Originally Posted by kjc (Post 3867763)

03-29-2011, 03:05 PM #160 107barney
Donating YT 500 Club Member


:icon1: Update on Barney and Leptospirosis
Someone asked about Lepto today in diet and health so I thought I'd update my thread.

Barney was treated with doxycycline for two weeks for the leptospirosis infection. My vet and I discussed giving the vaccine and decided against it. She was playing phone tag with the laboratory and the specialist to obtain more information because she just had a hard time believing he had the infection and that his positive result was more likely due to a prior vaccine. ...

... I think their individual lifestyles do not support the vaccine and I am going to go with the recommendation of my regular vet over the specialist on this. I hope I don't make a mistake, but if I do, then it is certainly not because I did not give this a whole bunch of time and consideration and that is what I believe to be in my dogs' best interest at the end of the day.

I hope this thread helps others. Thank you all for your support.
__________________


:confused:

Originally Posted by kjc (Post 3867763)

03-29-2011, 03:05 PM #160 107barney
Donating YT 500 Club Member


:icon1: Update on Barney and Leptospirosis
Someone asked about Lepto today in diet and health so I thought I'd update my thread.

Barney was treated with doxycycline for two weeks for the leptospirosis infection. My vet and I discussed giving the vaccine and decided against it. She was playing phone tag with the laboratory and the specialist to obtain more information because she just had a hard time believing he had the infection and that his positive result was more likely due to a prior vaccine. ...

... I think their individual lifestyles do not support the vaccine and I am going to go with the recommendation of my regular vet over the specialist on this. I hope I don't make a mistake, but if I do, then it is certainly not because I did not give this a whole bunch of time and consideration and that is what I believe to be in my dogs' best interest at the end of the day.

I hope this thread helps others. Thank you all for your support.
__________________


:confused:

Originally Posted by megansmomma (Post 3867772)

What is your point? Why are you posting threads from OTHER areas of the board here? I can work the search button too :thumbup:

Originally Posted by 107barney (Post 3867784)

Not just bumping up other threads, but using threads I posted A YEAR AGO about my sick dog who had a possible exposure to a deadly disease to try to take my posts out of context for some unknown agenda.

Originally Posted by kjc (Post 3867720)

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup: Very good practice...



:thumbup: I think the Rabies vaccine is the only one required by law in the USA.




Rabies is required and can only be given by a vet in the USA because of it's zoonotic properties (infectious to humans). Giving the Rabies vaccine is no different than giving other vaccines, but care must be taken to not inject oneself or get stuck by the needle, and proper disposal/destruction of the needle, syringe, and vaccine container must be done as these also are a route of infection.



There are no 'specialty' singles for small dogs. All vaccines made for dogs are strong enough to vaccinate a dog weighing up to 100 pounds. This is where the problem of 'overvaccinate' originates, and why Dr Dodds recommends only one vaccine per vet visit and one month between vaccines for dogs.



Good breeders work closely with their own vets. My vet has a 'Breeder call List' to inform those who breed of any changes in practices, meds and/or recalls.



Quite a few breeders are trained by their vets to perform these procedures. These are minor procedures compared to whelping the pups at home.... Vets offices have many dogs and cats coming in on a daily basis, many of which are sick. To bring unvaccinated puppies into this environment is always a risk, as viruses are airborne and can infect even if the vet's office is clean and immaculate. Even when the puppies are carried in, there is still a risk that the breeder could bring home something infectious on their clothes or shoes. Not only do they save money doing this.... they may also be saving the lives of their puppies.



IMHO, it is a big lump.

All human medicine and more is tested on Horseshoecrab blood before it ever goes into production.

Horseshoe Crabs - The Useful Horseshoe Crab

The Veterinary Profession is always looking to human medicine/procedures to find ways to better treat our pets.

