Lucy's Bile Acid Test Results
 

Lucy got her bile acid test results yesterday and they were slightly elevated. 51 before feeding and 41 after feeding. (That sounds backward). I guess 20 is normal and anything over 100 is considered definitive for a shunt.

Her vet was really not sure. With her issues this week-end, he thinks it is a possibility and next step would be a scintography; I would have to travel to Ohio State.

However, he said he wouldn't be in a great rush to do this unless she has another episode like she had this week-end.

He did not recommend to change her food at this time. Our tentative plan is to keep an eye on her and redo bile acid tests in 30 days and go from there.

She is fine at the moment. I'm very confused as to the right thing to do.

Put her through the test? Or wait the 30 days and re-test. Do her numbers 'jump out' at anyone?

Appreciate any advice. Meanwhile, I'm going to search the boards for all the information I can find . . and give Lucy a hug. She's so sweet; I don't like the thought of her suffering OR that the food I'm feeding her is making her suffer. OR putting her through needless invasive testing. OR waiting too long . . . but maybe her numbers are low enough to not worry.

I just don't know.

I don't know, but I'm going to bump your post so someone with the necessary knowledge perhaps can help you. Good luck to you.

My suggestion is to contact Dr Centers at Cornell University. She developed the BAT tests and familiar with everything LS. She's very helpful and answers phone calls very quickly.....I'm sure she'd want to see the results and would definately help you in making the right decisions......

i would do a phone consult as well with dr centers as the pre is high as my girl had a post first time it was 73 then had pre and post and pre was 3 and post was 54. Then i fed a low protein diet which i recommend you do 18% since your dog had symptoms it sounds like if no symptoms then 22% protein. I feed a 18% protein diet to mine and had her bile acids redone 6 mos later by dr dodds and it was pre 3 and post 26 and 25 and below is normal so the low protein diet helped so i would at least recommend this for now. I opted not to do the scintigraphy with mine only because she had no symptoms. There is another blood test protein c test but have found that not to be very accurate as a dog tested negative with that and had 4 shunts so after that i felt it was not accurate. The scintigraphy is pretty accurate but again there was a yorkie on here Ginger that had scintigraphy done by dr tobias and her bats were high and scintigraphy showed shunt and they opened her up and spay her at same time and no shunt so it can be tricky so I would consult with centers for sure and pay a phone consult fee and have her review the testing.

Keep in mind if the gall bladder contracts at time of blood draws it can throw the test off and why i opted for the second one and then the third 6 mos later

also join this group asap Liver_Shunt_And_MVD_Support@yahoogroups.com as they are very sharp about this disease and i believe tobias' assistant is on the group as well so they will advise as well based on blood work

This is per Dr Center's lastest seminar:

Disregard the normal fasting ranges provided by laboratories: This value is not useful and will only confuse you. Approximately 15% to 20% of dogs have a higher fasting than post-prandial (after meal) bile acid value due to individual differences in the rate of stomach emptying and intestinal motility.

good to know my girl had exact same pre on the two with pre it was 3

Do you think she will do a phone consult with me even though I probably will not be taking Lucy there? Mainly because she is so far away.

If so, I will ask the Vet for a copy of her results.

Also, wonder why the Vet did not recommend diet changes? I specifically asked him about it and he said that she was little and needed protein as a growing puppy. This confuses me as everyone else seems to be on low protein . . maybe I would be trading one problem for another?

I will join the group and call the doctor if she will consult with me.

Thank you for your knowledge. On the one hand my Vet said - no need to rush into anything unless she has another 'episode' - on the other hand, he is now reluctant to spay her in February as we planned - so makes it a bit confusing for the owner - who does not know what they are doing!

In the meantime, is there something I can give her as a treat? I was giving her bits of cooked chicken but maybe there is a better treat I could give her . . . while we are deciding what to do? I think her favorite, pupparoni, might not be too good right now either.

So very sorry to hear about your puppy, I bet it is confusing for you. Have you tried to give her cherrios? My puppy loves cherrios I have to keep a low fat diet for her even tho my vet has NOT recommended it. She had one episode of pancreatitis and I never want it to happen again so I just give her a low fat diet..

Cheerios sounds like a good idea. Thanks!

Absolutely,

There is another member that contacted Dr Centers just last week. She responded within minutes...

At the very least she can assist you by reading your pups results and guide you to your best option......

I don't know how old your pup is. However, Dr. Center recommends that an initial test should be done at 16 weeks and another at 6 months of age......

I have no further advice but will hold Lucy and you in our thoughts and prayers.

Huggs

I would hold off on the spay until she is diagnosed because she may (but very unlkely) need shunt surgery and there is really no reason to go in twice...

What happened this weekend?

Treats anything low fat and low protien.

Green beans, peeled apple bits, and watermelon are good for liver compromised dogs. Cooked carrots, sweet potato, and zucchini would also be okay.

no pupperonis those are not good for yorkies anyway as they are too high in fat those things are greasy and vet told me when dex got pancreatitis those are the worst treats too high in fat

i would hold off on spay and if this were my dog when they spay i would have them do liver biopsy to give a firm diagnosis of mvd as that really is the only firm diagnosis for mvd so you will know for sure

Yes centers should do phone consult just like dr dodds consults on blood work over the phone - some charge and usually the charge of an office visit which it is worth it since they specialize in these things and always good to have a second opinion from a specialist when things are more involved