So true, so sadly true...

Thanks for the link, It'll take me a while to read through that and as it is midnight here and a coupla beers taken (normal amber colour, not green) I don't think I can give it the attention it deserves tonight.
I have to say that living in Belfast I have been much more about finding peaceful resolutions to our troubled and sometimes hate filled society than I have been about animal welfare. I only realised recently that we had any sort of puppy mills here and am very shocked that we do.
It is very, very hard here to find any registered breeders, there are nowhere like the same amount of breeder websites here.
I have Alfie's 5 year Kennel Club registration and as far as I know his Mommy has only had 1 litter and would probably be regarded as a BYB!
I do hear about animal cruelty cases but they seem to be quite rare and I do think we have a system where very few dogs, cats or horses are euthanised unless they are in pain or have a painful future ahead.
I am absolutely appalled at some of the terrible stories I have read here and many of the links have had me in a blubbering mess.
I know that you personally are dedicated to eradicating suffering for all our earth species and I applaud you for that.

The answer for mills has to be somehow through enforcement, publishing known mills, shutting them down for what they are.

And what is and how is a puppymill different from commercial breeders? They often keep dogs within the regulations for commercial breeders and somehow don't look a whole lot different to the millers.

The fact remains in my mind Dogs and for that matter cats, should not be overseen by a Dept of Agriculture in either of our two countries.

They are not livestock, and should not be treated as such.

A seachange is necessary, how that will be, how it needs to be molded, I simply don't know.

ONe needs to stamp out the rot at its' core. That being the laws and regulations regarding breeding of dogs under the Dept of Agriculture, for profit.

I completely agree with your comment about the way some rescues have a "relationship" with mills. In fact, I'm not sure if I agree that organizations that get their dogs this way exclusively should be called rescues at all. The sad part is that most rescuers have no idea how that whole system works. I think that if a lot of rescuers really understood the details & process behind that system, they wouldn't "rescue" the dog.

What really bothers me is the ones who go to the auctions and buy pups. :( For the life of me I cannot comprehend it.

What?! How on earth is that rescuing?

They give the same reasoning...they are saving the dog from certain death. I gave up trying to understand that one. I mean..I really DO get that the poor dogs are suffering. It is just the people don't look at the big picture. Of course, anyone I have discussed it with thought I was heartless.

I had no idea that dogs are auctioned off!!! :eek::( Cats, too? Why???? Where??? Is this legal?

I don't know about cats.

Yes, it is legal in some states.

There is a lady in OH who works tirelessly to stop those things. I used to be on her email list...she is mentioned in this link:


Dog Auctions speakingforspot.com

another link..there are so many if you google dog auction

Puppymills - auctions of dogs in commercial kennels.

I agree. That's not rescuing. That's reselling. They're basically pet stores. I don't understand how an organization can do that with a clear conscious. They are supporting puppy mills & then deceiving the public by calling themselves a "rescue". What I don't understand is how they are allowed to label themselves as a legitimate rescue operation. Is there no criteria set on what kind of organization can use the term "rescue" in their name?

Are you kidding? There are mills who call themselves rescues. It's crazy. I see that language about ADOPTING when people are selling and buying. There are people who think they are rescuing a pup if they buy it...and don't even TRY to tell them that is not an adoption. I pretty much avoid those discussions. Of course you can always look for the 501c3 .. most mills wont have that BUT it really does not mean a rescue is doing what we might think is rescue. All that paperwork really is for is to prove it is a non profit.

It's so sad that these days not only do you have to research your breeder, but you also have to research your rescue. It actually makes me angry.

It does me as well. I have reported the ones who list on Petfinder BUT it is hard to prove sometimes and they pretty much stay on there.

very true

Ladyjane,

Would you be willing to start a new thread about what to look for in a rescue? I know some of it is subjective. But it would be helpful to know what red flags we should be looking for when we do our searches.

Thank you for both of the links you sent me. It's amazing what is going om around me. Yet, I have no clue. No Tennessee isn't listed as one of the States that auction off these pups...but that doesn't matter. This needs to be stopped and banned everywhere. PERIOD!!:mad:

I think that's a great idea

Oh dear, I've been reading your posts and am quite amazed at how heated up you all can get. Anyway it's wonderful to see how involved you are in the well being of our delightful dogs. Just a question about puppy mills in PA and the Amish. How are they involved and why? Can you clear me up on this? We don't have Amish in Italy, of course altho' we have a lot of bad things going on in animal testing, just recently a real upset over an organization that was testing on beagles. Would appreciate an answer.

The short answer is that the Amish community tends to view dogs as livestock, and treats them accordingly. Here are a couple of links. Be warned, some of the pictures are pretty graphic.

Amish Country's Dark Puppy Mill Secret | Care2 Healthy Living

https://www.google.com/search?q=amis...&client=safari

Amish Puppy Mill Cruelty and Trophy Hunting (Selling of buck semen as well) - YouTube

NYS Citizens Against Puppy Mills

I paid $1,700 US dollars for one of my furbabies and it was from a private breeder. A few years ago I paid $1,200 for my other baby. So many factors to consider and just pray that you are guided to the right one :)

Ours cost $500. We just wanted a baby. Do not care about "papers". Won't be breeding her. The lady we got her from had the mom and dad. My daughter asked many questions about their health and bloodline. Puppies seem cheaper in the south. We live in Bowling Green, KY and prices start about $700. Of course if you go to a breeder and want AKC and a female you can plan on $1000 to start up here. My daughter lives in MS and they were cheaper down there. Ours is just to be a family member, not a show dog so we just wanted a healthy puppy.

I would also still suggest that people look for an AKC registered pup but that is only one criteria when looking for a pup.
Usually when a state starts trying to enact legislation that would put the bite on the puppy mills AKC will send out letters to their breeders warning them of legislation that might effect their ability to breed unrestricted. It scares decent breeders into thinking that they are going to be shut down by the actions listed in the legislation. This gets breeders all riled up and they write their letters to the state objecting.
Sadly, AKC has the money and power to help write legislation that would be fair to reputable breeders and at the same time put the bite on puppy mills but instead they block any changes that are suggested. It's a very sad situation.
If they were only concerned about keeping accurate records for dog breeders then legislation about how people keep dogs that are being bred would not be a major issue, however, AKC has their fingers in a few other profitable pies. They say they are defending dog breeders and that may be true but at the same time they are defending really BAD breeders.

When I got Presley 17 years ago, I paid $275 from a breeder. Now, whether she was up to the standards of today's requirements, I can't tell you. Her home was clean and the puppies well cared for..she only had 2 puppies out of the six left. I've had a wonderful 17 years with him so I couldn't be happier. Well, if I could have another 17 years that'd be awesome....