Originally Posted by MissSunni (Post 4538998)

Boy all this talk makes me happy I adopted a rescue with no papers! lol. She's a pet…her ears stand up, her tail is docked, she has the right colors and her coat is silky. She looks like a Yorkie, acts like a Yorkie..so to me she is a Yorkie:) But she may be a mix. I completely understand the debate about keeping the breed standards. I am not knowledgeable enough to really debate in this conversation. But it has made me curious. I do know that if I were to have spent anything over $1500 for my puppy, I would expect her to conform to the standards. But, I still don't understand why they ever even started to dock the tails? To be honest, I think they look odd chopped off. Given a say in the matter I would have said for my pet, just leave her tail alone. Again, if she were a show dog, I guess thats a whole different world. I don't see how when a human chops off a "genetically" perfect tail, makes it a standard preference. I know it is, but why? Who ever thought of that and was there a legitimate reason? I am curious about why docking ever became a thing.

Originally Posted by kaydelongpre (Post 4539128)

I appreciate your input & huge amount of knowledge. I was pretty overwhelmed by the amount of responses and all the conflicting info & conversations, so I never got to anwsering everyone's follow-up questions. She had a spay & neuter contract that required the contact info for the vet we would use, and introduced me to her vet who does spay/neutering for a discount for her pups since he's her vet for all her adults & she refers the owners of her pups to him. She informed me that that vet can do tail docking when they're under already for the spaying/neutering if wanted (if I do end up getting the pup, I wouldn't want it done for the record. She will just be my pet anyway and if the breeder never did it, I certainly wouldn't get it done by choice afterwards. I figure there's no point. I see the point in breeders doing it before pups are sold, but it's a pointless thing to do IMO if she's already a pet in my possession). She offered everything else I would look for in a breeder. A 5 year health guarantee, pedigree, lifetime breeder support, and even included a free year of puppy health insurance for vet visits (she registers & pays for insurance for all her pups for 1 year to make the first year of ownership easier on her customers). These pups' dam was 5th generation of ones she has bred, her retired adult had even more generations with her. And she says she knows the pedigrees & histories of the generations before they were with her. as well
Like I said, I have a lot of experience as my family bred bulldogs for a long time. So I know about things like neuter contracts/pedigrees/health guarantees/etc. It was just the breed specific Yorkie things I was fairly uneducated on. All of her general breeding practices went above & beyond my standards. However, I had no clue about whether or not a reputable breeder breeds this coloring or leaves tails undocked.

Originally Posted by Lovetodream88 (Post 4539132)

Docking a tail after a couple days old is considered amputation which makes it a much rougher thing for the dog to go through so weird she would say that. I was kinda concerned about the weight of the female because I noticed you used the word tiny a lot. I know that might could be just by being new to the breed lol. Heck mine seems tiny at 17 pounds. You will find some very strong strick breeders who won't breed anything but traditional and have strong opinions about it and some that do. You can do a search on yt and see the many heated topics about Parti's and tail docking lol

Originally Posted by kaydelongpre (Post 4539133)

She did what I did with bulldogs, bred smaller males to bigger females. They were all small but I don't think it was to an unhealthy point. The dam of this litter was about 6lbs pre-pregnancy. Sire was 5. I didn't ask about the weights of her other females but to my eye, one was about the same as the dam of this litter and her retired female was a little larger. All looked miniscule to my eye considering I've only owned bulldogs & pugs, and always considered my pugs to be tiny. Have a friend with a yorkie thats like huge. At least 12lbs. So considering thats one of the only ones I've ever met, these were itty bitty to me.

Originally Posted by MissSunni (Post 4539174)

I didn't mean that I feel there is anything wrong with buying to standard in any way at all. I actually always have with my other dogs, and would most likely have started to look for a new puppy at a breeder eventually. My little puppy just happened to find me, and it was love at first sight. I think what I meant was more about the tails being docked. I agree that the attributes that make Yorkies so beautiful is because of the standard look that reputable breeds work so carefully to achieve . But the tail being docked is a human thing done to the dog after its born, not before…So, its not like a short tail will ever be passed on to the next generation. I think I should have kept my mouth shut, lol. I'm in something I don't know enough about here.

Originally Posted by MissSunni (Post 4539174)

I didn't mean that I feel there is anything wrong with buying to standard in any way at all. I actually always have with my other dogs, and would most likely have started to look for a new puppy at a breeder eventually. My little puppy just happened to find me, and it was love at first sight. I think what I meant was more about the tails being docked. I agree that the attributes that make Yorkies so beautiful is because of the standard look that reputable breeds work so carefully to achieve . But the tail being docked is a human thing done to the dog after its born, not before…So, its not like a short tail will ever be passed on to the next generation. I think I should have kept my mouth shut, lol. I'm in something I don't know enough about here.

