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-   -   Sometimes I feel like giving up.. (https://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/general-yorkshire-terrier-discussion/250023-sometimes-i-feel-like-giving-up.html)

Nasdaq_Diva 07-21-2012 08:08 AM

Sometimes I feel like giving up..
 
*Please no Flamming*

I've had my dog, Tommy for almost 2 years come November. He is a rescue and I adore him. He's had a pretty rough life but I still see the good in him.

I'm starting to feel like he has deeper issues than I think I'm ready for. I've read books on training, he's unresponsive to any command. He will accept treats from my hand, but they have to be at a very low level (he won't look up to grab from my hand) or he will run away.

We play chasing games around the house when he's in the mood to play. But, the last few months, If I get to close to him while we're at play (like closing in on him) he will let out the saddest scream and has a look of terror. If I back away he'll want to keep playing. He's only started that maybe the past few months.

For the past month now, whenever I yell for him (like if I'm in another room) and then come in that room I find him trying to hide and he has peed himself. He never used to do this.

When I go to feed him, he will refuse to eat if I'm not far enough away from his area. I never leave the kitchen area until he's started eating. If I walk past him during this time, it's like he will jump out of his skin and wait for me to walk away before going to eat his food.

I guess my patience is just really wearing thin. When I first got him, I figured he would be some work, but I had no idea it would be like this. I have so much going on in my life - and it kills me to not have him there either :(

Thoughts? Suggestions? Again, please no flamming or judgement.

Sammy Mommy 07-21-2012 08:20 AM

Please don't give up on Tommy, he needs you. You must be so frustrated. Could your vet give you any advise or suggestions? Or maybe some kind of dog trainer/behaviorist that has experience with this? I wish you and Tommy all the best and I hope you can find a solution to help him.

Teresa Ford 07-21-2012 08:29 AM

Hello, I am sorry this is happening. I don't mean to frighten you but this could be a brain issue. OSU Vet school may be an option. I would first make sure there is no physical problems. If it is not a neurological problem, medications and or behavior modification will help. If you do not have the resourses (money, time, understanding etc.) talk to a Yorkie Rescue. They can help, they work with experts every day and can give good advice.
Please do not feel like a failure or bad person, sometimes we all need help. I will say a prayer for you. I know you only want what is best for your Yorkie. I hope you find some answers soon.

yorkietalkjilly 07-21-2012 08:31 AM

No judgments here - you are trying to help & just don't know what to do.

Is he a Yorkie and if not, what breed is he and what size dog.

Has had had a recent medical checkup with labs, etc.?

Joyce Adams 07-21-2012 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teresa Ford (Post 3977520)
Hello, I am sorry this is happening. I don't mean to frighten you but this could be a brain issue. OSU Vet school may be an option. I would first make sure there is no physical problems. If it is not a neurological problem, medications and or behavior modification will help. If you do not have the resourses (money, time, understanding etc.) talk to a Yorkie Rescue. They can help, they work with experts every day and can give good advice.
Please do not feel like a failure or bad person, sometimes we all need help. I will say a prayer for you. I know you only want what is best for your Yorkie. I hope you find some answers soon.

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

Nasdaq_Diva 07-21-2012 09:15 AM

Thanks for the understanding. So far, my my financial situation is shot. So, I'm hoping there is a good change in the air within the next few months. He hasn't been to the vet since Nov/Dec.

He's never had any health issues but they have put him on medication before for a staph infection they say he got before he was with me. They'd also give him the occasional pill prescription when I had a change in food. But, he's been happy with his food this entire time. He used to be on Solid Gold (pink bag), but 2 months ago the store I purchase from said it had been pulled from the shelves and recommended Premium Edge. He has been fine with that so far.

In the past I tried researching doggie trainers but when I'd read between the lines, it seemed like they'd use the choke collar method or the shock therapy kind and I didn't want that for him.

It will be another few months before I can afford to take him to the vet for checkups/medication. I really wish there was a better alternative then putting him on pills.

Nasdaq_Diva 07-21-2012 09:16 AM

@Teresa Ford,

What makes you think it's a brain issue? That really does scare me.

