I would like to answer your questions since this thread has been kind of derailed. :)

Here are my thoughts on this matter.

I think that it's great that you have a friend that is knowledgable about the breed. It sounds like she has done some homework on how to look for a reputable breeder. My feeling is that you should follow your friends advice and walk away from this breeder for the simple fact that she just didn't have a good feeling about it. Maybe it's not the idea the mom had a floppy ear or that she had partis (lots of debate on YT regarding Partis do a search), or the idea that she didn't dock tails. Since I was not there personally I would say go with your friends gut reaction. I believe in following intuition over everything else. There is no rush in getting a puppy and it's never a good idea to buy the first anything you see. ;)

As for the full tail let me weigh in on that too. I agree with LoveToDream(Taylor) that it is AKC standard to have a cropped tail. :thumbup: But that alone would not be a deciding factor in a puppy purchase or deciding if someone was reputable as a breeder. I have a Yorkie/Maltese mix that has a full tail and love it. I also have a Yorkie with a tail that was docked way too short and is a nub. AND I also have a blonde Yorkie that you might want to call a Parti or whatever you'd like to call him who is from a shelter :rolleyes: who has a docked tail. So tail or no tail I love them all. It's the Dew Claws that need to be removed at birth.....IMO :)

that depends on where you get your puppy mix from and how much they charge. I paid the same for Lola as I would have from most shelters or rescue group, most rescue groups would have charged more for a puppy like Lola. However like you said there are very gullible people out there that will pay more for the wrong reasons. I have a hard time with blanket statements like "no one really cares about the health and well being on these pups" because I can't help but wonder if the person really knows everyone:rolleyes:

That's because a shelter or a rescue only cares that a dog has a good home so they don't pump up prices or claim to have something unique or rare to line their pockets. :thumbdown

IMO if you want a Purebreed. Go to a reputable breeder. Yorkies and alot of purebreeds have poor breeding from mills. Which breeds unhealthy dogs. Ears erect is a standard. A reputable breeder would not breed one with floopy ears most likely they are just to long. They don't crop them they shave the hair is needed. Every Yorkie pup I've held had erect ears on their own. An easy trait to achieve. Dog are Not to small not to big. But they come out all sizes. They don't mix partis,brewers with traditional. They health check they dock the tails. If you don't want your dog to have a dock tail I'm sure they won't do it. IME good breeder usually have them sold before they are even bred. So you can make the request..Maybe. They do health checks ect. Have a healthy history of lineage. If your dog has floppy ear or is really big or small doesn't mean its not a purebred or bad dog either. Just a reputable breeder won't take a tiny or teapot and breed them either.Ppl who breed pups justs to have pups are breeders. Not good ..most likely didn't do health checks ..pups are lucky if they had homes first. You will NOT get a Show Dog. PPL think they are getting a pet because they don't want a "Show" ...You aren't getting one anyways. But a good quality puppy ime comes from Show breeders who want the best and have the resources to stud from around the World. The OPS question sure the puppy if you want one but for big money?? Heck no. Not because the puppy needs love. The puppy is still good. I personally won't support a breeder like that.I would rescue on instead. There some home breeders who have a few mated pairs which are close to the standards may try to do the right thing...just finding a breeder is hard..one whos not shady. Why spend $1500 from someone who doesn't health check,or even try to conform standards?? Not the ops breeder but any breeder? JMO

THE YTCA the National Club for Yorkshire Terriers sets the standard. They determine what is an automatic DQ or disqualification. And as I mentioned there is only one DQ for the YOrkie and that is color.


Rounded ears drop ears, bad bite will not get a Yorkie DQ - but would be considered serious faults - long tail just a fault. There is a rule of three it is a rough rule for show breeders - but it goes something llike this ; three faults and you are out of the show ring.


The Standard for the Yorkshire Terrier is available from the AKC website as well as from the YTCA - it will elaborate what are the DQ's/

I am referring to the people breeding all of the tinies and mixed colors and YES I said it exactly as I mean it. They don't care about anything but the bottom line.

FCI which is one of the largest registries world wide has the Standard as undocked. I would have to look at all the non member FCI countries to see what their standards say.


The UK Standard is for full tails - in fact you can't show in the UK a docked tail Yorkie.

Standard colors that are acceptable for a Yorkie are

BLACK & GOLD
BLACK & TAN
BLUE & GOLD
BLUE & TAN

White is a automatic disqualification

http://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/am...ireTerrier.pdf

Dis qualification : Any solid color or combination of colors other than Blue and Tan as described above.


See the Standard - while you may register those colors the only acceptable color is Tan and Blue for the show ring.

