Huge Bruise Or Huge Rash?
 

Hi all,

Earlier today I was giving Princeton some belly rubs, I just picked him up yesterday evening from my brothers house as I had been out of town. When we came home yesterday, I took him out and then he curled up in his crate for a really long sleep. Which is normal for him, but also my brother has a 10,5,3, and almost 1 year old so I assumed he didn't get much napping done the 2.5 days he was there.

After he napped, we went out and then it was time for me to go to bed, so I did and he hopped in with me. His harness was on this whole time and I didn't notice this but,

Today when I was rubbing his belly, I noticed what looked to me like a little redness or something in his armpit area where the harness goes. I removed the harness and the whole right side of his chest, up to his shoulder and neck was an angry red color. I panicked. I thought it was a bruise then I thought it was a rash and I honestly don't know which.

I combed his fur and noticed a small area of what looked to be like some flea dirt near the redness. But I looked him over thoroughly and see no other evidence of fleas. He hasn't been biting or scratching the area at all.

He seems normal to me behavior wise and energy wise. Eating, drinking, peeing and pooping normally.

I gave him another bath (he'd had one prior to going to my brothers house) and got a better look at the are while he was wet, It's really large.

He isn't bothered by me touching it or rubbing it. I called the vet ER and they said if it doesn't seem to be spreading I can probably wait to take him to his normal vet in the morning. Naturally I can't relax, even though he is sleeping by me right now just fine.

After a few hours since his bath, I looked over it again, and I can't tell for certain but I think it might be darkening up and maybe purpling up a bit like its a brusie and not a rash.

I asked my sister in law if she noticed him biting or scratching the area or if anythign happened that I should know about. Since the redness/bruise/rash is under where his harness usually sits I wondered if one of the kids maybe yanked him too hard while playing with him? But would it be like that?

I will post some pictures later. I've been looking the web over for pics of rashes and bruising. It looks more like bruising to me now but it could be a reaction to a bug bite. He seems fine but I was going to give him benadryl until I decided to wait to determine if its a rash or a bruise because I really can't tell.

It's nearly 3am and I'm keeping an eye on him and will be calling our vet in the morning. Anyone have experience with reaction rashes (there is no bumps, wounds, cuts, puss or oozing) or bruising on their little guy (and what it looks like exactly?)

I dont have any clippers to get the hair away from the areas so I will wait for the vet to trim if necessary.

Pictures
http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/pic...ctureid=139736

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/pic...ctureid=139738

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/pic...ctureid=139737

It does kinda look like it could be a bruise. I think I would definitely have the vet check it out.

I would have it looked at, for sure. If a bruise, I sure would want to know how a bruise of THAT size got there, my gosh :eek: :(.

I have to agree, that looks like a bruise, I would most definitely have your vet take a look at it. I would also like to know how my baby got that bruise is that is what it is.

It looks like a bruise to me as well. In the third pic there is a mark that looks like a nick in the skin.

Something happened to him. What did the vet say?

any update?

Not good. Something diffentley happened to him. Have him checked

hi all!

We went to the vet the day after posting, and the vet agrees that it is a bruise. I was pretty upset, I don't like even thinking about him being hurt.

Everything else on him looked great and he wasn't and still isn't showing any signs of being in any pain or any type of behavior change, including being timid or sleeping away from me (when he was a year old we boarded him for a week at a terrible place, and when he came home he was a different dog for a few days including sleeping in strange spots in the house and being scared when the door at the vet shut when I took him right in after picking him up from that wretched place - thats another terrible hard to think about story for another time) thankfully he's acting just like himself and following me around room to room and curling up right on me or next to me as usual.

Anyway, I really do want to know what happened. He doesn't mind it being touched or even pushed on, so I don't think it was an impact bruise, like something hitting him hard. I do have a hypothesis...

(Note: I trust my brother and his wife with him, and he's spent time there before several times while I've had to travel and has always been fine. He isn't afraid of them or show any signs of fear or timidness etc)

This is what I think *might* be what happened and I've asked my sister in law to talk to the kids. My dog is very active, and he's not the best boy on a leash. Seeing as how the bruise is under and sort of in the shape of the chest patch of the harness he had on, I think it may have been one of two things:
Either he was yanked hard by the kids while he was leashed or he was yanking himself very hard (which is something he does, but that I immediately correct/stop moving) He gets tunnel vision when he is outside and his one goal is to PEE ON ALL THE THINGS. So he tends to yank and pull very hard. Walks are workouts for me between keeping him focused on walking and not stopping at every tree or structure we pass and allowing him time to pee on things as a reward for walking how he is supposed to.