The Vet ER I worked at 20 years ago had all kinds of equipment donated from local hospitals, from infant incubators for small critical patients, to EKG machines and Pulse Oximeters, Endoscopes, IV supplies and pumps, etc., which now is fairly commonplace (or should be) at many vet practices/clinics.

Stem Cell therapy is becoming an available treatment for our pets also. Funny though as it was first tested on animals before being used in human medicine, and now it's coming back to be utilized in the Vet Med field.

9/11 Search and Rescue Dog Receives Stem Cell Therapy at Va. Clinic

Burke Vet Performs Stem Cell Therapy on Dogs with Hip, Knee Problems - Burke, VA Patch


To 'draw a line' between human and animal medicine would be severely limiting to both fields.

Also, when I worked at the human hospital, I remember hearing countless stories of nurses intervening in patients treatment, usually involved an error in medication or amounts in the charts.... takes a sharp nurse to catch and verify those kinds of errors.

Originally Posted by megansmomma (Post 3867573)

Nancy, I think that you missed what I was pointing out in my original post. So I will clarify further my observation and why I still hold the same opinion.

Below is the part of the original post that I took issue with and it was not regarding an RN giving vaccines. My issue is with the bold RED sentence.



Anyone can go to the local tractor supply and pick up a variety of vaccines to be used on their domesticated pets. But the part that is overstepping her scope as a nurse and that I take issue with is the part in RED. A vaccination record and a Veterinary Health Certificate are two totally different things. The VHC is to be signed by a Licensed Veterinarian and certified the HEALTH of a puppy.

Here is a link so that you can see what I am referring:

Health Certificate for US Pet Travel

Why is a CICU nurse stepping into the scope of practicing Veterinary Medicine. :confused: I don't care how well regarded you are on the floor of the CICU it's still practicing Veterinary Medicine without a license. :rolleyes:

I am also taken aback by her website, where she once again uses her RN signature to promote the sale of her puppies. What does this have to do with breeding? It's a marketing ploy as far as I am concerned. :thumbdown

RoseHillYorkies

Judy Wright, RN
Owner of RoseHill Yorkies
Houston, Texas

Originally Posted by 107barney (Post 3867768)

There is nothing to be confused about. My post said I feel sorry for people who have to discuss annual vaccines with their vets. My vet follows AAHA standards and does not do annual vaccines. My post had nothing to do with the leptospirosis vaccination, or with Barney's case.

Originally Posted by kjc (Post 3867835)

At the very bottom of the Health Certificate that you linked to, there is a place for the owner to sign... therefore she is not "practicing Veterinary Medicine without a license" when she states that she signs her puppies' Health Certificates.

Originally Posted by Yorkiemom1 (Post 3867832)

Thank you for stepping into what appears to have taken on a complete blood bath and feeding frenzy against me. I appreciate your points, well made-point by point, as they are, of course, true, but a select few of these people on this site attack, condem, judge, and convict people that have done absolutely NOTHING wrong. Then, to crucify me and my breeding program, and even my site because I sign my name with my RN.....OMG.....I had joined this site years ago, and all the petty bickering and unfounded attacks I witnessed, conducted by members who seem to "travel in packs" and relentlessly attack and try to destroy other members, so appalled me, I chose not to associate with this venue. When we were in high school, some of the "mean girls" had spiral notebooks, called appropriately, "B--ch Books", where they all got together and tore into individuals they detested for WHATEVER reason they could dream up. This is exactly what this forum reminds me of.....these people do not know me, they do not know what kind of nurse I am, they do not know my reputation, they have never bought a puppy of mine, they have never done any business with me, or they would realize they could NEVER justify their attacks against me. They have accused me of everything from overstepping my place as an RN (I have always been a patient advocate and have routinely intervened on my patient's behalf) to practicing vet medicine, to deliberately using my RN as a shameless sales ploy on my website. This is really grabbing at straws in order to tear someone apart, all based on nothing but their conjecture. I hope all the new people out there that are reading these posts, can see this visciousness being spewed by what closely resembles a pack of ravenous wolves, going frantically after blood. They gang up, pile on, and begin to rip and tear apart. Such a shame, because there really are sincere, caring, honest people out here that are educated and knowledgable in a number of different areas, that can offer so much valuable information to people seeking answers and help, with not only their pets, but their medical issues with loved ones too. And all such knowledge and information, is shared NOT with the intent to sell dogs, or blackball vets, or out practice vets, or challenge doctors, or impress anyone by boasting, but simply to answer questions and offer help and solutions. What a shame to attack and try to discredit members just because you dont agree with what they have said. Again, thank you for explaning points that I could never have defended on my own, as these people have become hell bent on criticizing ABSOLUTELY ANYTHING and EVERYTHING I say.

