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01-23-2022, 07:38 AM | #1 |
Yorkie Talker Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: Beulah MI
Posts: 11
| bile acids off the charts My 4 year old 3 lb female spayed Yorkie collapsed this week after being in great health. We went for a long walk, nothing unusual about it. A few minutes after we got home she went totally limp except for a small jerk every few seconds. I rushed her to the vet. She was put on oxygen, IV fluids, and a warming pad. Her heart rate was 40, they couldn't get a temperature, and she was barely breathing. A few hours later after blood tests they sent her home with Hills cans of liver care food. Her ALT was249 (normal is 1-120) AST was 414 (normal is 0-60) bilirubin was .4 (normal is 0-.5). The killer was the bile acids 248 (normal is 0-10)! A year ago her bile acids were 6. So now she is on the liver plan food and goes back for blood tests Feb3. I am terribly upset as those numbers seem like a death sentence. Any advice about diet or other measure would be appreciated. The vet ruled out possible surgery due to her small size. I am not sure the Hills liver care is so great. She eats it OK but protein is only 4.5% and mostly from soybean meal and egg "product". She is very active and young so I want her on the best food possible. We may do an ultrasound after we get the next blood test results. I also wonder if there is any possible cause for such a huge spike in the bile acids in an adult dog other than a liver shunt. Thank you https://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/mo...r-marker-1.pnghttps://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/mo...r-marker-1.png |
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01-24-2022, 05:58 PM | #2 |
Yorkie mom of 4 Donating YT Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: LaPlata, Md
Posts: 23,247
| There is nothing wrong with that food especially if something is wrong with her liver. What is the vet saying they think it is? She’s not to small for liver shunt surgery but if she ends up needed it and the Vet is uncomfortable with doing the surgery you can find a specialist. Is there any way she could have gotten into any toxins? What flea and tick and heartworm meds does she take?
__________________ Taylor My babies Joey, Penny ,Ollie & Dixie Callie Mae, you will forever be in my heart! |
01-25-2022, 06:23 AM | #3 |
Yorkie Talker Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: Beulah MI
Posts: 11
| liver According to my vet when they develop liver shunts after youth it is almost certainly multiple shunts and that type isn't operable. below I am pasting a reference from the tenessee vet univ she isn't on flea and tick and heartworm for the winter as we are in Northern MI and here we do May-Oct. "Multiple acquired shunts occur as a result of end stage liver disease (cirrhosis) and portal hypertension. These are not congenital and they are not surgically correctable." but we are retesteing after fastin and then after eating Feb 3 and by then she will have been on only Hills liver care for 10 days. If necessary then vet will do an ultrasound. She is eating well several times a day now and isn't acting sick but I doubt if the test was in error https://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/mo...r-marker-1.png |
01-25-2022, 07:25 AM | #4 |
Donating YT 3000 Club Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: E.Stroudsburg, Pa.
Posts: 67,952
| What I am about to tell you has nothing to do with your baby's condition. Heart Worm pills are to be given all year round. They are not to be stopped like flea and tick pills.
__________________ Joan, mom to Cody RIP Matese Schnae Kajon Kia forever in my A House Is Not A Home Without A Dog |
01-25-2022, 08:52 AM | #5 | |
Resident Yorkie Nut Donating YT 20K Club Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas
Posts: 27,450
| Quote:
Secondly, it is NOT true that an adult dog ONLY could have multiple shunts. Here is a link about my adult yorkie who had a shunt as an adult .... https://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/si...ver-shunt.html This is a great link about yorkies and liver disease : http://www.theyorkshireterrierclubof...re_9_16_13.pdf Diet: there is NOTHING wrong with prescription liver diet. PLEASE do not read the label and assume it is bad food. There are too many arm chair nutritionists on the internet who have advised people to do this and it is simply bad information. If you don't like Hill's then I suggest looking at Royal Canin liver diet OR do a consult with a boarded vet nutritionist. (ONLY a VET Nutritionist!) Here is a website that is amazing regarding pet food.....veterinary nutritionists there will actually answer your questions if you cannot find the information on the site. There is a search tool and LOADS of great questions and answers about pet food! www.petdiets.com When you go to the site, click on Ask The Nutritionist The other thing I am concerned about here is her age. This is when other things show up in yorkies such as GME. The fact her bile acids are elevated suggests liver, but she also could have neuro issues.....the sudden collapse is very concerning as USUALLY when an adult has a shunt show up it is because it was a small shunt that didn't show symptoms previously. What *I* would do is go to a board certified internist lickety split ESPECIALLY if my vet told me my dog was too small for surgery. That is simply scary to me that a vet would say that. If money is an issue, I urge you to get a second opinion at another general vet. To find a specialist in your area: https://www.vetspecialists.com/speci...ernal-medicine Please keep us posted. I do hope your baby is ok.
__________________ Last edited by ladyjane; 01-25-2022 at 08:56 AM. | |
01-25-2022, 09:01 AM | #6 | |
Resident Yorkie Nut Donating YT 20K Club Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas
Posts: 27,450
| Quote:
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01-25-2022, 09:55 AM | #7 |
Resident Yorkie Nut Donating YT 20K Club Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas
Posts: 27,450
| Oh wait! It just hit me about the bile acids. Are you saying they did bile acids that day? I would definitely wait to see what they are on Feb 3rd when the correct protocol is followed. For reference: http://couriers.asaplab.com.au/proto...20protocol.pdf
__________________ Last edited by ladyjane; 01-25-2022 at 09:57 AM. |
01-25-2022, 10:14 AM | #8 | |
Resident Yorkie Nut Donating YT 20K Club Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas
Posts: 27,450
| Quote:
https://www.heartwormsociety.org/pet...incidence-maps
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01-25-2022, 12:47 PM | #9 |
Yorkie Talker Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: Beulah MI
Posts: 11
| liver yes we did bile acids in 2020 and they were 6, then last week when she went into a coma they were 274. Except for the sudden coma she was happy and healthy before the coma and after it. The vet said no surgery if it is multiple small shunts which is the most common type for dogs over 1 year old. She loves the liver care diet and is eating 4-5 times a day. I always left her iams small breed down all day and she ate at will but with the canned I leave it in refrig and offer it to her several times a day. Thanks for all the info and links. I am very anxious to see the new test results but we are waiting so she is on the liver care diet for 10 days before the test https://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/mo...r-marker-1.png |
01-25-2022, 01:26 PM | #10 | |
Resident Yorkie Nut Donating YT 20K Club Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas
Posts: 27,450
| Quote:
The OTHER question is this: Was she fasting before the bile acid test was done?
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01-25-2022, 01:40 PM | #11 | |
Resident Yorkie Nut Donating YT 20K Club Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas
Posts: 27,450
| Quote:
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01-25-2022, 02:00 PM | #12 |
Yorkie Talker Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: Beulah MI
Posts: 11
| again the criteria she said was if it was multiple shunts which is generally the case in adult occurrences https://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/mo...r-marker-1.png |
01-25-2022, 02:52 PM | #13 | |
Resident Yorkie Nut Donating YT 20K Club Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas
Posts: 27,450
| Quote:
generally OK......so keep us posted
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01-26-2022, 07:22 AM | #14 |
Yorkie Talker Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: Beulah MI
Posts: 11
| thanks all I will post after her Feb 3 blood tests https://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/mo...r-marker-1.png |
01-26-2022, 07:29 AM | #15 | |
Resident Yorkie Nut Donating YT 20K Club Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas
Posts: 27,450
| Quote:
Hope it all goes well and this was just a one time weird incident.
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