Sammy Mommy 07-21-2012 09:19 AM

Did his behavior changes differ after you changed the dog food? Maybe something in the new food?

Yorkiemom1 07-21-2012 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teresa Ford (Post 3977520)
Hello, I am sorry this is happening. I don't mean to frighten you but this could be a brain issue. OSU Vet school may be an option. I would first make sure there is no physical problems. If it is not a neurological problem, medications and or behavior modification will help. If you do not have the resourses (money, time, understanding etc.) talk to a Yorkie Rescue. They can help, they work with experts every day and can give good advice.
Please do not feel like a failure or bad person, sometimes we all need help. I will say a prayer for you. I know you only want what is best for your Yorkie. I hope you find some answers soon.

:thumbup::thumbup:
No condemnation for someone that is desperately trying to help a lost soul....I agree with above....can you take him to the vet school for neurological exam? You know, we see someone or something that needs help and we try so hard to help, to unravel all the damage that has been done, either physical or emotional or both...and as hard as we try, sometimes we ourselves need help and solutions and even then, if the damage done is toooo deep rooted, we just cant fix it. It then comes down to accepting them like they are (if the issues are not a danger to them or us/family members), or if necessary, we do what we must do.....rehome. Please dont feel like a failure....you just may not have found the "switch" for Tommy that will turn it around for you both...I feel the frustration in your voice....hang in there....give it a rest for just awhile...seek help/assistance from the vet school....there may be solutions that you can not meet without medical assistance. Hang in there sweetie....know that Tommy loves you....and he needs you.

yorkietalkjilly 07-21-2012 09:55 AM

He doesn't have to have a neuro or other medical issue to behave like this - stress and fear can do it also. Until you can vet him, can you answer some questions?

He sounds terribly fearful and wondering how he spends his day - is he home alone or with children or in a crate, confined to a single room or area in a home or apartment? Trying to find out what his daily living situation is and what sounds he might be hearing, etc. What is his typical day like?

What is his age and size?

Are there other dogs or cats, animals around him frequently?

caw 07-21-2012 11:18 AM

Does Tommy like to go for walks? ....... that might be something you could enjoy doing together. I think I'd stop the chase game if he's starting to be weird about it. If you rolled a tennis ball across the floor, would he chase it? Maybe some gentle tug of war? Is there a quiet place in the home you could feed him. I think I would just put his food down and get out of his way. Thats what I do with my dog. If he wants to be weird about it, just ignore it. Maybe watch from a safe distance to make sure he starts eating. I guess you'll have to stop calling his name while in another room and just go look for him. As far as the treat taking....let him accept them on his terms. I don't know.....just some suggestions. I do know that yorkies are SUPER sensitive and will pick up any frustrations felt by you. So....try to shake some of this stuff off, if you can. I know sometimes its hard if your not in the greatest mood. I hope you can work things out with little Tommy. I'm sure he loves you, trusts you (as much as he can), and is grateful to be able to live his life with quiet dignity. Daisy was quite a bit more independent than I would have liked. I felt a bit left out at times. But I just decided that I was gonna accept her as she was and love HER.. Guess what ......she LOVES her mommy back soooooo much.....and shows it in HER way. When I started to accept her ways, and just worry about what made HEr happy and what she needed, I started feeling the love I needed in return.

caw 07-21-2012 11:50 AM

Oh...and I raised Daisy up from a pup. I think the fact that I worked all day, plus she may have just may have been inclined, temperamentally, to being a little more of the independent type. And when I left her to go work all day she had to learn yo be more self reliant. I was thinkn she was gonna be a big time lap dog and she's not. But we ARE tied to the hip......just in a different way. She's a very, very loving and sweet little girl. So you see....you can raise a dog from a pup and get something different than what you originally had in mind. I hope you'll hang in there and I DO wish you all the best.

YorkieMommieof3 07-21-2012 12:31 PM

After having yorkie fir babies since 1997 I have learned a lot. They all have Univision personalities more so than other breads. I have also did rescue. Are as well. If I may ask do you know what type of abuse the little guy suffered?