Partis have their own parent club Biewers Terriers have their own parent club. Yorkies have their own parent club. All Acknowledged by AKC. They make the standard for each breed. But only the "Traditional" Yorkie can do conformation under the Akc. As far as I know. This is a reason why Yorkie breeders don't mix colors. They are considered different in there eyes. I guess keeping the White out of the steel blue and gold is hard to do. So the Partis that want white..well. For ppl who want a pet it may not matter but for a Traditional breeder it does. If you like certain traits of certain dogs...you breed to keep them. For any type of pure breed dog

As with Galen who is a Biewer. (Yes IMO they are Tri colored Yorkies from Germany.) He was bred by a reputable show breeder. The reputable Biewer breeders that are doing it for the better of the breed. Just as Mr Biewer, who started the Biewer Breed, was a Yorkshire Terrier breeder. I did my research. I know that a Biewer is not much more then a Yorkshire Terrier. If the breeder is charging a large amount of money. Yes they are just just doing it for the money.

The Biewer, named after the founder,originated in Germany in the mid 80's. Over the years they are selectively bred and a standard was set. The standard is similar to the Yorkie, but calls for specific color placement. White paws, tip of the tail, symetrical coloring on the head and face, etc and no docking of tail. It has been recognized as a separate breed by some organization and can be shown in some venues. Not in the AKC

Partis are tri-colored Yorkies. They can be registered with but not shown in AKC. Can be shown in some other venues. There is no standard set for them that allows for the non-standard coloring, but typically, most Parti breeders follow the YT standard with color as the exception.

Biewer info can be found here...

http://www.biewerbci.org

You can get more info on the Parti Yorkie here...

Yorkshire Terrier - PARTI YORKSHIRE TERRIER CLUB

I am so happy you posted this. I adore Little Ms Phiefer and would love to see more photos of her too.

My Morkies have the most beautiful full tail plumes, and I wish Tiki had one too. It seems like such a natural expression of their personalities to see those tails carried high above their backs, or wagging like flags. Poor Tiki has such a tiny nub, I let the hair grow long on it so she has something to wag.

Whoa, Sorry for confusion or offense. I wasn't talking about Yorkies at all. Like I said, the yorkie faults I was referencing aren't a health problem. I was talking about my experience in the English Bulldog breeding community when I said the comment about mills, show dogs, and snobs. So many people look for the standard bulldog look of flat face, super short stature, tiny narrow hips, and huge bowed out shoulders. Show bulldogs all have that look. Like they are cartoon characters with the exaggerated extreme shoulders and chest and that giant flat face. We had many many people call willing to pay any price so long as we could "guarantee they wouldn't grow taller than a foot" and asking about the hip to shoulder ratio in the dam. These people only cared about looks and when told that those specific looks can be extremely unhealthy, and that we only breed for looks to a certain point but the ability to breathe, run, climb, etc was the priority, they would very often say they would just go to a breeder with the perfect looking ones who guarantee a height and dimensions. In my opinion, those people are snobs. People who wanted this dog as a status symbol to show they can afford a $2500 dog who is tiny and wide and has those exaggerated "bulldog" features. Those people only out to get dogs based on how they look and how extreme their features are but aren't at all concerned when told about their dog's probable inability to breathe, inability to walk, arthritis, fractures, dysplasia, etc etc, are indeed snobs in my opinion.
Much like someone calling a breeder and saying they only want a yorkie who is a "teacup" and is guaranteed to stay 2lbs or under, and refusing to buy from a breeder who won't make such a guarantee and explains the risk of hypoglycemia, fragility, anesthesia complications, dangerous surgeries, broken bones from falls, hereditary ailments, etc. I would consider a person like that a snob too. Obviously neither you, nor anyone on here with good advice and genuine love & concern for their dogs is anyone like the kind of people I was trying to describe that all too often call breeders looking for something that's just not healthy simply for looks & status.

I wasn't equating situations like that to the color/tail/ear discussion we were having. I absolutely understand why some people prefer breed standards and want ears to stand up and tails to be docked. If you re-read my post it clearly says that I know those are not comparable to health problems and I wasn't saying they are anything at all like the Bulldog issues I was referencing. When I talked about my experience with the EB breed, I stated that I was just suggesting a circumstance where sometimes the breed standard isn't necessarily the most humane, safe, and ethical thing to follow.