Originally Posted by Yorkiemom1 (Post 3867832)

Thank you for stepping into what appears to have taken on a complete blood bath and feeding frenzy against me. I appreciate your points, well made-point by point, as they are, of course, true, but a select few of these people on this site attack, condem, judge, and convict people that have done absolutely NOTHING wrong. Then, to crucify me and my breeding program, and even my site because I sign my name with my RN.....OMG.....I had joined this site years ago, and all the petty bickering and unfounded attacks I witnessed, conducted by members who seem to "travel in packs" and relentlessly attack and try to destroy other members, so appalled me, I chose not to associate with this venue. When we were in high school, some of the "mean girls" had spiral notebooks, called appropriately, "B--ch Books", where they all got together and tore into individuals they detested for WHATEVER reason they could dream up. This is exactly what this forum reminds me of.....these people do not know me, they do not know what kind of nurse I am, they do not know my reputation, they have never bought a puppy of mine, they have never done any business with me, or they would realize they could NEVER justify their attacks against me. They have accused me of everything from overstepping my place as an RN (I have always been a patient advocate and have routinely intervened on my patient's behalf) to practicing vet medicine, to deliberately using my RN as a shameless sales ploy on my website. This is really grabbing at straws in order to tear someone apart, all based on nothing but their conjecture. I hope all the new people out there that are reading these posts, can see this visciousness being spewed by what closely resembles a pack of ravenous wolves, going frantically after blood. They gang up, pile on, and begin to rip and tear apart. Such a shame, because there really are sincere, caring, honest people out here that are educated and knowledgable in a number of different areas, that can offer so much valuable information to people seeking answers and help, with not only their pets, but their medical issues with loved ones too. And all such knowledge and information, is shared NOT with the intent to sell dogs, or blackball vets, or out practice vets, or challenge doctors, or impress anyone by boasting, but simply to answer questions and offer help and solutions. What a shame to attack and try to discredit members just because you dont agree with what they have said. Again, thank you for explaning points that I could never have defended on my own, as these people have become hell bent on criticizing ABSOLUTELY ANYTHING and EVERYTHING I say.

Originally Posted by kjc (Post 3867860)

See the highlighted part in your quote (in my earlier post). I was just verifying that you do (or did) discuss annual vaccines with your vet, as Lepto is an annual vaccine.

I only commented because your post may make owners feel like they shouldn't discuss vaccines with their vets, period, and I don't think that's a good thing.

Originally Posted by Yorkiemom1 (Post 3867832)