I have 3 rungs. My Mollie is 11 and she is sweet as can be but she has arthritis and wi snarl at me if she is in pain and will do some evil or sad growls if she doesn't want to be bothered


My izzie is 2 1/2 she is very nervous and a lite nurotic at times. She loves to cuddle but if her sister is in my lap she runs and gets in the. Or we of the. Ouch and pouts. She want eat a treat if I a. Holding it nut if I lay it down and don't look she will get it. She is also scared if I correct her baby sis I can honestly say she has never been abused a day in her life. She thinks she is human


Oh then there is babie Abbie who I loving refer to as Psyco baby. She is 3 s of energy. She is scared of nothing. She with play ruff if she isn't corrected. She loves going out and doesn't know a stranger. She is just a fur ball full of sassy diva. It is hard to I d her and Izzie are 1/2 sisters


Your little guy just may a snuggled are. Missed. He may be trying to gain your trus or just testing your limits to see how he will be grated. He may have a health problem that has developed thAt is causing him to pull away. Keep I. Mind if these little guys suffered physical abuse they may have long term effects such S Arthritis.


My mom rescued a s**tzu that was badly abused. She has adjusted well yet 2 years later she is terrified of goind sown stairs she has to be picked up and carried the vet thinks she may have been kicked down the stairs she is nervous and if ahe is boarded has to stay in a special area awAy from other dogs She does well with my little ones


I would suggest talking to a rescue group volunteer who may be able to hp you i would ask the vet to heck the joints for arthritis or his teeth to see if they may be causing pain I know it is tough but these behaviors are correctable once you get ro the root of the issue. He could also have a stiborn streak like Abbie who does not like being told what to do

capt_noonie 07-21-2012 01:53 PM

You said he is a rescue. Perhaps you could call the rescue group you adopted him from and ask them if they have any recs for trainers. Or maybe call the former foster mom and she if she has any tips?

Lovetodream88 07-21-2012 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nasdaq_Diva (Post 3977509)
*Please no Flamming*

I've had my dog, Tommy for almost 2 years come November. He is a rescue and I adore him. He's had a pretty rough life but I still see the good in him.

I'm starting to feel like he has deeper issues than I think I'm ready for. I've read books on training, he's unresponsive to any command. He will accept treats from my hand, but they have to be at a very low level (he won't look up to grab from my hand) or he will run away.

We play chasing games around the house when he's in the mood to play. But, the last few months, If I get to close to him while we're at play (like closing in on him) he will let out the saddest scream and has a look of terror. If I back away he'll want to keep playing. He's only started that maybe the past few months.

For the past month now, whenever I yell for him (like if I'm in another room) and then come in that room I find him trying to hide and he has peed himself. He never used to do this.

When I go to feed him, he will refuse to eat if I'm not far enough away from his area. I never leave the kitchen area until he's started eating. If I walk past him during this time, it's like he will jump out of his skin and wait for me to walk away before going to eat his food.

I guess my patience is just really wearing thin. When I first got him, I figured he would be some work, but I had no idea it would be like this. I have so much going on in my life - and it kills me to not have him there either :(

Thoughts? Suggestions? Again, please no flamming or judgement.

I would suggest consulting a trainer I think it would be the best for both of you. Rescuing a dog can be a lot harder work then many people realize.

Nasdaq_Diva 07-21-2012 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yorkietalkjilly (Post 3977564)
He doesn't have to have a neuro or other medical issue to behave like this - stress and fear can do it also. Until you can vet him, can you answer some questions?

He sounds terribly fearful and wondering how he spends his day - is he home alone or with children or in a crate, confined to a single room or area in a home or apartment? Trying to find out what his daily living situation is and what sounds he might be hearing, etc. What is his typical day like?

What is his age and size?

Are there other dogs or cats, animals around him frequently?

I have no kids. I've been unemployed for the past 4 months, so we're home alot more than before. Before this, my job was literally a 4 minute walk from my apartment so I was usually always home for lunch.

When I'm not home, he's in his crate. Even if I dont' close the door on it, he still likes to hang around in there.