PS In my experience just a few hours outside of Lancaster PA, those puppy mills that work with Bulldogs do indeed breed super tiny moms with crazy bowed out legs and flat faces and narrow hips. Reason being that mills are out for nothing but money. And a bulldog with that standard bulldog look can go for $5000 and up. I've had 3 EB rescues from mills. All 3 were indeed gorgeous, perfectly breed conforming between 12 & 15 inches tall, huge hip to shoulder ratio, dipping back, etc. However they had horrid lives. One, at only 4 years old, had such severe arthritis that she couldn't walk up or down a stair. Not even one. We carried her any time she needed to go down the porch stairs for the entire rest of her life. It was very sad. One couldn't even swim and we had to fence our entire pool so she never ever fell in, because if she did her arthritis, mixed with her elbow dysplasia, top heaviness, and constant panting, she would fall under and nearly drown. No amount of surgeries and medications can help a Bulldog that was solely bred for looks & standard live a life that isn't constantly painful. My entire point was that many people search for those looks, many breeders only breed mothers that look like that, and many mills breed whatever will make the most $$ regardless of the fact that it is cruel and extremely unhealthy. Such comparisons weren't to say people who want yorkies that conform to breed standard were anything like the EB people I have known at all. I was just stating that there are circumstances where some breed standards aren't always a good thing to conform to when it comes to a family's beloved pet.
Sorry for any offense, none was meant.

Again very sorry I offended you. You misconstrued my wording, I'm very sorry. What I was trying to say in these quotes underneath this was that my experience breeding Bullies brought a lot of knowledgeable people being snobby about standards, hips, shoulders, and size who did not even care that their requested dimensions could cause terrible health problems. And I wasn't comparing it to the ear/color/tail thing. I was just stating that there's been times where I've seen dogs suffer due to breeding for looks to fit some kind of standard.

Also, when I referenced mills I 100% wasn't saying they care so much about bettering the breed. I was saying that in my experience with EB rescues from mills, they were all bred for looks to have the extreme features that rake in the most cash, and the mills had zero concern for their health. Obviously I was in no way in favor of them or think they breed to standard, otherwise I would not have extensively rescued mill dogs. However, like I said I am new to Yorkies so have never experienced seeing them from different breeders and/or mills so cannot compare that to my experience with the way I've seen mills breed EB's. Never owned a yorkie, do not know much yet but am trying to do a lot of research. I fell in love with the breed when I saw my first Yorkie and was completely taken by it's precious little personality and of course with the fact that unlike most dogs, they gave me no allergies. I thank you all for the input.

I agree, I love the tails. My poor Cookie has a nub. :(

I just got an injured yorkie in tonight...he is in the hospital and will have surgery in AM. They told me he is adorable AND has a tail! :)

I do want to just say I'm not sticking up for or against tail docking it's not something I necessarily agree with but I don't agree with the standards of many dogs. I do believe it would be a rare thing to find a reputable breeder who didn't didn't dock tails not that there is not one out there but just it might be hard unless you are on a waiting list and you ask ahead or time for no tail docking. I was trying to ask other questions to the op to try and figure out if this was a reputable breeder or not because a few things didn't sound right but they just got ignored I'm sure for many reasons. But at the end of the day color is up for argument docking tails and dew claws are up for argument. Other things like how far back does this breeder know the lines of the dog back if it's not several several generations back then she doesn't know whether some serious genetic issues run in the lines which reputable breeders do, or did she have the things she can health checked, or is she breeding females under 5 pounds, or does she have a good health guarantee, or does she have a spay and neuter contract? These are things that are not in argument that a reputable breeder does and by answering these questions it might get you a bit closer to your answer. The reason there is a standard though is to make sure yorkies look like yorkies because there are so many bad breeders out there breeding yorkies and creating yorkies that don't even look like yorkies and that is really damaging the breed. Puppy mills don't care about the standard or even quality they simply care about quantity and money. I do worry about you not really knowing about puppy mills by your comment that there one of the only ones who cares about the standard because I'm pretty sure you could ask owners of several puppy mills what the standard is and they would have no idea. The snobs being another one of the people you say only care about the standard bothered me badly maybe to a point I got to defensive but it was a hurtful comment. I am not a snob I am simply a lover or yorkies standard or not and I certainly don't have a perfect yorkie in the standards eyes. I speak out about reputable breeders so much for one reason because my baby came from a puppy mill and has had to suffer terrible issues and pain because they didn't care about health so I try to push people probably to hard in the direction of a reputable breeder because I don't want someone else to have to watch there dog like that and if we stop buying from puppy mills and non reputable breeders they will eventually have to go out of business. These dogs this breed is in my heart. I have a big love for them and I just want what is best for them and for the breeders who aren't doing right by them to not make money.

