I was just reading a rebuttal/response on the rip off report where someone basically described a breeder as one who has bred a litter..etc., etc., isn't this the same thing "technically" ? - if you 'sell' dogs - that is take money from someone for what you have sold them - you are in fact a 'business' (you don't have to have a business name, tax id # - you're a business...under the table or however) Selling dogs - even that one accidental litter someone had - is a business, which a business can be short or long term. Using politically correct terms doesn't change what it is. Some people use the term "hobby breeder" well, once you take money for "your hobby" you're now out of the hobby and into a business (even if you didn't report your "earnings" to the IRS).
I think everyone gets so caught up in the terminology that the importance of the message is lost.

Kendra,

The message wasn't lost on me. I guess, I was just hoping, this breeder, truly didn't know that Dogs Direct was an auction, or that she really didn't have a hand in doing her web-site.

Have you ever wanted to just believe that just once, someone might be innocent? That's why I offered to connect her with my friend that does web-site design.

I'm typing this as my beautiful, nearly 15 yea old Yorkie, Sydney is in the final stages of CRF. In a few more days, she will Cross the Bridge and take my heart with her.

Just once this week, I wanted to believe someone might be innocent.

Sheila

the purposes of Businesses is to make money to support the business and the business owner and in some cases pay a few employees as well. If the business does not do that, the business closes up, moves, whatever.
A dog fancier breeding, showing purebred dogs do not make a living from selling the odd puppy they may have for sale. The cost of showing, looking after their dogs and all the things that come into it far outweigh what little income might come in from the sale of a puppy or a few puppies. Show breeders i personally know sometimes have a show potential or show dog and do not sell it to a show home unless they know the person quite well and are willing to risk that person having their line. Many are sold spayed/neutered for pet instead at a pet price, not a show dog price.
I don't know of a show breeder that makes it their income. All have jobs, spouses with jobs sometimes where the other person has a great income job so the breeder can stay home, or have private investments coming in to support them.
i have my own business - mobile dog grooming. That is where I make my money to support me and my dogs. I can juggle my bookings as necessary to be home with my dogs at times I can't leave, ie whelpings, sick dog etc.
When I first got into this, my mentor cautioned me if I ever am looking at breeding a litter to sell puppies to make a little money, and I want to do things properly, it won't work out. Something will go wrong and money will not be made as i had in mind to do.
For those that sell many litters/puppies, sell anywhere, don't honor guarantees, sell them young enough before trouble starts, well that puts it on a whole different situation.

I know I am a "harper" and "nag...but my daughters who know little to nothing about breeding could look at the photo of the OP pup and could tell you it was not a Yorkie..
I agree, some mixed Yorkies are very hard to sort out as to purebred or not..but these tend to be poorly bred from stock or a mix of a Yorkie and perhaps a Silky..I have seen a few poodle Yorkie mixes that took majorly after the Yorkie and that was difficult to know for sure...but

NO ONE has the right to produce a pup that in no way resembles the breed...if it happens, you spay/neuter the parents and never repeat your mistake...
Shoot, I have seen 100% champion line Yorkies that I would not breed from or to...I was offered a stud service in return for a favor with a champion male who had one eye slightly larger then the other...I declined...and any ethcial breeder would, not just me.

I'm so sorry to hear about your beloved Sydney. My heart goes out to you.
Yes, I'm with you I always want to believe someone is innocent and in this case the person probably is. I can see where someone would leave the website design up to the web designer based on their "expert" advice. Afterall, that's what they do, why wouldn't someone assume they know the verbiage that has the most appeal (which is the purpose of the website).
I just sometimes get irked or amused (depending on the situation) of how people like to turn words around to make themselves out in the best light, never minding they are walking contradictions...my reference to the "hobby" breeder who is really selling puppies but pretending (through words) they aren't a 'business'. Just silly. And it kinda irks me how someone will pick out one, possibly not best choice, word and focus on that rather than the whole message.
I know we were planning doing some redesigning of our website (because I, too, relied too much on giving them free reign because I didn't know what I was doing) if you want to send me your web designer's information I'd appreciate it. Thanks.
Again, so sorry to hear about Sydney.

Did you know that if someone makes money off of a "hobby" they are supposed to report that to the IRS, too?

Business or Hobby? Answer Has Implications for Deductions

Sorry, even a business that isn't making money is still a business, and not a "hobby" (in the sense it is used here/breeder's claims to imply they do it never assuming the possibility of a profit). Not everyone chooses to show their dogs, thus if they are breeding (and yes, many non-show people do breed high quality dogs, where they've spent a good deal of money on buying the best breeding pair, often times producing "show potential/quality" pups) barring problems, eventually could make a profit from the sale of the pups. There's nothing wrong with recouping your costs, and nothing wrong with actually making a profit off a particular litter.
Did I make money off of my litter? No, but I also spent a lot of money on high quality dogs/proper care/testing, etc., etc. Could I, at some point actually see a profit? Yes. So if I did, would my dogs be any less quality for that? If I personally choose not to show at this time in my life, are my pups any less 'show potential'? No. Don't get caught up in the verbiage of some people. Look at the overall facts. Remember showing one's dogs is a choice. Would I like to do that someday? Yes (& I am diligently studying the show aspect), but I can't show at this time, it's the way it is, not some sinister plot to breed willy-nilly.