We go for walks or to the dog park about 2x per week on average. The typical day here is pretty quiet. I barely watch TV. He doesn't have any toys (I wrote a thread on that - never found anything he likes), so he lays in a corner next to the couch and naps most of the day. It's extremely quiet where I live.

And he's almost 8 and weighs about 8-10lbs

Quote:

Originally Posted by caw (Post 3977584)
Does Tommy like to go for walks? ....... that might be something you could enjoy doing together. I think I'd stop the chase game if he's starting to be weird about it. If you rolled a tennis ball across the floor, would he chase it? Maybe some gentle tug of war? Is there a quiet place in the home you could feed him. I think I would just put his food down and get out of his way. Thats what I do with my dog. If he wants to be weird about it, just ignore it. Maybe watch from a safe distance to make sure he starts eating.

Nope, no toys for him. He doesn't like them at all. Even when we go to the dog park he is anti social. He'll wag his tail to and try his hardest to get in there..he'll wag his tail around to greet the other dogs (big and small) but then he'll jsut walk away and come lay down next to me and will refuse to interact with the other doggies.

Quote:

Originally Posted by YorkieMommieof3 (Post 3977621)
After having yorkie fir babies since 1997 I have learned a lot. They all have Univision personalities more so than other breads. I have also did rescue. Are as well. If I may ask do you know what type of abuse the little guy suffered?



I would suggest talking to a rescue group volunteer who may be able to hp you i would ask the vet to heck the joints for arthritis or his teeth to see if they may be causing pain I know it is tough but these behaviors are correctable once you get ro the root of the issue. He could also have a stiborn streak like Abbie who does not like being told what to do

All I know is that he spent his life strictly for breeding out in Amish country (here in Ohio). The rescue agency I got him from paid to take him away from there. He stayed with the shelter for like 3-4 months, was adopted into a couple. They kept him for about a year, decided to divorce and brought him back. He'd been back at the shelter about 3-4 months before I got him.

There is an animal rescue not far from my place. Hoping to see if she can maybe point me into a good direction.

yorkietalkjilly 07-21-2012 03:00 PM

Oh, forgot, are there others in the family he reacts to this way?

caw 07-21-2012 03:43 PM

I feel for you and understand where you are coming from. Sounds like he is sooo damaged. there isn't much you can do. Can you find it in your heart to just give him a home and get another dog to fulfill your dreams of what you need in a dog? I feel for you....but I feel for this poor dog too. Bless you.....and him.

Teresa Ford 07-21-2012 04:56 PM

As a trainer and lover of Yorkies, I always tell people before any retraining, or behavior modification we must know that a dog is healthy physically.
You said his behavior changed recently, you also said he didn't lift his head for treats, and barked like he was afraid or angry. Not lifting the head, snapping at invisible flies and startle reactions to sound, spinning in circles and fearful behavior may be symptoms of a brain issue. It could also be an eye, ear, or tooth problem. It may be all behavior. I can't tell, I can only make an educated guess. A good vet/ doctor who is trained to examine, and choose the right tests can come to a diagnosis and recommend a treatment plan. I just felt the need, to offer some suggestions that might help.

nanahas3 07-21-2012 05:54 PM

The first thought that came to my mind was maybe his eyesight is not what it used to be. I know with our little pom when she got older she was losing her sight and displayed a lot of fear.

Yorkiemom1 07-21-2012 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Teresa Ford (Post 3977783)
As a trainer and lover of Yorkies, I always tell people before any retraining, or behavior modification we must know that a dog is healthy physically.
You said his behavior changed recently, you also said he didn't lift his head for treats, and barked like he was afraid or angry. Not lifting the head, snapping at invisible flies and startle reactions to sound, spinning in circles and fearful behavior may be symptoms of a brain issue. It could also be an eye, ear, or tooth problem. It may be all behavior. I can't tell, I can only make an educated guess. A good vet/ doctor who is trained to examine, and choose the right tests can come to a diagnosis and recommend a treatment plan. I just felt the need, to offer some suggestions that might help.