I agree. I had a Yorkie from poor breeding. Co$t alot in vet bills. What hurt is when he passed at 7yrs Yorkies are know to be overbred from greeders and mills. If you aren't a Show breeder . You won't get a show puppy. Simple get ppl need to get that outta there head. They want a puppy bred from a reputable breeder mainly for health check and if theres a genetic flaw in the lines they don't bred that line anymore.Main thing is health and treatment of the dogs. Not pumping pups out and healthy conditions

I have been reading YT posts recently looking for info about chiari. Found a lot of good info on yorkies and enjoyed reading until this post. A lot of judging others opinions and non respect from some. This reply from Maxdog is an example of what a reply with class looks like.

To answer the OP's question. Yes, I would buy a parti colored yorkie and I did. Peanut's tail is docked but, I think he would be beautiful either way. He's my favorite little yorkie (only one I have) and I wouldn't trade him for a whole kennel full of "show quality" yorkies.

Because ppl who have experience bad breeding get passionate. Your Companion will rip your heart out if you spend alot of money on Vet bills and they still pass from some genetic defect on which they should have been not breed in the first place.

Its not the "show Quality" its the quality in the way they breed a healthy animal... Which still doesn't always happen. but you can imagine how less it will happen with just ppl breeding . They should be altered if you don't learn responsible breeding practices

Breeding a healthy animal is by far the most important thing. I have to say though that the standards that are set by some breed clubs have caused a lot of problems for certain breeds. Some have been bred to standards that will not allow them to welp pups naturally or have breathing problems trying to breed for that pug nose. We (humans) have decided what characteristics we want in specific breeds and IMO it is not always a benefit to the breeds health.

True like Bulldogs. But I don't support those dogs. Only standard I really care about because I have pets . Is the breeding practices. I want healthy as I can possibly find. If I'm buying a puppy on the cheap then I home they are doing a good job. But Yorkies,Partis ,Brewers ppl are asking $2k plus there better be some reason I'm paying that much. Well breeding practices isn't a 'Standard" just ppl who are showing dogs breed for health. ...usualy because htey want there next champion. They aren't selling show puppies. But you may benifit from the breeding practices...Maybe not but I would rather take my chance there then from someone who just wanted puppies and is selling them for the same price

Just wanted to mention also that show standards for most breeds have changed over time and will continue to do so. If you will compare pictures of show champions from years ago and champions now, you will see what I mean.

It is disappointing, for me, to find that threads which seek advice turn into debates which have 'right or wrong' and 'sides' attached to them.


The OP came here seeking opinions and instead this thread appears to have degenerated into bickering.


I am against tail docking but I do not judge those who continue the practice for many reasons. Mostly, because I believe that society has a huge influence on what people perceive as right or wrong. When something has been ingrained as permissible for a very long time, it is hard to persuade our collective minds to look outside of the issue so that it can be analyzed from alternative points of view. I guess my training allows me to be more objective than judgmental or maybe it's part of my personality, I don't know. I do feel sorry for the dogs who are victims of a permissive mentality but I am hopeful that tail docking, like other permissive practices of the past, will soon be frowned upon and/or discontinued in most countries. As someone mentioned, the tide has already turned significantly in favor of the dogs.


What I do know is that no one should come on here feeling like they should be afraid to voice their opinion or stick with their opinion because someone else may disagree. No one should be made to feel ignorant for asking a question. No one should feel upset because they have been shown the error of their ways by understanding people who have all made mistakes.


If we could just remember that we are all humans, imperfect by nature, then we could go a long way to restoring what this site should be about -which is learning.


Disagreement is not a bad thing, in fact, it is often necessary to get to the crux of an issue. But, there is a sophisticated, adult way to communicate.


I recommend this site:


Effective Communication: Improving Communication Skills in Business and Relationships


If someone feels offended by a post, or angry, I would suggest stepping back before responding so that time can assist with a thoughtful, constructive post instead of a personal attack.


OP- we are ALL Yorkie lovers and EVERYONE on here has made valid points. We are all passionate because we have seen horrible examples of what puppy mills, irresponsible breeding, ownership etc mean for these dogs.


I hope you can see past any negativity and find some real assistance in this thread as I believe everyone is trying to assist in their own way.


I still want pics when you get your new puppy :)


With love,


Sir Rupert Teddykins:animal-pa

Great reply! Couldn't have said it better myself.

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

Goodness. This is an online forum and there is nothing being discussed that is out of line. IF you think it is out of line, then simply report it. Not one of us, you included, has the right answer to what should be said.

As with anything else here, take what you can use and leave the rest behind.

You are right that everyone here has a right to their own opinion. I have learned so much from this forum but I cringe every time a new member asks certain questions because I know what will follow. I know that most here are just trying to help but sometimes the comments come across so strongly that it chases away the OP who really would benefit from the knowledge here. JMO