Quote:
Originally Posted by yorkietalkjilly  Even wolf pack leaders in the wild don't alpha roll their subservient pack members so where this idea came from as a tool in dog training, who knows. Subservient wolf/dog pack members voluntarily roll on their backs, expose the abdomen to curry favor, show subjugation but the pack leader never does it! I mean, he has no hands so how would he!
So the dog being 'alpha rolled' by a human gets no message other than his human is dominating him(dominating behavior is a rude, humiliating thing to do in dog culture); and he has little idea why other than to cause fear-inducing subjugation, loss of trust. 'Alpha rolling' is totally counter-productive to positive training, team-building, inducing trust and teaches the dog only fear of the dominating, rude human. Primitive trainers/dog handlers are the only ones still using it, rather than training the dog in the way he should behave with a upbeat, fun training program using positive reinforcement treat/favorite toy/pat when he obeys your request or command. Dogs love to 'win' by getting it right, work hard to do that for their leader.
Alpha rolling is some archaic, power-hungry trainer's idea of how to show the dog who's boss. Well, if a handler is really boss, he never need to roll the dog to prove it - dogs inherently recognize leadership. Dogs with true leaders for handlers/trainers/guardians happily obey to 'win' their approval and their treat/toy 'paycheck'. Dogs are just like us, want a 'pay check' and a little encouragement for a good work session. Dogs will do anything to win the approval of a true leader. Dogs ever live to please us. |
Jilly, THANK YOU!!! Myra certainly did NOT tell Dan to do that. it was that dog whisperer nonsense. I find what that man does to be tremendously barbaric. I happen to observe my girl being tremendously upset when her pack is gone. Every Wednesday, my husband leaves (he works from home) and my daughter of course goes off to school. My girl is absolutely heartbroken. I'm told when I leave she won't leave the (before pillows, now it's the love sac) spot by the door until I come home. This is exactly why I can't see that just because a camp states dogs don't think in pack terms is true. I've seen with my own eyes that that they do, in fact, retain that behavior. The problem is how we approach it. Husband gets upset (working from home) when she barks. I again and again remind him, that's her JOB. Barking is perfectly fine!!! Frantic scream barking? No, not okay, that's fine to reprimand her for. But barking? Absolutely not okay to say no. She's a dog.... not a human. If she wants something, I'm the one she comes to. Wants to play and "Daddy" and "sissy" ignore her? Mama is the one to come to. This happens for a variety of things. I hear a soft "mmmph!" I look, and there is Chewie pointing at me and wagging her tail. They can communicate quite well. I once watched her glare wickedly at a vet, and look to me for confirmation. I made eye contact, looked away, and shook my head and she stopped with the lunge. Only time I've ever seen her do that.. and he very definitely deserved it. Saying to a sick dog come here little nugget and stabbing her with a needle isn't okay, and she had a right to be angry. These are smart little guys, but they, again, aren't PEOPLE. They think and approach things differently.