I can imagine that the 10 year old while taking him out to walk/pee doesn't know that his very hard and constant forceful pulling could be bad for him and I didn't think to teach him how to correct this (nor mentioned it to my brother/SIL)

This is what I *hope* is the cause, because thinking it was done intentionally or recklessly really makes my heart hurt. But because he isn't sore or acting any differently than he normally does, I really think it may have been this.

I can't image my tiny little 5 year old nephew or 3 year old niece yanking him hard enough to make that happen. I can't imagine the 10 year old hurting him on purpose.

I was pretty upset about it, just because its so jarring and the thought of being hurt makes me sick. But I'm going to pop in and chat with the kids tomorrow after school to see if they can tell me anything (without leading them) about his weekend.

The bruise looks a bit better already. It's not as red, and has darkened up in some spots to look more like a bruise. It still doesnt seem to be tender or to be affecting him in any way, which I am relieved about.

He's been getting EXTRA lap time though as I want him right by me every second right now out of worry, although he is fine! lol.

Thanks for the responses and concern. I'll update again as things clear up or if there's any changes or new info about how this even happened.

*Went to the vet later the same day of posting, rather

Thank you for the update!
 

Thank you for the update. I think you have a very good plan of action. The best way to get the kids to talk is if they don't feel threatened. You can deck them after they spill the beans :lol tears . I realize that there isn't anything funny about the situation - just trying to give you a smile.

So glad to hear that the bruising is going away and that Princeton doesn't have any personality changes. Your theory(s) sounds logical - either one. I don't want to offend - but you might consider helping Princeton learn some patience on his walks to avoid future injuries.

THANKS FOR UPDATING!!!!!!!!!!
More than likely it was the 10 year old. He/She needs to SEE the pictures you took, and train them and your sweet baby how to walk on the leash.

I'm looking forward to finding out the truth about how it happened.

lol I did laugh... haha.

No offense taken at all! He needs to learn patience. Especially if that's what caused this!!

I am really trying to help him learn patience on walks, he is kind of high anxiety and gets laser focused on what HE wants and he is in tact, so marking ALL THE THINGS is his huge motivator in life. He's great with commands in the house, but outside its pretty hard with him - and hes 5 now so it gets even harder because he's so set in PEE mode. lol. But I try. Most of the typical "change direction" when they pull methods don't quite work for him. I do a lot of stopping, especially when we walk in certain areas. I've found some locations that work better for him. Rewarding him outside with treats doesn't work too well at this point, because all he really cares about is peeing.

I am considering neutering him more seriously now, although I don't think that will really curb a well-set behavior pattern with him at this point. I don't know.

He's very strong for 9lbs and I definitely need to teach the younger kids how to walk with him (I have 10 nieces and nephews, my sisters older girls do fine with him outside but I can imagine the my brothers 10 year old doesn't really know and it's my fault for not going over that with him in detail)

I agree I will be talking to them tomorrow, and we will go for a walk too.

Also, going forward the rules are his harness/vest is to come off immediately upon coming back in to the house. We tend to keep it on during the day because he goes out so often, but I don't want him harnessed anymore unless he is out for a walk or to relieve himself.

Thanks for the update, sounds reasonable about a pulling dog and 10 yo tugging him back. I once had a pack of 3, all walked at the same time, all pullers, I could never train them out of pulling, this was years back, before there was any training advise on the correct way of training a dog to not pull. Neutering him now at 5 yo I don't believe will stop his behavior, it has become a habit now. Taking to the children IMO is good idea, train the children on how to walk a pulling dog. Removing his harness after each walk is the best thing to do, the harness could be rubbing his skin irritating him after a walk of pulling. Good luck with speaking with the children, I think showing them the pictures of the bruise will help the children realize how sensitive his skin is and will help when they have to walk him.

I am sorry, but I am going to simply say that my pup would not be alone with the children again. You cannot assume it was the 10 year old while walking....there are two even younger children. Children run and play and a 5 lb yorkie is at a huge disadvantage and can easily be injured.

I don't see any way a little tugging would do that.

I know many will disagree with me, but yorkies are not for children as a rule. Does it sometimes work? Yes, but I have seen far too many accidents involving children and yorkies. This was a warning sign. I am not saying it was intentional.......doesn't matter if it was or not. It happened and IMHO you are lucky it is not worse.

A Super Amen to lady Jane.

I absolutely do not think it was from pulling on the harness. My 10 year old could be a weight puller the way she has always pulled on her harness and never has it caused a bruise.I think something else had to have happened. That is why they don't really recommend small dogs to be around little kids.

