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Originally Posted by QuickSilver  Thank you for the feedback about Brenda, I do appreciate it. I love her book on doggie body language so much that I am going to stick with her approach for now, but I will definitely keep what you said in mind.
I feel like all of us must have seen different eppy's of Cesar because the reactions differ so much. I believe I've seen Cesar use flooding all the time - in half the episodes I've watched, I saw him alpha roll a dog that was going through parxysms of fear/rage and say that he WANTED the dog to struggle as much as possible before they gave up. It was almost like watching an exorcism.
I do believe in "catch the animal doing something right" and that's how I've managed to teach most of what Thor knows. OTOH, I decided to try the clicker again today. I broke it out and "charged" it with thirty+ clicks and treats. Thor was better than he was six months ago, by which I mean that he did not head for the hills on the click, but sat ten feet away from me and shook every time he heard the click. I guess I will be sticking with "good boy" for now. |
Ok two things yes Brenda's book on body language is amazing and I like the pictures better then some of the drawing in other books
But have a look as well at Turid Rugrass book with it just to complete the picture it is call On talking terms with dogs. ( I look up the title as I can never for the life of me spel her name right. Truid is the start point for calming signals and it very much easier to read and grasp and solid.
Second ceser does use flooding it just done mainly off camera but if you do see the epsoide on the thumder storm search dog fearful that is flooding and also one on the dogs not wanting to go on slipper floors that is flooding.
Also the one that got him nailed from the human behaviourist is the one he floods a aussie that is afraid of childern by having the dog jump over his kid. Big time flooding.
Alpha rolls no dog ever gets up saying yippy lets do it again. You do it on my dog she gone in the brain and she will not be back for days and she may not come back.
As for the clicker if he is worried about it find a word. I tend wrongly to use yes as we use it to much but if I am in the middle of hanging on for dear life as my dog is setting to go off and getting treats in the word works to get food in rapid fire. I drop the word if we are in a very tight situation and just feed. If I can feed fast enough to get us away from a fool with a on coming dog that is "freindly" than we did good.
Rule of thumb is feed in anyway what you want to see again. So that can be with actual food or even just kind words.
Nancy his fancy words actually are not correctly applied to what he is actually doing. Some of these aggressive guys do not have the abitity to ever focus on anything else until you work them long and hard outside the trigger zone. If you are working in the zone they are frantic, unable to focus on you, dancing around that is flooding not desesitization at all. Flatout flodding. drat speeling going south ling week hang in will try to keep in so you can understand desesitization is only done in calm and when the dog can sit or down or be still on it own wnd not made to. It got to be the dog not the handler doing it for the dog. Ceser all to often makes or does it for the dog.
That builds fear in the dog not good learning.
So out side that frantic action you catch him trying to look at you or sit and praise or reward that stuffing out of that and teach the dog that this is what you want and only get closer once he can give yo look at me calm always.
Now that said my girl can not never has she will dance and spin if you try to get her near a dog and if you push she explodes and the mind is gone.
So then what...we work out of the zone on trusting me that I will get her by her fears. TWo words now do it. now by..... she can look at the dog she can even bark as long as she keeps moving with me right passed the dog. She can she will stop once by te dog look at me and go I did it pee a stress pee and ask for a treat. but if I try to treat her as she goes by her mind is so in panic that treas have to wait. Now this is only for when we get cornered by a dog and can not get passed or away.
This is 7 years in of heavy rehab and we can go to a dog show she not showing she can hang in the car... in the cool and be ok to take out pee and put back in with out and blown up.
This girl should not be in the world as a long time freind and former vet tec taht I say the other day reminded My girl. "sweetie you are a lucky girl by rights you should be died. NO reason non that you are alive except that you mum will not give up." I get this everytime someone that has not seen her since we got back west sees her. they can not believe she still here and doing so well.
Problem is with flooding is you kill a behaviour but you do not tend to replace it with something well enough or in a not mushy cause I got flooded or rolled mind that it sticks for long.
JL