Thank you for stepping into what appears to have taken on a complete blood bath and feeding frenzy against me. I appreciate your points, well made-point by point, as they are, of course, true, but a select few of these people on this site attack, condem, judge, and convict people that have done absolutely NOTHING wrong. Then, to crucify me and my breeding program, and even my site because I sign my name with my RN.....OMG.....I had joined this site years ago, and all the petty bickering and unfounded attacks I witnessed, conducted by members who seem to "travel in packs" and relentlessly attack and try to destroy other members, so appalled me, I chose not to associate with this venue. When we were in high school, some of the "mean girls" had spiral notebooks, called appropriately, "B--ch Books", where they all got together and tore into individuals they detested for WHATEVER reason they could dream up. This is exactly what this forum reminds me of.....these people do not know me, they do not know what kind of nurse I am, they do not know my reputation, they have never bought a puppy of mine, they have never done any business with me, or they would realize they could NEVER justify their attacks against me. They have accused me of everything from overstepping my place as an RN (I have always been a patient advocate and have routinely intervened on my patient's behalf) to practicing vet medicine, to deliberately using my RN as a shameless sales ploy on my website. This is really grabbing at straws in order to tear someone apart, all based on nothing but their conjecture. I hope all the new people out there that are reading these posts, can see this visciousness being spewed by what closely resembles a pack of ravenous wolves, going frantically after blood. They gang up, pile on, and begin to rip and tear apart. Such a shame, because there really are sincere, caring, honest people out here that are educated and knowledgable in a number of different areas, that can offer so much valuable information to people seeking answers and help, with not only their pets, but their medical issues with loved ones too. And all such knowledge and information, is shared NOT with the intent to sell dogs, or blackball vets, or out practice vets, or challenge doctors, or impress anyone by boasting, but simply to answer questions and offer help and solutions. What a shame to attack and try to discredit members just because you dont agree with what they have said. Again, thank you for explaning points that I could never have defended on my own, as these people have become hell bent on criticizing ABSOLUTELY ANYTHING and EVERYTHING I say.

Originally Posted by megansmomma (Post 3867817)

She has been following me around too. Here's an example that she admitted to me in a PM was her way of making fun of me. :confused:

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/3862065-post104.html

and what's this???? Taken from another thread too :confused:

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/3865965-post18.html

Originally Posted by kjc (Post 3867860)

See the highlighted part in your quote (in my earlier post). I was just verifying that you do (or did) discuss annual vaccines with your vet, as Lepto is an annual vaccine.

I only commented because your post may make owners feel like they shouldn't discuss vaccines with their vets, period, and I don't think that's a good thing.

Originally Posted by Yorkiemom1 (Post 3867832)

Thank you for stepping into what appears to have taken on a complete blood bath and feeding frenzy against me. I appreciate your points, well made-point by point, as they are, of course, true, but a select few of these people on this site attack, condem, judge, and convict people that have done absolutely NOTHING wrong. Then, to crucify me and my breeding program, and even my site because I sign my name with my RN.....OMG.....I had joined this site years ago, and all the petty bickering and unfounded attacks I witnessed, conducted by members who seem to "travel in packs" and relentlessly attack and try to destroy other members, so appalled me, I chose not to associate with this venue. When we were in high school, some of the "mean girls" had spiral notebooks, called appropriately, "B--ch Books", where they all got together and tore into individuals they detested for WHATEVER reason they could dream up. This is exactly what this forum reminds me of.....these people do not know me, they do not know what kind of nurse I am, they do not know my reputation, they have never bought a puppy of mine, they have never done any business with me, or they would realize they could NEVER justify their attacks against me. They have accused me of everything from overstepping my place as an RN (I have always been a patient advocate and have routinely intervened on my patient's behalf) to practicing vet medicine, to deliberately using my RN as a shameless sales ploy on my website. This is really grabbing at straws in order to tear someone apart, all based on nothing but their conjecture. I hope all the new people out there that are reading these posts, can see this visciousness being spewed by what closely resembles a pack of ravenous wolves, going frantically after blood. They gang up, pile on, and begin to rip and tear apart. Such a shame, because there really are sincere, caring, honest people out here that are educated and knowledgable in a number of different areas, that can offer so much valuable information to people seeking answers and help, with not only their pets, but their medical issues with loved ones too. And all such knowledge and information, is shared NOT with the intent to sell dogs, or blackball vets, or out practice vets, or challenge doctors, or impress anyone by boasting, but simply to answer questions and offer help and solutions. What a shame to attack and try to discredit members just because you dont agree with what they have said. Again, thank you for explaning points that I could never have defended on my own, as these people have become hell bent on criticizing ABSOLUTELY ANYTHING and EVERYTHING I say.

