[YorkieMother]

Bhikku

If you are intrested in why both Erin and I speck of training as we do there a long list of books and training seminars and even a course which I have attennded I can give you. Non of them by a certain someone on TV.

For starters find anything by Dr. McConnell, Dr Overall, Dr. Dunbar.
Teryy Ryan, Jean Donaldson. Pat Miller, James O heare, Dr Dodman, Dr Wright.
Karen Pryor, Melssia Alexander, Emma Parsons, Scott and Fullers work and lastly Raymond Coppinger. To name a few.

Your not going to find to many of these in your local book store they are going to have to be special ordered from dog wise or amazon or Mungo books for dogs.
I would not start with Dr Overalls as it a tough go. Fuller and Scott will curl your toe nails but it is amazing and Coppinger is not easy either but your going to walk away from that one knowing dogs are not wolves. Coppingers will teach you trying to dominate a wolf that we base so much dog trainig on will only get you killed.

Then your going to understand according to who and also that what we say is based in science not a fantasic blend of folk lore and myth. Roll up with wives tales and half truths.

Science in it every changing growning wonderous way says So. It says it needed to grow and change and not be what some assume was and really was not and it grows into waht it is now and what it will become.
Someday the way I train will be concidered wrong and not gentle enough and that will be ok as I will grow and learn and change as we learn more.

Erin... I disagree on one thing it is about the 90%.......100% of all dogs that are trained by adversives are effected negativley and the relationship is impacted by it. It not up to the owner and it does not matter if the dog still does what it is told.. adversives do not build a relationship and it does not build trust. I know you know that and I understand why you said that but I am not moving on it adversives in training are wrong!

In closing and this is closing I not fighting this battle again been there done that.
There is never any excuse to use adversives if one is willing to use ones brain and allow the dog to use the one that was given them and to work as a team.
Dogs that are allowed to use there brains are happier, healthier and genrally smarter then those told what to do ever waking minute.( Just cause one does not use adversives does not mean that we do not ask or expect our dogs to do what we ask when we ask. we just ask please and say thank you and listen to them if they say they can not do it. We tend to have dogs that listen better as we listen to them.

JL