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:
I agree....and it may take a trip to a specialist or vet school to get a good neurologist....

yorkietalkjilly 07-21-2012 06:40 PM

I fostered a little brain-damaged dog for a few months and even she learned some things but couldn't retain it for longer than 2 days or so unless frequently reinforced. But she was happy, pretty frisky and not fearful of one single thing - even great heights or loud sounds or anything. She had no fear of falling, some fear of fire. Life was wonderful to Winnie. She would stand in her waterbowl, run into things and stare unendingly at the sky when outside. But she was very playful and kissy, loving. She could learn but not retain for very long.

gemy 07-22-2012 04:27 AM

I just wanted to offer my sympathy for what you are going through right now with your dog.

Your rescue dog is eight years old. It is a time of life that dogs can begin to show age related symptoms. I assume that you are under financial pressure being unemployed; but you need to get some medical assistance for your pup. There can be many reasons for an abrupt change in behaviour; many of which are medical in nature.

Have you considered selling some "stuff" on ebay? Offer some babysitting services? Would your vet be interested in an exchange of services? Could you offer to clean his clinic, in exchange for medical assessment/treatment? Perhaps you have computer skills he might need. Night time reception work?

In terms of your pup. Let's talk about "how you call come for your boy". When you are in the other room; is there a happy and excited lilt to your voice? If not really try that out. Come is one command that a puppy/dog, should always be rewarded for. You want to create the environment that coming to you is always, happy, exciting, secure, comforting, in otherwords, everything positive.

Food/Eating. Try this out. Have breakfast with your dog. Start in the same room, but place his food distant to you; then you sit down and eat too. Make some enjoyable sounds with your food. Ignore the dog.

Toy Drive: As a puppy mill breeder, he was never ever exposed to toys and fun times. No wonder he doesn't know how to play; he has never played!
It is possible to teach and adult dog to enjoy play. It will take a lot longer though; and is really dependent upon your dedication, imagination, and time devoted to the "task" at hand.
First you need to find and get re-acquainted with your own inner kid. Cultivate a sense of wonder and play.
Then select a toy, get one that squeaks, but don't use the squeaker yet. Place a toy in say a kitchen drawer; this is where you are going to "hide your toy" and only bring out this toy for fun and games.

Step 1. Go to the drawer. Find "your toy", with lots of happy lilting excitement in your voice. Oh boy, wowee Look at this. Continue talking, rambling if you will, with that same happy voice. Play with your toy. throw it up in the air and catch it! Shake and wiggle it around. Oh boy look at this TOY. Hopefully your pup has come into the room to investigate these happy sounds. Continue on with your game. Likely he will just watch the first few times. And let that be; that is good!. Name your toy. IDK - call it Mr Wiggles. Personalizing things, does help us to interact with "the toy".
Sounds silly doesn't it? Who cares? Enjoy your game.

If your boy doesn't come into the room to investigate. No worries. Put your toy away for now; again with some voicing out loud; oh dear Mr Wiggles; it is time to rest now.

Spend about 2-3 minutes doing this; 2-3 times per day. After three days, if your boy has not come to investigate, THEN..

Step 2. Go into the room where he is. Hide the toy in the room he is in. Try not to let him see you do that.

Then; do the same as step !, but in a softer/less volumne tone, after all you are in the same room.

Exercise: I think you said you only walk 2X per week? Not sure if you meant that; or if you meant you go to the dog park 2x per week.

Daily exercise is so very important for your pup and as a side note for you too!

A healthy dog should be quite fine with 2 - 30 minute walks a day. Now let's make those walks interesting. Change up the route. Change your pacing during the walk. Talk to your dog when walking. Make/ note of interesting things on your walk. A lovely flower, a butterfly on the wing, a grand old oak tree. Explore your environment as a health dog would. Stop, touch, smell things on your walk.
On a beautiful day, bring a book with you, sit under a tree with your dog, and read aloud to him.

It doesn't matter what really you do with him, but that you are with him. Companionship does wonders; for both the human and the doggie.

I do hope that things turn around for both you and the dog.


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