Let me add this....dogs don't just pull with one side of the body. They run full speed ahead....
that said, even IF it was bruising on both sides, I still say no way to a harness doing this.

:(

(He's 9lbs 4oz just to clarify so he's a bit bigger than a 5lb dog, but he's still a little guy!!)

But yes, I have gone back and forth over whether or not I think this is what happened or not. It just seems to be in the exact shape of the chest plate on that particular harness...

except the bruising is on on one side and not centered does make me wonder.

Because he wasn't bothered by it or in any pain or averse to it being touched/pressed on and has no other type of injury I don't like to think he was kicked or hit or anything, but I really can't say for certain -- which is the worst part of this whole thing.

I agree I don't really want him alone with the kids and that until I can establish the 10 year old knowing how to walk him I think only the adults should walk him. I dont have any travel plans that he won't be coming with me for the foreseeable future so I'm not too worried about that at the moment. The next few trips I have planned Princeton is tagging along.

I'll update again after I get a chance to sit down with the kiddos and have a chat!


Also - his chest looks even better now than it did before we went to bed last night (this morning) it looks like there are like two major bruise areas and the rest of the coloring is fading and its darkening more bruise-like in two spots - kind of hard to explain. I'll take new pics. It's still the same shape and still very noticeable but it doesn't look nearly as angry as when I first found it. I wanted to have him groomed this week but I'm putting that off too although i do want his chest hair cut low so I can see the healing process better.

I honestly don't think the walking is the thing. Kids play rough.....it's normal. I just would never chance it. I thought you had said 5 lbs...but yeah, 9 isn't a whole lot different.

If the parents have not figured out what happened, I don't think you will either. Just be thankful you have gotten a warning. I have seen dogs with fractured limbs...and have seen some dropped who died. :( Children really don't mean to harm as a rule...but, they just do not understand. They want to pick them up...hug them, smother them...many of them end up getting bitten and the dog ends up being labeled a "biter". I don't mean to sound harsh about children....some really DO know how to handle little dogs but in my experience it is a rarity. My granddaughter LOVES dogs...but I would never leave her with mine. Actually one of mine did bite her one day. :eek: The other problem is that children run as I mentioned before and are not looking for a small dog underfoot.

I am glad your pup is ok!

:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

I have to totally agree with this AND with what Linda said earlier as well.

Ya know, we as adults *MUST* remember that kids' frontal lobes/brains are NOT YET finished developing. It's just a fact. This means, they simply cannot be capable of making decisions like adults are. They can be overwhelmed by emotions - sometimes those emotions can feel like they want to "smother" with love (similar to what Linda said), but they really end up hurting the animal, seriously. They go too far. They cross limits with animals.

Kids cross limits with animals and sometimes they can't really help it. This is why you don't really leave small animals in their care.

That bruise, in my opinion, is NOT explained properly - is NOT normal *at all* - and is HUGE. If this were one of my dogs, I would be crying over this, bc I know it would've been very painfully obtained, VERY. I would never, ever be leaving my dog in their care again. Something happened to this dog in their care that should never have happened. My guess is that they had this dog in the harness and may have been dropping this dog from a height or something, with the harness on, for fun :(.

I'm glad he is okay, but am very sad that something traumatizing probably happened to him, poor guy.

Hi all, (this is long, again, sorry! lol)

I will be updating with pics that I took just now a little later today but I think I have revised my hypothesis as to what happened, with a little added info.

We think it might have been the 1 year old (he will be 1 this month) he is in his throwing everything and hitting things stage and he does hit pretty hard. The other kids said he hit the dog with a toy. Whether or not this is true I will never know for sure.

However, the bruising is about the size of a quarter now and right on the center of his breast bone. It is really bizarre to me because it was HUGE. It even made me wonder if the vet was wrong about it being a bruise at all??

I was so freaked out, obviously, as you can see from the pics, but now you can barely tell it's there and this was how it was most of yesterday too. I've personally never seen a bruise clear up that quickly... I still have a tender spot on my leg where I ran into a guard rail at a movie theater months ago and had a deep large bruise for several weeks.

Princeton went there on Friday evening, and I picked up on Sunday evening and noticed the bruising on Monday. It is now Friday again. Now when I wrote my post I REALLY couldn't tell if it was a bruise or a rash, the pictures make it appear darker and more purple, but it was a really angry red color in person which is why I thought rash.

Now, there is a tiny purplish-red area around the center of his breast bone/top of his chest, but it's not very large or very dark at all.

