Is this common from a SHOW BREEDER???
 

I bought my Yorkie from a quality show breeder. He was 4.5 mo and 31/2lbs when I got him. I was told that in order for me to have him he would have to be neutered, no problem there I want a pet.
I called her 2 days before he was to be neutered and specifically asked her if the vet she uses would be removing the remaining baby teeth and she told me “no”. :confused:Okay, so I questioned her a bit and felt comfortable with her answers.
My first visit to my vet was a month after having him, my vet questioned the baby teeth still being :confused:present and the fact that he was neutered and they weren’t removed…He said to wait a month longer if I wanted to see if they come out on their own if not I would have to have them removed. :cool:
That day I called the breeder, very upset, :mad:and explained my visit to her and again ask why it wasn’t done. She said maybe it was b/c the adult teeth weren’t ready to come when he was neutered in and the baby teeth just fall out when ready...:rolleyes:
Monday night I was brushing his muzzle hair and the comb caught his upper lip in the back, OMG, :eek:there were 2 teeth growing out sideways, :eek:it was awful!!!
I called Tue and Dudley is down TODAY getting this taken care of…I just got off the phone w/ my vet…..This is what he said “9 retainers, the lower canines probably won’t grow in normally b/c they spouted further back on the bottom gums, he had to CUT 2 teeth out of the gum area etc….it goes on….
I feel as a quality breeder, who has been in the business for MANY years, have questioned the vet, or the vet seen this as a red flag here and taken an Xray to see what was going on?
:cool:(IMO) Shouldn’t the vet have said something to the breeder and the breeder then inform me so I knew what I was in for? :cool: I just am having a hard time with all of this b/c (you all can see my previous questions/comments about teething in the past several weeks) I asked her in the beginning about having them removed….And her reply was just so cut and dry, “no they come out naturally.”
Should I contact her about this, DH theory was that as a show breeder, she just doesn’t sell many and just may not be aware?
Sorry to be long…..Looking for opinions… ;)

How old was your puppy when he was neutered? Puppies sometimes do not get their permanent teeth until they are 6 to 7 months old. That is why most people wait to have them spayed or neutered when they are little older.

I'm not sure I understand the timeline, but it sounds like he was neutered before you took procession of him at 4.5 months, is this right? That would probably be way too soon to take out the baby teeth. I imagine it varies, but you need to wait until some adult teeth are ready to come in, otherwise, it would be hard for them to eat. Joey's vet wanted to see Joey around 6 months of age, so that he could see if the teeth were indeed ready to pull, and we scheduled the surgery for 7 months. Some breeders do insist on dogs being neutered before they leave the premises, because they have been burned so many times by people who say they weren't going to breed, but then go ahead and breed. This is a tough spot for the breeder, but it's a rare dog who can have his teeth pulled at 4 ½ mouths. How old was your dog when you discovered the two rows of teeth? The breeder is correct about certain things, some teeth come out on their own, but it seems like most Yorkies need a few pulled. You say she is a "show breeder", is she a member of the YTCA?

I don't think that it's an issue specific to show breeders. Lots of folks feel you should give the teeth time to come out. At 4 1/2 months his teething hasn't really started yet. He has baby teeth but it's still a bit early for the adult teeth to come in. So I don't think that there is anything wrong that she said to leave his teeth..at 4 1/2 months he is probably just finishing getting in all his teeth in his mouth.

He was 4.5 mo when he was netured...THANKS

Ok so at that point he was just only getting all his baby teeth in his mouth. She didn't do you any disservice.

I'm not sure I understand the timeline, but it sounds like he was neutered before you took procession of him at 4.5 months, is this right?

He was netured at 4.5 mo of age, i got him a few ays after it was done.

How old was your dog when you discovered the two rows of teeth? started about 5.5 mo old.

You say she is a "show breeder", is she a member of the YTCA?
She is not a member, but has many friends here that know of her.


Thanks for your reply, you shed some light on this for me...

Lots of breeders that want to enforce the limited registration will neuter/spay the pup at the owners cost before they leave their home. They want to ensure that there is no shenanigans in the new owner as far as breeding. Being as it's done that young the pup is in the baby teeth teething stage. ...they really are working on getting in all their baby teeth. I think around the six month mark is when I saw baby teeth falling out and adult teeth growing in. With yorkies they tend to loose baby teeth up until a year on their own. Some of the smaller sized pups tend to take longer. So your show breeder didn't try to pull the wool over your eyes or neglect your pups health.