Originally Posted by kaydelongpre (Post 4539128)

I appreciate your input & huge amount of knowledge. I was pretty overwhelmed by the amount of responses and all the conflicting info & conversations, so I never got to anwsering everyone's follow-up questions. She had a spay & neuter contract that required the contact info for the vet we would use, and introduced me to her vet who does spay/neutering for a discount for her pups since he's her vet for all her adults & she refers the owners of her pups to him. She informed me that that vet can do tail docking when they're under already for the spaying/neutering if wanted (if I do end up getting the pup, I wouldn't want it done for the record. She will just be my pet anyway and if the breeder never did it, I certainly wouldn't get it done by choice afterwards. I figure there's no point. I see the point in breeders doing it before pups are sold, but it's a pointless thing to do IMO if she's already a pet in my possession). She offered everything else I would look for in a breeder. A 5 year health guarantee, pedigree, lifetime breeder support, and even included a free year of puppy health insurance for vet visits (she registers & pays for insurance for all her pups for 1 year to make the first year of ownership easier on her customers). These pups' dam was 5th generation of ones she has bred, her retired adult had even more generations with her. And she says she knows the pedigrees & histories of the generations before they were with her. as well
Like I said, I have a lot of experience as my family bred bulldogs for a long time. So I know about things like neuter contracts/pedigrees/health guarantees/etc. It was just the breed specific Yorkie things I was fairly uneducated on. All of her general breeding practices went above & beyond my standards. However, I had no clue about whether or not a reputable breeder breeds this coloring or leaves tails undocked.

Originally Posted by gemy (Post 4539302)

I do have to speak out here. You either dock the tail at 3-5 days old or you leave that tail intact. I would not go to her vet for s or n unless I had researched that vet met them and determined it was someone *for me* to bring my dogs to.

In terms of docking tails. There are very many show breeders who don't and who do. The USA standard calls for a
docked tail. But not at the age for goodness sakes that s+N takes place.!
I am a show breeder, and try to couch my opinions given the reality of the fact for any breed you name, we show breeders can not meet the market demand for puppies. I will couch my opinions with that reality in mind. I know what to expect from a show breeder, but in my mind the simple fact goes like this. If I spend thousands upon thousands of dollars, investigating, showing, health testing my champions, (and I do btw), give the ultimate in vet care, use the latest in puppy rearing techniques, and say oh for example charge $1500 for a pup of two Champions raised in this environment, why would you pay a similar price from someone who has done little if any of the above?? These will not be pups with just champions in their lineage, but their parents are champions of their own!


I am not sure now what the asking price of these puppies are but I can tell you if I was going to spend over $1000 for a pup the above would be what I am looking for.


Some food for thought.

Originally Posted by ironmike86 (Post 4539309)

Exactly my point. PPL will never get a "Show" dog.I say that because ppl always say I don't want one for Show. But They get all the work that goes into breeding one. Home/backyard breeders who charge $1500 imo I wouldn't support them. But ppl are Yorkie crazy and pay whatever. I would rescue one first. JMO nobody needs to agree. I was on a 2yrs waiting list for a female. But If a home breeder didn't show and put forth all the health check ect..I may still buy from them but not for so much$$ I see pll ask $2k..crazy

Originally Posted by Oregongirl (Post 4608051)

I have no problem with anything that your friend told YOU the puppys. I do have a problem if you do not select the puppy you want to live with for 14 to 16 years. Docking the tails is wonderful and looks great. They should do it within the first 5 days, at least that is what I was told.

As far as the Parti, as long as the dog is a Yorkie with the Parti gene, I am ok. I am not going to show these dogs, I am going to love them. I have one girl and one boy coming end of December. Of course, I am not going to breed these puppies. I am retired, and I thought about breeding, but the problem for me would be I would want to keep all of them. It is not out of the question in the future. I have a huge home with just me. Breeding is for another day. The dogs I would breed and the puppies they produce would be so spoiled and well cared for.

You cannot believe what I have done to get ready for my new puppies. I am not using the bedding or dishes from my MISSY who died about a month ago. All items are new and I have everything ready I even made the VET and Groomer apts already for my new puppies. My dogs mean everything to me. My partner who passed in July loved my Yorkie. And, after he passed, my Yorkie could not go on. I only wish people would take responsibility for their dogs. Watch what they eat, regular visits to the Vet, keep them clean, spend time with them and exercise them. I am sue the list is longer. They are a responsibility just like our children. I can always tell a dog that is loved.

Originally Posted by Wylie's Mom (Post 4608084)

If it were your body part being amputated without any anesthesia, I do wonder how "wonderful" you'd then think it was...?

And yes, we should absolutely take responsibility for our dogs and be advocating for them...including advocating that humans stop amputating the body parts they are naturally born with, imo.

I'm so glad my Pfeiffer has her tail - it's stunningly gorgeous, and such a part of her expressing herself! :)