I'm properly confused. Was the LARGE area a reaction to being hit in a centralized area? Was it a reaction to something else entirely? Was it a rash!? It really was nearly the shape of his harness, which is where that potential idea of what happened came from. He hasn't worn that harness at all since (but he'd been using that one for quite a while with no problems)

Sorry these updates are so wordy! I wish I could just ask my boy what happened!! So I'm sorta thinking out loud as I post. I was really upset and really scared at first. I'm definitely relieved that he is fine and that the massive size has gone down, but I am honestly bewildered. I dont see marks on his neck anymore, or near his armpit or the majority of that side of his chest, just mainly center on the bony area where the ribs come together.

I will have to say I didn't too much care for the vet, he gave him a good once over to make sure he was bending and moving okay and in no pain and no signs of infection/illness but he said bruise very quickly. It was not the vet we normally see and the appointment was quick. Granted for a bruise there isn't much you can do and Duke (I call Princeton this sometimes, don't know where it came from, Lol -- neither name has anything to do with either school!) wasn't in pain so he didn't need pain management. But the vet seemed pretty dismissive into really investigating it and was more worried about what he could have me spend more money on instead ("wanna schedule surgery today?!" even though I expressed fear and hesitation about having him neutered and wanted to discuss everything in depth he just wanted me to get my credit card out. It was dismissive and rude and definitely didn't set me at ease.)

I am going to see if I can get him in with his groomer today or tomorrow, but I got his chest wet again to get a better look and there just isn't much there. It's really odd you guys.

Him being smacked with a toy against that bony part where his ribs come together seems feasible and perhaps the redness was just a reaction? I dont know if he was smacked Friday or Saturday or Sunday. If that's even what happened.

The worst part of this is not knowing what exactly is going on and if it wasn't the kids at all then what was it? I am happy he is okay but I don't ever want to see that sort of coloring on him ever again, that's for sure.

Unfortunately he does have to have bloods drawn in a couple weeks for routine care (heartworm check) and I really hope he doesn't bruise up from it!!

Forget the vet...and forget trying to figure it out. Just accept this as a warning. Don't leave him there again! That is the only advice I can give you.

The appointment for blood work should not be any concern. If he bruises, he bruises. That is common. It is NOT common for him to come home from being cared for with a huge bruise of unknown origin!!

Poor Princeton, poor you. Well if your little boy shows fear when he sees these children again you'll know why. Thank goodness he's ok. I myself would never leave one of my babies where there are small children, children are fast and accidents happen. Sad that you are left with no answers as to what happened to your baby.

The fact this his skin his back to its normal color in every area aside from a small tiny spot tells me this likely wasn't a bruise. So, not to be dismissive of the concern of this community, but if it wasn't a bruise I am not going to assign that kind of blame to my sibling or my nieces and nephews and I actually DO want to know what exactly happened.

This is a weird stance to take, because if it was a RASH and NOT a bruise then it is important to know that the vet didn't know what he was talking about and THAT MATTERS

and to know that my puppy could be allergic to something or have been having a bad reaction to a bug bite. Remember in my initial post I mentioned seeing an area that looked like flea dirt and a bump in the same general area and the vet didn't investigate this at all. All of these factors are important. Pics on how his chest looks basically normal now are in the next post.

Bruises do not completely clear up in 3 days. Bruises tend to be tender. This looked like an angry red rash to the naked eye and I will not "forget" the vet or "forget" about trying to figure out what happened because it could happen again.

When I picked him up he was sitting with and loving on the kids and I stayed for a while to chat and he was being played with and there was no fear and timidness, and my boy is the biggest scaredy cat and if anything scares him once he DOES NOT deal with it again. He doesn't like rustling noises, and hides in his crate or under my bed when I open plastic bags, or when I fold sheets, or when I turn the stove on (my boyfriend caught the stove on fire on this inside once 4 years ago and he STILL is afraid of the stove being turned on)

I know when my pup is afraid and he wasn't afraid of anyone in that house. I am simply a concered mama trying to flesh out what this might have been and I don't think it was a trauma at this point. I do want to know what it was.

And I can fully understand your concern, I would want to know if this ever happened to my kido. I never had any of my babies get bitten by an insect so I wouldn't know if they would get red in such a large area as your photos shows. I do hope you can solve this mystery.

Looked like a bruise to me. Your pup...your call. All I can do is offer what I think is a sound suggestion....

I have SERIOUS doubts that any vet would not know the difference between a bruise and a rash.

You seem to want to be in a position of defending what happened so you can feel good about leaving him there again. I get that it might be convenient; but, if it were me...not a chance in that hot place. Again...your call....your pup

BTW not all bruises are tender. I am a registered nurse...not that it probably means much but I say it was a bruise.