Love it when you own it :thumbup:

This thread is just disturbing. I watched that video and the puppies were in distress and the woman was cackling like a freak! :eek:

The man in the video pointed to the puppies tails and make a joke about how they wouldn't be there in a few minutes! :eek:

I am by far not weak hearted but it was very disturbing.

Lol, if she's mixing me up with you, I'm honored! :D

I have my vet do the claws and tails. I've never been shown and won't attempt it unless shown in person and then maybe still not.

I have the same concerns about taking newborns anywhere. What I do is to schedule my appointment first thing. I like to be there before any other animal has been in that room that day. It helps to minimize the risk. As for the weather, in the winter I make sure the truck is well warmed up before bringing the pups out and then it's with a towel that's been heated in the dryer. In the summer, I just don't use the AC and keep the windows up so no drafts.

Another thing I like about taking the pups to the vet's at this time is that my vet gives them all a good once-over. I like the added assurance of a medical professional checking them out.

Oh the honor is all mine! :p

I live in Canada (on the prairies). Winter is a fact of life for us. I have had to take puppies out in the winter to go to the vet more times than I would care to remember. I have taken pups to the vet when it is 40 below zero. I pack my pups into a small plastic tote with microwave heat packs and cover them with blankets. I then wrap the whole tote into a quilt. The car is well warmed before we leave. My pups are always toasty warm and sleeping when we get there.
My vet sees the pups first thing in the morning in a freshly cleaned cat area. No adult dog has ever set foot into this area. Cats and puppies only. It has always been freshly cleaned before we get there, I work in a hospital and it doesn't smell nearly as clean as my vet's office. She puts out sterile sheets for my pups. Each pup has a full exam before tail and dew claw amputation to make sure that they are strong enough to handle the procedure. If a pup is weak, tiny or struggling with their health in any way, she delays for a day or so until they are strong enough to handle it.
Tails and dewclaws are removed with a pair of sharp surgical scissors. I have never had a bone grow from the dewclaws (although I have when dewclaws were removed with a clamp on a dog that I bought, in all fairness to those who use a clamp, it was a dog from a breeder who was a novice to doing dewclaws). She then cauterizes and puts one stitch in each. After the procedure is finished, she gives 1 cc of a dextrose solution by mouth and sub-q fluids to each pup to just give them an extra little boost and to prevent any shock.
It is my personal preference to have the tails docked in this method (clamp method is fine, I just prefer the scissor method). I find that it is very accurate as to the length and I just like the look, it gives a nice blunt end to the tail without the skinny squashed appearance that I have seen on some tails that have been done with a clamp (probably by people who were not really experienced in doing it).
Anyways, I have to agree with WoogieMan, it makes my feel good to have my pups have a really thorough check up when they are only a few days old.

The environment of the puppies should tells that story of that video. It's sad that some people are more concerned with saving some money than the well being of puppies.

I would have to totally agree with you on that. :(

I have to say, I have never seen pups cry like they did on the video, those poor babies, also the people involved seemed to be getting some kind of a perverted thrill out of doing it.

I replied in another thread saying that I supported mommadog. I would never support anyone w/ breeding practices as such. Now you're saying you've been involved w/ showing and breeding w/ those ethics? Not sure what show world you're referring to. But I've seen enough to know what's what.

40 below zero?

You betcha, people in Saskatchewan are tough and so are our yorkies:D and yes, we potty outside in the winter (dogs not humans) but they do it VERY quickly.

Audrey, except for the -40 degrees (brrrrr), it sounds like you and I have mirror experiences with this. My vet also does the cut and stitch method and has delayed for a day or two doing a pup he felt wasn't robust enough at the time. He doesn't sub-Q but won't do any pup that hasn't begun to plump out. None of my pups have ever shown any distress from his method and we're on the same page as far as tail length goes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mommadog1 View Post
YES.. please don't twist..it's just sickening to me...

When I DID tails on my cockers and cockapoos (I refuse to do it now) i took a small torn strip of cloth and tied it on the tail where I was going to cut. You MUST cut on the dead side of the cloth (the tip of the tail u want off)..

I waited 15 minutes until it was numb, it will be cold to the touch. Then I would cut with very sharp scissors, or a dog nail clipper..looks like a claw and cuts side to side. It works best. Then I would cover it with septic powder until bleeding stopped. But I never had any blood really..

But every time I took them to the vet they bled like heck and they screamed when they cut. At home they would yelp, but not much. I hated it, I know it hurts them, imagine the pain after? It doesn't just stop hurting after they snip.

