) then she will finally go.

Strange.

Ellie is so bad at the pet store that I have to carry her or she will go. Of course then she scratches to get out of my arms.:rolleyes:

After looking at this thread again I am guessing you are talking about Ellie's corn allergy? If so, read on.:)

She was on a garbage food for a few years (Science Diet). She didn't have any itching problems on it. I pulled it and started homecooking. Then she went on a vet diet and it had corn in it just like the Sci. Diet. She evidently acuired the allergy from eating the Sci Diet for too long because on this new vet food she scratched her ears until they bled. Benadryl didn't work and the vet gave her one shot and we switched foods. Thirty-sixty days later she was almost better. Now she just gets itchy when she gets into corn product.