[poosdarling]

Hello everyone, long time no see. Clearly I have been out of the forums for way too long. Anyways today I will like to share a $15,000 experience I had with a certain breeder.

So earlier this year we decided to go into showing. We searched and finally found a male. When the boy came we took him to our vet and had him checked. Everything looked great except he only had one jelly bean. Our vet advised that we contact our breeder and express our concerns. We contacted our breeder and he said that prior to shipping the boy both beans were checked and down. It may have just temporarily went up and that it was quite normal.

Okay ... we have trust in our breeder. So we wait about 1-2 weeks and we visit our vet again. Still one missing, BUT our vet said he's a little boy and it is quite common. So yes, we love and trust our vet so we ask how long should we wait before we should start getting worried. Our vet says give it about 5-6 months. We go home and email our breeder and he tells us yes the puppy's father didn't have his beans until he was 12 months old. So it probably runs in the family? Okay that sounds fine.

So we wait and wait ..... Now at 5 months. Still missing one bean, we are getting concerned. So we write to our breeder and tell him it's not going to drop and to please take him back in exchange for a show capable male. Our breeder replies well you should have returned him the moment you found out he only had one bean and that I shouldn't have waited for so long to take action. Because a 5-6 month old puppy is just not worth as much as a 2-3 month old puppy. Hmmm ... well we only waited so long because everyone said it was normal. Well I guess the jokes on us, we obviously weren't experienced enough to know better and the testicle is such a delicate subject. Really ... no one is to blame, right?

But our breeder offered us $1,000 credit toward another puppy. Which really wasn't much considering the fact that a pet quality pup is only $2,000-$2,500. But we eventually gave in when he promised us first dibs on this new girl we really liked. Even though some people thought it was silly, by allowing us to have to girl it had added more face value to the measly $1,000 credit he offered for our next boy. Ok so the deal is to pick a boy and we get the girl. Yay!

We made our picks ..... waited for them to be old enough to be shipped. Finally the day before their arrival I received an email stating both beans were there and very noticeable. And here I am thinking .... finally after 8 months of waiting for a male the day has finally come and we can finally get this show on the road.

Next day .... yay the pups are here! Still a little frusterated because the airport took FOREVER to get the paperwork to us. It was a 5 hour process just standing at customs. But it was all worth it!!! Because the pups are finally home =)

We get home and let the pups out. They weren't bouncy or playful but who could blame them. After a 7 hour flight + 5 hours at the airport I would be pretty scared too. We take them out and let them settle. We check the boys beans .... YES! They are both there and yes very noticeable. Whew! Atleast the quality check is still in order over there. I go slowly checking all the parts that I can and I get to his bite. And to my horror .... the boy has the biggest underbite ever. I immediately email my breeder and ask him what's going on and why is there no pedigree for the girl?????

He told me both pups were checked and bites were perfect. He swears and says his vet promised him the bite was good, and that the pedigree is on it's way. But the bite was NOT good ....and bad bites don't happen overnight or go back up like jelly beans.

I tell him that this is unacceptable and I cannot work with a bad bite and he is not show quality. Then he goes on to tell me well why don't you wait 3 months and see if his bite will self correct and if it doesn't we will give you $2000 credit toward your next puppy and this time it will be perfect.

Like ..... seriously???? I tell him nicely .... we made a mistake holding onto Remy (our last boy from him) for too long and we don't want to make the same mistake again. Then he goes on and leads me in circles asking me to take him to my vet and ask what he thinks. Okay fine ...I go to my vet and ask him what he thinks. My vet says the bite is bad, and underbites will not self correct and if anything it will only get worse. I go home with an official letter from my vet stating the bite is bad and the pup is not fit for what it is intended for. I scan and email the letter to my breeder.

Now he goes ... why don't you take him to the show this weekend and ask what other breeders think. Now I'm getting annoyed but okay I will do whatever I have to do to convince this guy the dog is no good. I take little Benji (we named him Benji) to the show, we show him around and needless to say everyone agrees with my vet.