Originally Posted by lynzy420 (Post 3867892)

This is alarming to me, as I said in another post on another thread somewhere there are a few schools of thought in this forum, of course there are those who will be on the same threads, we all belong here. We all have differences in our opinions and experiences and knowledge, there is nothing wrong in stating it.

What is alarming to me is there does seem to be a group who doesn't like it when they are questioned or when someone differs in their opinion.

Suddenly the bash word and gang word etc. , comes in to play...where in the world does this come from?

I know none of you in real life (i don't think) but my opinion won't change, my priority is the pups and I will forever advocate for them and if you don't like the school of thought I have, well thats just not something I can worry about...I will defend my statements, I will admit when I am wrong, I will share my knowledge and I will state my opinion. I will also tell you when I think your wrong, especially when I have said experience, or when its blatant. Everyone has a right to their own school of thought.

I stand by my statement, I think it is unethical that you use RN on your breeding program site, its could be misleading to some. I also don't like that you have a layaway plan for pups, am I wrong for feeling this way? I also don't like that you have a price plan, what would I get for my offer of $300 or my offer of $3000, quite frankly your the type of breeder I want to expose, am I wrong for feeling this way? Its my opinion, and I do believe I have a right to it.

I am offended by your statement. In fact; I am outraged by it, but its my opinion and my feeling and I will deal with it.

Sadly, this afternoon I received a pm from someone asking me if I was invited to join a gang on here, I'm shocked to think anyone would really do this, I am not upset at said pm'er I am upset that I think she felt this way because she did not like my school of thought....this is not right or perhaps she was her self pm'ed, I didn't know if I was being warned or informed or just an honest concern.

I am not a follower, and as I said to the pm'er, they don't call little old me Big Bertha for nothing.

Apparently I am being judged by "keeping company" with those in my school of thought (I went back and looked over alot of my threads) the funny thing all the same people are in my threads WHY because we have different schools of thought...eiyieyieyie, I don't know if this makes any sense. But I'm putting it out there.

Originally Posted by Nancy1999 (Post 3867904)

I've really enjoyed reading many of your posts and I think you have a lot to offer members of YorkieTalk. I'm very sorry for the way you have been attacked for the smallest of things. It's really shameful. We have lost so many good breeders and other members because of this type of ganging up behavior. While I understand that we all have different opinions on what's the best way to do things, I'm really sadden that there no longer seems to be respect for those who think differently then we do. I hope you continue to answer people questions, I think your posts were some of the most helpful. The bad thing is if you ever disagree with certain members, they'll never let it go. Welcome to Yorkietalk!

Originally Posted by Micah my love (Post 3867887)

I believe that you both are two of the kindest ladies here and i appreciate the knowledge that you share here

Originally Posted by 107barney (Post 3867896)

I absolutely think owners should discuss all aspects of their pets' health with their veterinarians, but my point was that I do not think that owners should have to discuss core annual vaccines with vets because those vets should not be doing core annual vaccines IMO. You didn't bump it up for any other reason other than to try to show a prior inconsistent statement, and there is no inconsistency. I don't discuss annual vaccines with my vet because we follow AAHA recommendations for core vaccination only.

Originally Posted by lynzy420 (Post 3868000)

Do these things exist in the only the U.S.?

Originally Posted by kjc (Post 3867835)

At the very bottom of the Health Certificate that you linked to, there is a place for the owner to sign... therefore she is not "practicing Veterinary Medicine without a license" when she states that she signs her puppies' Health Certificates.

Originally Posted by Nancy1999 (Post 3867319)

I'm confused about all this talk about telling your vet what to do? As a pet owner, I told my vet I did not want yearly booster shots, I preferred to get titers. I also told him I didn't want the lepo shot on the advice of my breeder. Since when are giving shots some medical procedure? Diabetics give shots and little training is needed. Certainly an RN is qualified to give a shot and understand the dosage recommendations and need for quality control. All these things are legal as well. The only reason the rabies shot can’t be given by anyone other than a vet is because any time some disease effects the human population, special precautions have to be made to insure it’s done properly. Again, not saying that most breeders should give shots, but this wouldn’t affect my judgment on the breeder’s qualification as a good breeder one way or the other.