I think you should let her know about this, it's possible she didn't know that some Yorkies have to have their teeth pulled. She should have told you that while they lose some teeth on their own, many yorkies have a few that the vet has to pull. Some people wait until the age of one, if not being neutered. I'm glad you noticed this because the double row could cause misaligned teeth, and early decay.

Okay, so in your opinion the vet shouldn't have "seen" anthing or been looking for anything at 4.5 mo when he was neutered? :)
I completely understand the whole "fixing" before sending them to their new forever families. I guess since getting them at that age and the "policy" makes sense as to why it wasn't done at the same time.
I plan on getting another one in about 6 mo and hope to get it from the same breeder, now i know what to expect in a case like this.
I was under the impression they should have been out (baby teeth) :Dby 5mo.
BTW----He was 7 mo on 1/16/08. So i think the timing all worked out.

Thanks bunches

I was going to wait until he was a year but Monday night:eek: when i saw that "snaggle" tooth freaked me out. :eek: I'm glad i did it now too.
I was thinking of telling her b/c i don't think she sells as many as she keeps, :Dbut would ALL pup have to have some removed or maybe she's just been lucky to not have had any that needed them to be:rolleyes:

Yes, that's right! The thing I guess that bothers me about the early neutering thing is that so many Yorkies don't lose all their teeth on their own, and so you have to do the anesthesia thing again when they are pulled. There is always a risk with anesthesia, and it just seems safer to do it all at once. Joey's breeder sold him with a limited registration requirement, and that way, I couldn't register him with the AKC until I had him neutered. This way I was able to plan the neutering surgery to coincide with his permanent teeth coming in. I wonder if this breeder would compromise with you on the next pup, and allow you to choose the time of surgery, since she knows you now?

I think it depends on just which teeth are retained and how the new ones are starting to form as to whether or not it's critical baby teeth be removed by a certain time. Your boy would have been to young to have them removed at 4.5 months. Most yorkies are okay having baby teeth stay in until 7-8 months or longer in some cases.

I can see what the breeder was trying to do here....but man...I wouldn't want my puppy to be put under twice before it was a year old.

I got Marcel from a show breeder and she held his registrations papers until he was neutered - which I was just fine with.

I suppose even that isn't enough to deter some folks from breeding, but it's one way.

Morning after update on DUDLEY
 

Picked him up last night and Dr. told me Dudley started having loose stools. So he was concerned and gave him Barium (sp), sent me on my way w/ ramidayl "anti flammatory" and Torbutol "pain med" and Clavamox "antiobotic". :thumbup:
He said only to give pain med last night and wait on everything else until his stools were firm.....(PS-i only gave 1/2 of what Dr. rec)
This morning stools were mostly firm, so i gave all but antiob....it said "w/food" he didn't eat much this morning, a few kibbles. .....(PS-i only gave 1/2 of "pain med"again what Dr. rec)I gave him some Nutri-Cal also.
He's w/ me at work today so i can watch him.;)
He's been acting weird...running along furniture, walls, whatever like rubbing himself, rubbing his face in his blankets, (i'm sure b/c mouth is tender" is this norm?:confused:
He did get chipped y-day too, so i wonder if the rubbing is related to the chip injection area? :confused:

:cool:I onder if he needs the other part of the pain meds???:rolleyes::rolleyes: I only gave 1/2 b/c i was afraid"my experience w/ Julz & her histroy worries me for Dudley too" ANY SUGGESTIONS ON THIS???
Luckily for me there is a vet office next door if i need one.
Thanks for all of your support and advise. THIS SITE DOES ROCK!!!

P.S.
 

Dudley's weight went up to 4lbs!!!!! He gained .5lbs since Nov. HA!! It's one of those little accomplishments. ;)
YEAH BABY!!!!!!:D
I hope to see at least 6, but breeder said that might be pushing it for him, I hope not but I'll take it....the bigger the better for me!!!

At 4.5 months, his adult teeth likely had not all come in. That is a little early to have retained teeth pulled as they truly *may* come out on their own. Most people have it done when the dog is neutered, but most people also wait a little longer to neuter so that it can be done. Unfortunately, many breeders are having to result to having dogs s/n before leaving their home because there are so many dishonest people out there who will breed the dog anyway. (Not you, just generally speaking.)
Maybe she should have explained things to you more thoroughly, maybe you should have researched it more yourself, maybe the vet should have told you earlier. Hard to say who is in the "wrong" here. It sounds like it was just a miscommunication on all sides.

