"Update" Yorkie Not Like Lab Hi there everyone, my last thread was titled "My Yorkie is No Lab". I was saddened that my yorkie pup Bubba had very few similarities to my lab Charlie. Since then, I put Bubba on a feeding/potty/exercise/crate schedule limiting his roaming and unstructured freedom. I speak in a normal tone to him and praise him tons, constantly telling him "good boy" and loving on him even for the smallest feats (like just sniffing my hand, or letting me scratch his chin). Two days after beginning the schedule, I had him out, gently trying to tend to his eye mucus, after about one minute of letting me he growled and bit me very aggressively. That was it, it was crystal clear he was confused, I pinned him down and held him until he submitted, he put up a fight for 17 minutes before giving in. I got up didn't look at him or say anything, came back 5 minutes later, he wasn't afraid, on the contrary, came when called tail wagging and licked my hand, I gave him the biggest hug and kiss and we went about our evening. He now obeys for "0" treats, just praise and affection. He doesn't nip anymore, there are two toys that trigger his aggression (growling/tearing) he doesn't get those anymore, I plan on slowly re-introducing them eventually, just to know we definitely conquered it. He lets me bathe, groom, touch his face, top of his head, roll him over check his belly (and scratch/tickle :) ) this pup is unrecognizable from two weeks ago. He's had a couple of potty accidents, so he isn't perfect... yet :) I love that I don't have to raise my voice or be stern, he can sit, stay, lay down, and come when called, just by being spoken to. He automatically sits when it's meal time, no command needed anymore. Coincidentally, Charlie my lab, has begun taking wood (never allowed to do this, it's a definite "NO") out of the wood cart, from the back porch, and shredding it. He may be hearing all of the praise going on inside the house. My husband has been the one primarily exercising him (daily), but I may need to rotate in, see if it's my absence causing his behavior. To anyone that may be having difficulties, I say hang in there, there is hope. Thank you all for your advice and knowledge, I have researched this site thoroughly and found my answers here :) |
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What a cute face! I am so happy to read that things are better for you and Bubba. Having had two goldens pryer to my yorkies, I understand your confusion. Yorkies, however, are so endearing. Things will only get better and better...... You will see, they are almost humanlike in their ability to love. Happy New Year! |
Human-like, I have heard that several times and now understand. I don't want to say that their sensibilities are delicate, they seem to be more in tuned with what a person wants/expects. I suppose hundreds of years of breeding for human companionship not so much servitude/work as seen in other breeds. The stern voice and assertiveness is almost over-stimulating to them, and I found that they quickly shut down. Where my lab is not as in tune or perceptive of me and needs it, he can be reprimanded and will obey even quicker. I have learned so much in such a short time and hope for more improvements. Happy New Year to you too ;) |
His biting concerns me, did you get him from a breeder at an age under 12 weeks? The YTCA says that if they stay with the mother and littermates until 12 weeks they are less likely to bite and more importantly less likely to bite hard, the mother teaches inhibition of the biting reflex. I agree with lots of your training methods, but I’m not fond of the holding them down for 18 minutes method. Just because he didn’t act afraid 5 minutes later, it doesn’t mean this had no negative effect on him. Punishment is tricky, it sometimes gets fast results, but it usually always has a bad side effect, but that isn't always apparent. I’m not talking about opinions here, the science definitely shows aversive punishment doesn’t work long term. How long ago has it been since he bit you? Puppies do nibble the hands, they are teething, and fingers are irresistible, so next time he bites, you could say, “no bite” in a firm voice set him down, and give him a chewing type of toy. If he bites you aggressively again, I hope you seek out a trainer, if he does this to the vet or a groomer, they may have the legal right to have him put down, this is very serious. Anyway, it sounds like things are going good, I just don't agree with the holding down, and while some trainers do this as a last resort, they always say the layman shouldn't do it without proper training. I know everbody is looking for easy answers, but there is no "One time do this and everything will be good" answer. |
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I have had puppies in the past, and clearly know the difference between exploratory bites/teething and aggressive behavior. I don't recommend anyone try this unless they have been properly shown how and are familiar with the technique. There is such a fine line, he struggles I hold, he relaxes I relax, he cannot try to engage me with eye contact and he has to surrender, mind you all the while I remain calm and collected. The instant that he does surrender/submit, he is released and avoided. You are correct in that, it is a last resort. When he attacked on 12/24, that was it. I was being gentle, calm and he growled and bit, and he needed to be put in his place. I understand that not everyone will agree with my methods and that is fine. I will always get my dogs to submit and obey, I have a son, young nieces and nephews over all the time, I would never risk not having absolute control over my animals no matter how small they may be. As stated before, he has not bitten since. Your reply, I'm certain is appreciated as a variant position for members of the yorkie talk forum. |
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:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup: The 'holding down' is a form of the 'Alpha Roll' and should never be done to puppies or young dogs. It was developed by professional trainers to be used by professional trainers on severely aggressive dogs, after all alternative methods of training have been tried and failed. The 'Alpha Roll' would then be tried, only as a last attempt to save the dog from being PTS. When it is used on younger dogs and puppies, it can have adverse effects and actually make them worse aggressors, or the opposite can occur and their spirits can be broken, and they end up being fearful, cowering, hiding under the bed messes, which then need to be retrained to begin trusting humans again. I will say some members have gotten 'lucky' using this method, and I just want to say here that it was intended to be used only once. Repeated use will not improve matters and may cause the adverse reactions mentioned above, or worse. From: Alpha roll - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Monks of New Skete, The (2002). How To Be Your Dog's Best Friend. Little, Brown & Company. ISBN 0-316-61000-3. "In the original edition of this book, we recommended a technique we termed "the alpha-wolf rollover"...We no longer recommend this technique and strongly discourage its use to our clients.... The conditions in which it might be used effectively are simply too risky and demanding for the average dog owner; there are other ways of dealing with problem behavior that are much safer and, in the long run, just as effective." |
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I got my last yorkie when my children were 5 & 3 years old. She was trained around them like she was a large german shepherd much to the laughter of friends who joked about how serious I was about it. Toys, bones & treats could be taken from her without reaction. She could be petted while she ate and she wasn't allowed to put her mouth on anyone. I was not willing to risk injury to my own children, or their visiting friends by a snippy dog. |
I don't want you all to believe that other attempts weren't made at correcting Bubba's behavior. Before getting him to submit, I also attempted the passive approach, in which I lied down and allowed him to climb on me and explore and become comfortable with me, and not be afraid, which is what I thought was his original problem. I was told that if he was aggressive out of fear, he most likely is intimidated by humans and I should allow him to find out that I am no danger, I will submit and not harm him. When I did this he bit and shook, even when I would "yelp" in pain. The yelping was almost like fuel to the fire, getting a reaction was even more exciting and tempting to him. I spoke to a trainer (also the vet tech that immunizes Bubba), she warned me that his reaction to my "pain" was "extremely alarming" and "he should not be handled by children or strangers until corrected". I was so upset. She recommended getting him to submit and correct it a.s.a.p. I have to admit, because he is such a small breed I never imagined it would have to come to that. A couple days later he attacked me and that was a huge reality check. I have been working with a professional and had actually contemplated contacting the breeder, but for what? A refund? An exchange? It didn't seem right, I thought what would happen to Bubba? I knew that he was separated from his mom too soon, I knew he had teeth and his litter mate did not, I just never imagined that such aggression could be created in such a short time with a tiny yorkie. Thank you all for your concern and advice. I truly am happy that Bubba is doing better. |
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You guys are awesome. Thanks :wub: |
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