Breeder question
 

So I got my puppy 3 weeks ago from a sensational breeder. I did some research (of course I didn't know half of the things that I know now) but the only puppies she bred were yorkies, they were ALL well taken care of, AKC certified and I believe she has a waiting list for puppies as she doesn't breed a ton at a time. Here's her website: Shadow's Retreat | 703-327-6454

Oliver has ALL his papers and I was able to meet his mommy and daddy which I liked so I know what Ollie might look like. My question is, his breeder had stated in the contract and told me that right around the time he is of the age to get neutered I have to bring him back to her to see if she wants to use him as a stud. If she DOES want to use him then I am not allowed to neuter him and she will pay me $100 for each time she uses him as a stud. I don't really know too much about this sort of thing and it didn't seem so bad at the time (and I was SOO in love with Oliver that I had to have him!!) so I agreed but now I'm hoping I didn't make the wrong decision. Is this normal for breeders to want their puppies to be studs? If so, is it harmful to them in anyway? I honestly don't think he will be used as he was the little runt of the litter but I fell in love with him regardless and wanted to take him with me :) Also, for all you experts out there that know a lot more than I do on what to look for, does her website look legit and does she seem like a good breeder? Thanks so much guys for all your help! :)

No, the people I know sell all their pups with spay/neuter contracts or spayed/neutered already. Sometimes one will go to someone they trust for show, but does not leave till the pup is much older and co-ownership is done, so both parties know the quality of the yorkie and responsiblities.

I feel for you having to be tied to her, for breeding your male. Looks like she is getting all the benefits without the work. I am glad that she is waiting to make a decision on his quality, but I feel for you. Looks like she will most likely use him if she needs to. Intend seems to be breeding. Once a male is used as a stud, they do start marking. You will need to be prepared for this, if he ends up being used as a stud. Also who is actually financially responsible in this case, if some of the pups he may produce end up having health problems, her or you or both. This should be spelled out in the contract.

You did sign this agreement with her and sounds like you are bound to it. I would not have gone for this. I hope she decides not to use him for breeding, so your little guy can be neutered and be loved as your pet. This way he is all yours! Hoping for the best for you.

P.S. Runts can grow to be the largest in the litter. You really cannot depend on him being the runt. Also some breeders out there, love the small males for breeding. I know crazy! Maybe you could go back to her and tell her you rethought this and do not care about the 100. stud bonus and just want him neutered. Maybe she will go for it. It is worth a try.

Aw thanks, yeah that's what I'm worried about....I don't know what using him a stud would entail and I don't know what reprocussions this would cause. What does marking mean? See I wish I had been more educated on these things prior to signing any contract...that was really foolish of me. I did the research on Yorkies but not as much on breeder's contracts and such. Guess I'm too trusting :( Thanks for your help though!

Yeah I'm thinking about doing that, I keep in contact with her a lot as she is very helpful and wants me to call her for any questions or concerns. I do trust her but I hope she cares more about the pup and its home than she does the financial aspect...but that's of course hard to say. Honestly I wouldn't care if she offered me $1,000 each time she used him as a stud, if it poses harm and discomfort to Oliver I don't want him to go through it!

He is your pet and I wouldnt let him use him for stud. It will change his behavior and you are not a breeder you want a pet not a dog with stud behav8iors. Ive never heard of a breeder requiring that either

Aww yeah now I'm worried! I'd seriously even be willing to pay her NOT to use him if that's what it took for me to get out of this contract. I'm really upset I agreed to something I knew nothing about :( Maybe I'll give her a call although maybe I won't and she'll just forget all about me.... :rolleyes:

Males (and females for that matter) mark their territory by peeing on their surroundings.

I would return him before I would keep my puppy under a contract like that. NO matter how much I love him. Well, I'm only trying to make a point that if you are not allowed to alter he isn't yours. He is co/owned and when you alter him without her approval if its in the contract then she can sue you. Tell her you want it changed. She will do it. She appears to be GS person with a boarding place that decided to breed her yorkie pets.

You have a wild contract. Sure, let you live with a stud dog she sold you as a pet. You want a pet, a stud isn't the same. Pets are cleaner.

So sorry you didn't ask this before you bought him. You really do not want a stud dog as your pet.

Who determins when it is time for him to be neuterd? Even if she chooses not to use him as a stud, you really want to have him neutered before he reaches puberty. Once he hits puberty he will start marking and even if he is neutered later, he might not stop.

If you are really stuck on him, ask her if she would let you out of that contract for additional money.

My guess is she really doesn't want to lose the sale so she will go for it.

Well I guess you could move and change your name. :D.

One of my grooming clients some years back bought a male very cheap...but the catch was, she had to allow the "breeder" to use him for stud.
Well, that male was used as many as 2 times a month for several months...I would groom him after the "breeder" kept him at her home for breeding because...he came back matted and dirty..what a nightmare...so my client had him neutered and told the "breeder" to sue her...she never heard from her again.

There was no end to the stud agreement...she could have used him for years.

I'm glad it worked out for her, the sad part is, by that time, he had already developed the habits of a stud dog.