Not to be flip, but a case could be made, that the ethical responsible hobby breeder, could characterize themselfs as a NPO (Non Profit Organization). That being that they have no expectations of making a profit, are not in "business" to create a profit, but to provide a meaningful service to their community. /that service being, keeping and or improving a high quality healthy pure bred dog breed alive and well.

Hate to put that out there; I can just see some bright whippersnapper, creating a whole host of appealing marketing terms for themselves.

Not quite that easy to set up a NP - but I see what you're saying and I agree to a certain extent.
RE: marketing terms: yeah, that could happen to.
I guess I wish I could see people focus on breeding high quality dogs of exceptional health (Yorkies for us Yorkie lovers) and quit tearing each other down over things like terminology. I do hate to see some of these websites where people have bred the teenie-tinies into some freakish looking thing. So sad. So yes, some people should be tore down, but many shouldn't. Give people the benefit of the doubt first is my motto.

It is easy to make money, big money from breeding dogs.

1. Buy cheap stock..
2. Breed dozens of litters
3. feed cheap dog food..many puppymillers feed chicken feed.
4. No vet care
5. set up a fancy web site
6. ship pups/no pick ups
7. give 3 day health guarantee
8. pay no taxes
9. be ready to move your operation and change kennel name often.

I have been thinking about Kia these past few days and it is very sad to hear that she is slipping away. :hug:

10. Always blame others for your irresponsible breeding behavior.

*not directed at you Rose :)

[QUOTE=YorkieRose;3444119]I know I am a "harper" and "nag...but my daughters who know little to nothing about breeding could look at the photo of the OP pup and could tell you it was not a Yorkie..
I agree, some mixed Yorkies are very hard to sort out as to purebred or not..but these tend to be poorly bred from stock or a mix of a Yorkie and perhaps a Silky..I have seen a few poodle Yorkie mixes that took majorly after the Yorkie and that was difficult to know for sure...but
QUOTE]

Just a clarification if this is directed at me. I am the OP and my girl Bratt who is shown in my avatar is a purebred Yorkie. In fact 2 AKC judges gave her first in class placements in the 6-9 month class when I showed her. I did stop showing her (and she is spayed) when her coat did not turn the proper color but she is purebred. :) I'm not sure what the "quality" of my dog has to do with this thread?

Teresa

[quote=Teresamag;3444262]FORGIVE me...I responded to the wrong thread...I thought I was posting about the buyer who DNA'ed her pup and found out it was not purebred.
I must be getting old...sorry!!!

Now I understand your issue, you think what is termed a hobby breeder is someone who doesn't show, breeds and sells puppies. Well, there are different terms for different things I guess but most show breeders consider themselves a hobby breeder as they are not in it as a business.
I guess although you have never been in the show rings and don't know much about show breeders I would surmise, but know it all, I wish you luck in your endeavors as you produce show dogs but don't have the experience of the show rings.

[quote=YorkieRose;3444267]No problem, I was just confused. :confused: Thanks

Teresa

I suppose that'd be one way, don't know about those things but I guess some do.

Like I said, I'm learning...as I suppose you did once upon a time?

It took a little while to find the right mentors and that is where I still learn from. People who have been show breeders longer than 30 years, produced many lovely show dogs over the years without having a lot of litters. I listen to what they tell me and still ask for advice, direction, and their opinion and follow what they say. I am still learning and they often tell me they still learn too.

You would lose sleep at night if you ever took a tour of the 1000's of Midwest puppymills and PA Amish millers...I have seen things that are burnt in my brain...for awhile I started to hate these people..but hate is a cancer..so I try to educate and pray for a better world for these animals.

The word "some" is literally in the tens of 1000's..maybe more...
but this has nothing to so with the thread....

Kendra,

Thank you for your very kind words. It's the middle of the night, and I can't sleep. All I can think about is that I am losing Sydney. I don't know how my husband and I are going to face life without her.

I hope Gayla is innocent. She did take her dogs off of Dogs Direct, but she hasn't contacted my friend about re-designing her site.

I don't know. I hope she cares enough about her dogs, not to want money badly enough to let them end up in puppymills.

No dog should be there. Those places are worse than hell on earth.

All, I can think about now is Sydney.

Again, thank you.

Sheila

Thank you, Jodi. It is Sydney that we are losing. You remember Sydney, she is my Yorkie that is nearly 15. And Kia is the 13 year old.

I know I have been blessed to have her so many years, and she has been healthy all of her life, but it was still a shock when the Vet told us how high her levels had risen since December.

It is breaking my heart.

I'm not sure what Rich & I will do without her.

Hugs,
Sheila

sydney
 

i am so so sorry to read about your precious girl, i can feel the pain your going through, thoughts and prayers to you and your husband, :cry:

Thank you so very much for your kind words.

We lost Sydney, yesterday, at 10:39 A.M.

Words cannot express the pain we feel.

We lost a huge part of ourselves, losing our darling Sydney.

Sheila

Oh, no. Rest In Peace, little Sydney. I think I can tell in some small way how very much you will always be loved and missed. This world is a much sadder place every day a beloved companion goes home. I cannot help but believe that Heaven is where the Rainbow Bridge resides and one day.......oh, one day.............

OH, I am so sorry. Posted little Sydney's post to the wrong thread.

Thank you so much. My DH & I are struggling to cope with losing Sydney.
She was such a wonderful little girl!

I believe that our loving Father in Heaven, that created these beautiful creatures, must also have a special place for them, in Heaven.

Sheila

No, it is my fault-I got off topic here, which I apolgize to the OP and everyone posting for going off topic.