I also do not remove dewclaws. No real reason for it, and they can grow back and I have had it happened. Some times they grow back deformed.. But you know, they DO use their "dewclaw", it is an actual digit and the pain of removing them is terrible. The vet has to dig down deep to get all the bone.
Now remember, all the while this is being done, plus the stitches, the pups are not numb!! They feel EVERYTHING.. I don't care if they remember it or not, it's cruel. But I do believe it effects how they run, and sit. this of course is my opinion and I feel strongly about it but I would never tell someone else what they should or shouldn't do, it's not my business.

This makes me sick. Thank you Nancy.

I don't understand how people breed w/o a vet they're in a partnership with. Even having yorkies, you need a vet you believe in and trust. Questioning things they're saying and fees is foreign to me. I did it years ago. We can't accomplish the same things. Can we? Trust is crucial.

WOW! this thread got out of hand quickly while I was away for a few days. Many of you are probably wondering exactly what happened.

1. I made an appointment with the vet to have the dewclaws removed. However the day before I decided "no, this is a relatively simple procedure and I WILL do it myself. Although I have NEVER seen the procedure done before in person I am confident enough that I can preform the procedure with minimal risk of infection due to my nursing training" (keep reading, you may disagree with this but please continue to my point at the end of this post).

2. After gathering supplies and talking through the procedure with Mommadog1 (thank you by the way). I went ahead and removed two dew claws from one of the babies. I knew that I had to cut high enough remove the entire claw so that it would not grow back. There WAS blood - but thanks to forum posts like these I knew what to do and applied a clotting agent.

3. Here is where it gets embarrassing. My little guy cried, and as much confidence I had going in, it all was lost when I saw him bleeding. Even though I was able to stop the bleeding quite easily, my heart turned to mush....I couldn't do anymore dew claws and had already canceled the vet appointment. - I wasn't about to make another appointment and have them find some of the dewclaws removed and have them ask me who did it - I was way to embarrassed to explain that to them. So here I am, one baby has his original 2 dewclaws still and the other one has 2 of his 4 removed. I do feel a little stupid.



All is healed up nicely but I still feel dumb. But here is my bottom line. I STILL agree with posting the information on here so that those of us STUBBORN enough to attempt to learn online will at least do so as safely as possible. Do I feel stupid for making the decision to attempt to do them myself? YES. But I know that I probably would have done it regardless of whether mommadog1 had walked me through it or not. We might as well post as much information as possible to at least ensure that others like me can preform the procedure as safely as possible because lets face many of us think we can do anything (myself included) and will do it regardless.

I'm torn by your post. Glad you realized you were not up to par to do it, but sad that you had to do that to one of your pups before you realized. All I'm saying is if it's your FIRST time and no one has ever shown you in person, you must really have a strong stomach and B@LLS to do it. And being that you're a nurse, and I'm assuming you've seen your fair share of "stuff" (my bff is a RN and she tells me stories), I'm surprised by your story.

So what now? your pups will be left as is? It's too late if you reschedule? Just bc you were too embarrassed to tell your vet what happened? You should own up and just tell them what happened and what you were thinking.

The thing I do not agree with is posting all this info online "so that those of us STUBBORN enough to attempt to learn online will at least do so as safely as possible". Perhaps you wanted to learn to do it safely, but what about others, bybers who don't want to spend the money and end up doing it wrong? Sometimes there is too much info out there for people to think they know better than a trained professional.

No Nancy I have not had any grow back deformed.. I have heard of it happening. And I have had pups born with double dews in the back that HAVE to be removed.

And read again, the dogs showed extreme pain when the VET did it.. man can't you read? or do you just pick and choose crap.

Oh yes you have...

Your first problem was cutting instead of clamping...cutting most always requires a stitch, there is too much blood and the wound is open.. IMO..

I hope the two claws removed were the back ones...they are a 100% MUST to remove. Nothing but trouble all the dogs life.
Go to the vet..admit your mistake for the sake of your pup and do the right thing..best wishes

jvdb: I did both my puppies myself with someone holding them. They yelped and then when mommy got them back they were fine.

You tried and that is what counts. Take them to the vet if you cannot finish the job.

It was my first time doing the claws and 2nd doing the tails. My vet did my first litter and I did my second.

Information is always great no matter what anyone says. Good luck and they will understand. Go some where else if your ashamed but it needs to be done.

One of my dogs has his back claws and its a pain in the ass. I'm having them removed as they are huge and get caught even in grass.