I'm guessing the person would not sue over this, but getting it out in the open would make me few better, than to always wonder if she was going to sue.

This lady does not have show dogs. So it's not like she was planning to make a champion out of him.

I'm so glad that you consented to this questionable agreement. As a breeder you place a dog as a pet or a breeding dog. There is no inbetween as she has requested. Explain to her your misgivinings about using a pet for stud service and that as an owner, you will end up handling the behavior of a stud dog, something that a qualified/reputable breeder should do.

You could not have said this better as to to intent of this breeder, "using a pet for stud service ..." Not good at all.

Let me correct what I wrote, I wrote it in haste. I meant to say I'm sorry you consented to this questionable agreement.

Thanks Jeanie for catching that....you could have corrected me publically.

I think we all knew what you really meant. :D LOL

Let me add what the OP breeder is doing, is taking advantage of her. Allowing her to take all the added responsibilty and expense of raising the pup and expense of obtaining all the required tests needed prior to breeding. And then reaping all the benefits of a litter (as many litters as she wants). A very convenient option for the breeder.

Maybe contact the breeder and just plainly tell her your not interested in owning a stud dog and would prefer to neuter and have him as your pet. Be honest with the breeder and maybe she will share your concerns and just let you have him neutered. At least try it!

Donna

That is what I was saying. She will use him when he is older. I am most certain of this. And I beat you she will not ask for tests to be conducted on this one, and just as fast will use him as a stud without testing. She's really got gumption. She has no upkeep (does not have to groom, feed, vet expense, care, potty training, pick up after him, etc... But can use him to her benefit as a stud), but all the advantages. I would defiantly try and get out of this contract as soon as possible.

How old was he when you picked him up? What kind of health testing has she done to her lines? What type of guarantee? She said that she gives each new puppy a pedigree certi to take with them, did you receive one for both parents?

I'm asking this now because you asked about her. This, like I said it wild. Her website reads better than many. Photos don't do much but never buy from photos alone.

Because you asked and this stud thing is from another planet.

Anyone can say that a mom and dad is the mom and dad. Brokers do it all of the time. I'm not saying that she's not being honest. But like the waiting list is most likely due to not having the breeding stock. Not due to demand.

[QUOTE=Elle;3176175]How old was he when you picked him up? What kind of health testing has she done to her lines? What type of guarantee? She said that she gives each new puppy a pedigree certi to take with them, did you receive one for both parents?

I'm asking this now because you asked about her. This, like I said it wild. Her website reads better than many. Photos don't do much but never buy from photos alone.

Because you asked and this stud thing is from another planet.

Anyone can say that a mom and dad is the mom and dad. Brokers do it all of the time. I'm not saying that she's not being honest. But like the waiting list is most likely due to not having the breeding stock. Not due to demand.[/QUOTE]

To the OP, Were you on a waiting list That seems to be the new sales tactic. "I have a waiting list and you are lucky to get this puppy."

With all of the puppies out there I can't imagine anyone, with the exception of show breeders, has awaiting list. I understand with show breeders because someone wants one from a particular pair or out of this or that champion. But for pets. I think not.

I agree with all posts, I also would be surprised if the breeder did the whole gamut of health tests. So I dont think the breeder is going to be expecting this owner to pay for health tests AND that is a problem

to the OP: Dogs can get diseases from breeding like humans. Will the breeder pay for the prebreeding tests on your stud, and show you the proof that prebreeding tests have been done on the bitch? Who will absorb the medical costs if your dog comes down with an infection linked to the breeding? What happens if he is hurt or injured in the breeding process?
Who makes the decision on what vet care is required, where it is done, and who pays for it?

Judging by the pictures I've seen on her website none of her Yorkies are in show coat. Do your papers show a CH beside the registered names of sire and dam? If not then it's likely this person doesn't intend to show.

So in summary I think its' worth a call to the breeder, try to get out of this $$1oo stud fee arrangement. Just explain that you have been doing some thinking, (talk to your vet too before calling her, ask his opinion about this stud business), say you would much prefer to keep your boy as a pet, that you are not prepared to handle a "stud" dog and the drawbacks and responsibilty of having an unneutered male. Perhaps in your area like mine the city licensing fee for a unneutered male is 4x that for a neutered male.

Also here in Ontario, the consumer has 30 days to get out of any contract they sign, maybe in your state you might have similar protections.

That just doesn't sound right to me. Good luck OP! I hope you're able to resolve this issue. Also, didn't your baby get released before the 12 week mark?

I totally agree with everyone. She gets out of the hassle of owning/caring for the stud dog, but having him at her disposal whenever she wants.
I wonder what you paid for him. If you neutered him and were sued, what would worse case scenario be? It would be small claims court and I don't think the judge would make you responsible for anything more than the cost of the dog.:confused:
I have a dog who was never bred, was neutered and still marks and it is awful!
I would never chose to have a stud dog as a pet. Good luck.

I've enjoyed this thread---just calm--good comments--good advise ! I'd like to hear how this thing turns out.