I've read about them rubbing their faces before, I'm not sure if this is due to the discomfort or not. When a doctor prescribes a certain dosage, I don't think it's wise you adjust the dosage, just because another dog had problems. The dosage is set for their particular weight, and if you give half the recommended amount, it might not offer much pain relief. I would follow the vet's instructions. It's great your vet is so close!

i would check this out ..there are also alot of threads here from rimadyl on the YT site ...


The Senior Dogs Project

:eek:OMG!!! I hope we see improvement so he deosn't have to be on these med's too long. I need to start his antiobotic when we get home, as of now he hasn't had loose stools and not really eating much, I've been giving him Nutri-Cal a few time throughout the day....Thanks All

As with us when the Vet prescribes a certain dose, Please give what is recommended. The symptoms you're describing could be many things including pain...He has had alot of dental work done. The vet gave him meds, Please give them to him. I know you're scared because of what happened to your other dog. But, Don't let this one go around in pain. Please call your vet before changing or stopping the dosages he put him on. You don't want him to hurt more!! Good-Luck to you both, :animal-pa

I would not worry too much about the adult canines not coming into place as your vet seems to have said might be a problem. I used to be totally paranoid about retained baby teeth throwing off their bite, but now I general wait until my kiddos are 8-9 mos old (on at least 2 of my papillons and one yorkie). Usually by then the baby incisors I thought would never fall out have fallen out (LOL) and after the baby canines are removed what are usually about 3/4 erupted adult canines have always moved into place where they need to be.

I agree. I waited 8 months with Brooklyn this time. For the first time I had a pup that didn't have to have 1 tooth pulled. I think sometimes we jump the gun. Her bite stayed perfect through the whole thing.

i agree with wylie's mom. i don't think it's good to put the dog under TWICE just because they are worried that people might breed the dogs. if they don't trust the people to neuter/spay the animal, then they shouldn't sell the puppy to those buyers.

perhaps they can charge extra. like some sort of deposit and it will be refunded once the puppy is neutered/spayed.

should definitely come up with a solution that doesn't put the puppy's health/life at risk like this!

Oh i so love your idea of the extra deposit and waiting to have everything done at once....I told the breeder i was willing to sign whatever "legally" so she felt comfortable. But i guess it's hard to make a decision on TRUST when there are usually phone calls and one ot two visits exchanged before turning teh pup over. We have a good open line of communication now so on my next one,maybe it will be differently. I wish i could get the next one at 12 wks instead of 4.5mo...HEHEHEHE

yea, i really like my idea as well! :p

they have got to come up with a solution that DOES NOT jeopardize the puppy's health! and i am sure there is a way to do that!

i got milu when she was 20 weeks old, it was a really nice age for me because she slept through the night and potty training was easy for me because she is a little older. she was still a tiny baby though when i got her. she was smaller than my smallest bunny when i first got her. now she is bigger than that bunny :)

WOW, i don't know if i could wait 20 wks....i was thinking i waited too long at 4.5 mo :D Although, the potty training is easier, he was perfect from day 1 in the crate, sleeping ALL night does have benefits. OH AND GROOMING IS A BREEZE!!!!!:p
He seems to be timid when reaching down for him, to pick up or even pet, i thought maybe that could be from being "handled" for the business:rolleyes: Not sure but he has made some improvements SLOWLY in that department.
TODAY he doing fine, I gave him pain med's y-day and he showed signs of being back to normal. vet said usually next day, so i didn't give anymore today, this afternoon he was fine when hubby checked on him. I did give the rymidal (sp) anitiflammatory. med's.

Several vets don't do both surgeries at the same time .

lol, isn't 20 weeks approximately the same as 4.5 months!? :rolleyes:

milu was my first dog, so i was already thinking that she was a lot of work. i could not imagine what it would be like if she also would not let me sleep through the night!

i guess it depends on your preference. but for milu it worked out really well to get her at that age. she is the friendliest doggie i have EVER met. the trainer said "she does not have a mean bone in her body" (because the trainer was trying to teach her to growl, and kept poking milu in the face and nose trying to get milu mad, but milu just showed her belly and said "you are supposed to be petting me, and you are doing it wrong!" lol)

glad your baby is doing well! :)

why not?