Originally Posted by Yorkiexpress (Post 3868672)

You say you prefer titers.... I don't think you can do that yourself can you? So if you can't do your own titers then how do you know when to vaccinate when its needed? Also when did YTCA start allowing people who breed/sell parti carriers to be on the Breeder referral list? You have that link in your sig line. Just wondering???

Originally Posted by Yorkiexpress (Post 3868672)

You say you prefer titers.... I don't think you can do that yourself can you? So if you can't do your own titers then how do you know when to vaccinate when its needed? Also when did YTCA start allowing people who breed/sell parti carriers to be on the Breeder referral list? You have that link in your sig line. Just wondering???

Originally Posted by concretegurl (Post 3868780)

Biting my own tongue.

I think it's an "oops" one dog with an "issue" is allowed just not that sort of breeding is allowed.

I wonder if at some point they will have breed club rules about testing for these genes prior to breeding-within the YTCA in attempts to fully exclude partis-I know it is encouraged breeders do this but not required. (my understanding is just based on my own readings)

I read that YTCA breeders do sometimes find they have a parti carrier, and they of course have AKC registered dogs, however they will not allow a parti in the ring...I'd assume (perhaps safety) they are acknowledging existence but not the quality of for show.

Like the idea is to breed them out or cull the herd two carriers should not be bread together but breeding a carrier to a non-carrier producing YTCA standard dogs is okay.

Again sorry to post off topic on this thread but that's my understanding of this.

To the OP,

I hope my posts haven't made you feel attacked. I always just post my opinions and perspectives on each thread I reply to here. I hope you take each opinion as food for thought in whatever choices made.

Originally Posted by Nancy1999 (Post 3868694)

I didn't mean I prefer titers, over the shots if shots were needed. I said Joey got them last time instead of getting a shot. My vet thinks each case should be decided individually, and he knows we live by a lake and have many dog paths around our property. However, even titers, don’t give the full story. I wish I could be as certain as so many of you that a dog doesn’t ever need a shot again. :( When I was talking about inoculations, I was only talking about the puppy shots that the dog gets the first few months. Joey’s breeder gave the shots and I believe her to be very capable, my vet did accept her shots and recorded the dates and times on Joeys record. This does not mean, that I think most breeders should give shots, I don’t even think most breeders should breed. :)

I have no connection with the YTCA, I did learn about it on Yorkietalk and found my breeder through them. I think many good breeders belong to the mother club, and since I firmly believe that a person should visit a breeders home in person, this allows many people to find a reputable breeder who is within driving distance. So that's why it's in my signature, just to give others more options when choosing a pup. There are lots of other good breeders who are not members though, and probably some poor ones who are members. Again, it's not as black and white as some would think, but what is? Regarding your question about allowing people who breed/sell parti carriers, I seriously have no idea what you mean.

Originally Posted by Yorkiexpress (Post 3868870)

My definition of a Parti.....JMO
Just another version of a "Designer Yorkie" Bred for no reason other than to dupe the unsuspecting public into spending ridiculous amounts of money on a Yorkie that they can't even show or register. It is not a color that is recognized under the Yorkie standard. Kind of like in the category of a "Tea cup" or Chocolate Yorkie.

Originally Posted by Yorkiexpress (Post 3868870)

My definition of a Parti.....JMO
Just another version of a "Designer Yorkie" Bred for no reason other than to dupe the unsuspecting public into spending ridiculous amounts of money on a Yorkie that they can't even show or register. It is not a color that is recognized under the Yorkie standard. Kind of like in the category of a "Tea cup" or Chocolate Yorkie.