Originally Posted by Belle Noir  Gemy, I could give you a hundred likes and thumbs up.
[B]I'm not worried about championships and most people aren't either. It's nice if a dog looks like it's breed, but so what if it doesn't. Breed looks change. Maybe
I have a problem with what if a dog doesn't look like its breed!Breed standards are one of the founding and guiding lights breeders look to. THat is why it should be and is extremely hard to change the standard.
It is more than just nice if a dog looks like its breed, if you are breeding to the standard, and charging folks a premium price for a well bred dog. It is what the public should get when purchasing a dog.
The show world has its faults, but still all in all, there is more than a few checks and balances, and they are getting a tad more strict over time. It is not a perfect world by any means.
I don't have the answers, except to push education.
People breeding off standard dogs aren't going to "ruin" the breed. Why? Because no one in the know, no one in the fancy, the "breed stewards" if you will, aren't going to breed to these off standard dogs.
In the main you may be right. But what about what is underneath the skin and bones, what is held within the genes? What if a parti carrier dog is championshiped as a full Yorkie, and you breed with that dog? What if a dog has hyperuricosuria which no-one tests for at least in the Yorkie world. It is only if these off standard dogs, are majorly "off" in appearance would one not to breed to a CH dog.
This is one instance of how some health and or color issues can creep into the show stock.
And I will say, that when I see so many many YOrkies out in the streets so very far off standard in so many ways, I cringe. I cringe because they are not what a Yorkie should look like. I cringe, because somehow the public gets to see these Yorkies as "representative" of the breed. This is anathema to me.
If I were breeding 20 lb yorkies, I'm not ruining the breed, because no one showing dogs are going to breed to my dogs. If I were breeding partis and other colors, I'm not ruining the breed, because the show people aren't going to breed to my dogs.
So what does it matter, SO LONG as I am breeding HEALTHY dogs? Isn't that what should matter first? Health?
Yes always health should matter first but if you have a healthy dog that doesn't meet the breed standards quite simply it should not be bred. Health is not the only criteria, albeit it is a very important one. Tempermant, breed type, coat, and color, bite, hearing, and eyes are quite important too. So is movement. All this coalsces to TYPE.
Yes, a yorkie should look like a yorkie, and not like a silky. But how many people are going to be really that much aware of the differences when they can be so subtle to the untrained eye.
Most people buying a pet aren't going to go to the show ring anyway, even if they do have full registration.
And a yorkie should look like a yorkie, not like... whatever those poor things on that site look like...
As ugly as they are, and they ARE ugly, I wouldn't care a bit, except I know that in all likelihood, they're riddled with genetic flaws, health problems and are destined for a short sad life.
That's what the middle ground is, I think.
No one breeding off standard dogs is going to ruin the breed for the show people, and the show people need to let go of the sense of entitlement that they have when it comes to breeding, and allow that there are going to be people that breed pet quality dogs. Maybe instead of castigating these people telling them they need to learn bloodlines and have a mentor and all these other requirements that are only required if you're going to be breeding for the show ring, and making these people feel unwelcomed, it would be better to guide these breeders to breed the same way that show breeders breed when it comes to the health of the dogs.
Because I think that is the most important thing.
I think that show ppl should be recognized for the knowledge and dedication they do for the breed. I don't have a sense of entitlement but I do have a very true sense of well earned pride in what I do. I dedicate hundreds or more of hours annually to study, to showing, to training, to educating. I have put my money where my mouth was, by not breeding a gal that had 2 serious and one major fault off standard, not to mention her temperament issues, so I would not show her or breed her. I destroyed my GCH males sperm at almost six 6rys old because he came up with Juvenile cataract in one eye just prior to 6 yrs old despite 3 previous clear opthamologists exams, and had DLSS, which was finally confirmed at around six years old, along with arthritic changes in his elbows, as he was front end loading to lift up from a laying down position. So in a pure monetary sense you want to guess how much I lost in retiring two breeding dogs? None of my gals fault would have precluded a healthy dog. Just too long for the breed, a little easty/westy, a roached back. So why would I breed her; even if JUST for the PET market?
By saying that only people that breed for show are reputable, (especially when we know that is an out right lie) those people that are doing the right thing, except breeding for show are being spit in the face.
If you're doing the right thing, except breeding for show, and you're still being called names, why should you waste your time doing the right thing, since you can't win for losing with the show people anyway? You know?
Like I said, I don't know what the answer to this is. I do think there has to be a middle ground. I do know that education is key, and it's not just for the buyers, but for the breeders of pet quality dogs as well, and they both have to be encouraged to do the right thing.
To me, the right thing is insisting on health certification on your parent dogs as the very minimal be you breeder or buyer.
I in another post talked about a middle ground, but that includes being assessed for structure/conformation, coat/color, bite, temperament, before a dog is allowed to be bred for the PET Market. And not to mention the health tests as well. And that presents a conundrum for the show breeding world. I only say this as my practical nature says, in the popular breeds, folks want these dogs, and quite frankly show breeders will never fulfill the market for same. We are too few.
I know I'm rambling, and I am sorry for it. I've probably a touch of heat exhaustion, and this has been on my mind the last couple days.[/QUOTE]
And now you have a response from me; also maybe a bit rambling, but there it is. |