It sounds like you're the one that's picking and choosing crap.
This is just my opinion, but I would rather have the 11 year old "mentor" me.

Being a nurse doesn't make you an expert on canine procedures. I was a nurse in my previous life (it didn't make a surgeon, and surgeons don't get their medical expertise via the internet). I would have never attempted this procedure without being instructed up close and personal by my vet and mentor. As stated before there are several nuances in performing this procedure; keeping stress to a minimum on these pups.

As you say, don't understand how one would be more concerned about their personal embarassement over the welfare of the pup.

Nancy,

I guess there those that choose what they post based on the circumstances and what benefits their purpose.

:eek:...this is just bizarre. And the comment of 'you tried and that's what counts'??

IMO, doing a medical procedure on a dog without proper training borders on cruelty, no matter one's background. It may seem simple, and may be to an experienced person, but to be walked through it on the phone just boggles my mind. I mean, it's not like this was a life or death issue and you were snowed in....and for what?....to save $38?

May not be a life or death situation, but could turn into one. I'm aware of a couple of people that I know on a personal level, that attempted to do this without proper instruction. Performed the procedure on premature pups that hadn't obtained the proper weight and lost pups. So, understanding that other factors figure into the equation is of improtance.

That was the point I was trying to make. This didn't have to be done...at home....by a novice....and there are many complications that could occur. I'm an experienced breeder but that doesn't mean I'm experienced at everything and I certainly know the limits of my expertise.

double post.

I do the dewclaws and tails myself.

I learned from watching videos and had someone talk me through it the first time. It all came out great and I am so glad I was able to learn.

Now with that in mind, I chose to do them myself after a horrible experience at the vet, it had nothing to do with money.

I took my first litter into the vet's to have their tails and dewclaws done. I asked ahead of time if they used the clamp and twist method as I had read this was the best way. They told me they did.
I got to go back and watch the procedure.

I will never forget the awful experience, it will forever be burned in my mind.
They vet started with these huge scissors thing that kinda looked like a mixture between garden clippers and a monkey wrench.

They cut off the tail and then they take a needle jab it into the poor end of the tail that has been cut so they can put a stitch in it. They had to do this a couple times to get is stitched.
The puppy is screaming it's poor little head off. I was horrified. Imagine accidentally cutting part of your finger off, then having a doctor not give you any pain medicine or numbing it as they stick a needle into that raw injured part as they stitch it.

They then do the dewclaws.

Despite them using a clotting agent/glue, there was soooo much blood from both the tails and dewclaws. I was so scared the puppies had lost too much blood. And they cried for a long time, long after I put them back with their mom.
A day later one of the stitches on a pup got pulled out or torn out. I had to bandage and medicate it and watch very close for infection.

It just broke my heart seeing those puppies in so much pain.
Right then decided I would never let the vet do it again.

So I was determined to learn myself. Watching the vet obviously wasn't an option. So where to turn to? Videos on the internet of course and a good friend/mentor who walked me through the whole thing.

Now I do the pups tails and dewclaws using the proper clamp and twist method. There is very little blood, if any at all and the pups only cry for a very short time. In fact as soon as you set them down they stop. The pups experience minimal pain. And no stitches or needles going up through the tail or risking the stitch getting pulled out. The tails heal up with no scarring and look great.

I for one am very glad I learned to do it myself and I am positive my puppies are thankful for it as well.
If it weren't for the videos I wouldn't have much to go by. I spent several hours watching several videos over and over and reading how it was done as well.

I realize learning to do it yourself isn't for everyone and each situation is different, but for me it was the right thing to do. I went it to it as prepared an educated as I could be and it was all well worth it.

So I have to strongly disagree, the vet isn't always the best option when it comes to this particular topic.

Yours is an usual situation. I'm not sure what type of rapore' you had with your vet. But, when I mean learn from a vet, you learn from one that you have a relationship with, know what their practice and procedures are. Speak to them first, if you don't like what you're hearing and don't agree with what they do. Search for a new vet. Keeping in mind vets learn the basics of dew claw and tail docking, but aren't versed in each breed's standard. So, you must have input to correct measurements.

Thanks!!
I have a very good relationship with them, been going there for years. Which is why I trusted them and took the pups there the first place.
I still go to them just not for the tails or dewclaws.
I did that visit have to tell the vet how long to dock it. I know they aren't versed in the breed standards, different breeds are docked to different lengths. They wanted to cut it too short but I was told what length to do it by so I told the vet and they had no problem with it.
It was just the method they used was so wrong. And the problem was I checked all the vets around here, they all did the same thing.