I go home and email him again. I explained to him what happened at the show. Blah blah .... (other peoples input) .... and I tell him that he is not being fair to Benji and that he needs to take him back or find him a new home now. Now he says he will refund me $2,000 and help me sell Benji for $2,000. Well that sounds okay since I won't be too far out from what I paid. Okay so a few days go by and I receive an angry email. Apparently there were some negative postings on a breeder who sends dogs with no beans and bad bites. He automatically assumed the role and pointed fingers at me and told me that he has been trying really hard to help me and only for me to say bad things about him, his mother, his father and etc. Well I guess everyone has a different definition on "working hard". But okay you say that you are working hard and I will give you that. But hmmm .... now what does your parents have to do with any of this? I don't understand? I've only heard that when things get rough you run to mommy and daddy. But now I see what they mean ... stop being childish we are all grown ups.

So I tell him I'm sorry but I can no longer work with you if you are going to be so petty. Originally I asked for him to reimburse me $3,000 for both Remy and Benji. We paid $4,500 for both pups that are supose to be show quality. To reimburse us $3000 for both pet quality dogs is actually a very FAIR thing to do. Because that would have meant I spent about $2,500 each for pet males. I mean it's still not fair since we don't need pet males but we were willing to split some of the losses with our breeder.

Now this is the frusterating part. He finally agrees to send us the money back for the two bad dogs ONLY if we sent the little girl back. But WHYYYY .... we like the little girl and there is nothing wrong with her. He explains to me that it was a package deal and that if i return the boy then i need to return the girl. Well .... that doesn't make sense... I would have gladly kept the boy if you actually took the time to check his bite. I sometimes wonder if this so called vet is ALSO the same vet that checked Remy's beans! So it's not really my fault... it's not like we are trying to swindle you out of a girl. And I paid just as much for the girl as anyone else would have. So I offer to send the boy back (all expenses paid by me) as long as he sends me a proper replacement free of charge at a later date. He refuses and then tells me I treat him like Sh**.


Hmmm ..... but I'm the one who ended up with two bad dogs. You ended up $15000 richer ... so .... ????? Overall ... I paid $15,000 for ONE show quality female so far .... still no pedigree.

You can try to post your side of the story on your website or wherever your choice of place may be. But just remember this, no one is going to think you tried your best to resolve anything because you don't stand by your dogs. You replaced one bad male with ANOTHER bad male. And this time you did not even offer ANOTHER replacement. You just kept corning us into sending you more money by offering us more credit towards ANOTHER boy, promising us the next time would be perfect. When the first one should have been perfect to begin with.


Anyways at this point I think it is safe to mark it off as a total loss. I have tried to communicate with him in all sorts of way but he keeps playing games and leading me in circles. Posting on the forum is really my last resort. I thank you all for taking the time in reading my story and I hoped you all enjoyed it as much as it relieved and lifted some stress off of me.

If anyone has any advice in any other further steps or actions I can take against this guy please let me know. It would be greatly appreciated.

And just a tip in the future for those looking for a biewer puppy. Don't for once be fooled by fancy pictures. Especially don't for once think that you would be an exception once something goes wrong he will not stand by his dogs. And if a breeder doesn't care about his reputation he will not make any rights to any of his wrongs.

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UPDATE 6/19/14

I wanted to just make an update to the original post. As you all know that these dogs were purchased through Michael. However, the breeder was actually another breeder whom Michael worked closely with.

Michael, the other breeder (Marianne) and I have all come to a satisfactory mutual agreement and funds were refunded to make the pups that were not fit for breeding a "pet" status.

The two pups were rehomed to loving homes of YT members. Both pups were neutered and had baby teeth removed prior to rehoming. I am happy to say that they are now living better lives than me!!! I know because I still keep in touch with them

I would just like to conclude as I am a breeder myself. No matter how hard we try our best to start off with the best and healthiest dogs in our program. Once in a while you will always get one that doesn't turn out. It is unfortunate but that is just how genetics works. We do our best to inform the new families of any defects. But sometimes things do slip by and they don't turn out exactly what we hope them to be. Whether in size, color or other physical contributions. What makes the breeder great is whether they are willing to work with you to make you happy. So I would like thank Michael and Marianne for making things right as they have helped rehomed the two pups that are not fit for breeding.