|
Welcome to the YorkieTalk.com Forums Community - the community for Yorkshire Terriers. You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. You will be able to chat with over 35,000 YorkieTalk members, read over 2,000,000 posted discussions, and view more than 15,000 Yorkie photos in the YorkieTalk Photo Gallery after you register. We would love to have you as a member! Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today! If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please click here to contact us. |
|
| LinkBack | Thread Tools |
01-27-2020, 03:28 PM | #16 |
Donating Yorkie Yakker Join Date: May 2007 Location: Winnipeg
Posts: 372
| He is the same for everyone but he likes women better. I can pick him up if I give him notice. |
Welcome Guest! | |
01-27-2020, 04:03 PM | #17 |
Yorkie mom of 4 Donating YT Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: LaPlata, Md
Posts: 23,247
| I wonder if it is startling him when he doesn’t know your about to pick him up. How long have you had them?
__________________ Taylor My babies Joey, Penny ,Ollie & Dixie Callie Mae, you will forever be in my heart! |
01-27-2020, 04:10 PM | #18 |
Donating Yorkie Yakker Join Date: May 2007 Location: Winnipeg
Posts: 372
| About 2.5 months now. Sam was awake just now and I was looking at a knot in his fur on his hind leg. He lost it. He sure is temperamental. |
02-03-2020, 05:42 PM | #19 |
Donating Yorkie Yakker Join Date: May 2007 Location: Winnipeg
Posts: 372
| Well the boys were neutered today. I also had them chipped and complete bloodwork. Their blood is excellent. I got the bandage off Max's leg easily but Sam snarled and attacked me. I had him by the collar so he couldn't bite me but he completely lost it. If i can't get him trained, I will be getting rid of him. |
02-03-2020, 06:13 PM | #20 | |
Yorkie mom of 4 Donating YT Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: LaPlata, Md
Posts: 23,247
| Quote:
__________________ Taylor My babies Joey, Penny ,Ollie & Dixie Callie Mae, you will forever be in my heart! | |
02-03-2020, 06:23 PM | #21 |
Donating Yorkie Yakker Join Date: May 2007 Location: Winnipeg
Posts: 372
| I'm just frustrated. I am going to take them both to obedience training in March. I hope that will curb his aggression. I just don't know why he's so angry. I pamper him so much. Something happened with the last owner. I treat Max and Sam the same so they don't get jealous. |
02-03-2020, 07:00 PM | #22 |
Donating YT 3000 Club Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: E.Stroudsburg, Pa.
Posts: 67,929
| Happy to hear they are neutered, chipped and blood work turned out good. I don't think Sam needs obedience training, with his aggression obedience training will not help that. A dog behaviorist will work with him to see what triggers the aggression and work on that. Something in his past has caused fear in him when someone reaches out to him, he's scared and reason he attacks, he's protecting himself, someone in his past hurt him, maybe beat him. He's young enough to have that trained out of him, you need the proper trainer for that. You mentioned you held him by his collar when he tried to attack him, collars are for tags only, when on a leash they should have harnesses on. It's horrible what ppl do to these sweet loving dog. Please find the proper trainer for Sam before you get rid of him. If it has to come to that, please follow Lovetodream advise, turn him over to a yorkie rescue, please to not bring him to a kill shelter. It's not his fault, someone made him that way, he's young and he's fixable with the proper training. Please keep us updated on how Sam is coming along.
__________________ Joan, mom to Cody RIP Matese Schnae Kajon Kia forever in my A House Is Not A Home Without A Dog |
02-03-2020, 08:18 PM | #23 |
Donating Yorkie Yakker Join Date: May 2007 Location: Winnipeg
Posts: 372
| I've had many yorkies and never experienced anything like Sam. I would use a harness but I'd never get it on him. He'd attack me. So unfortunately until he's trained, I have to use a collar to walk him. My other yorkies never needed a collar. This is new to me. |
02-04-2020, 06:43 AM | #24 |
Donating YT 3000 Club Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: E.Stroudsburg, Pa.
Posts: 67,929
| Wow, this has to be so hard on you. With all the yorkies you have had you must know using collars can cause collapsed trachea. I fully understand your dilemma and reason for having to use the collar. This poor poor dog, this is all from someone in his past harming him, I am sure of this. Like I have said, he is young and with the right trainer he IS fixable, I just do not think basic obedience training will train out his aggression, it can make it worse. I truly believe a dog behaviorist is what Sam needs, a trainer that will focus on his aggression. In Sam's case if he senses fear in you of him he will take control. And I do understand, no one wants to get severely bitten by a dog. Please keep us updated.
__________________ Joan, mom to Cody RIP Matese Schnae Kajon Kia forever in my A House Is Not A Home Without A Dog |
02-04-2020, 12:03 PM | #25 |
♥ Love My Tibbe! ♥ Donating Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: D/FW, Texas
Posts: 22,140
| Here's some thoughts on retraining poor or bad behavior out of a dog. The owner/handler must be totally eager to show their dog how to live another way and motivated enough to stay 3 steps ahead of them in every situation, prethinking and outmaneuvering every response during behavior modification retraining. It is no small task to truly change a fear-aggressive dog but you almost always can. Mostly, the expert obedience or behavior-modification handlers train the owner how to handle and understand their own dog, how to see life from his POV, think how he thinks and and how to gear themselves up to motivate the dog to WANT to learn how to behave differently because he sees change as a win. If the dog sees any behavior as a win, he'll readily go along, wanting more and more benefits for changing of happy praise, treats, positive rewards, oodles of smiles from you, etc. But I think if an owner is not strongly motivated to be an excellent dog handler, he'll always have problems with his dogs, no matter how much obedience/behavior retraining takes place by expensive experts. Just takes the intense interest, the determination of the dog owner to WANT to remake his dog. Most people just don't have that level of interest and never have completely controllable dogs, which can be fine. Not everyone has that level of determination or dog handling skills or want-to. Our pets don't have to be perfect. Obedience training or behavior modification are 2 very different things and many dogs do well on the positive-reinforcement they get from working together to learn simple obedience skills and prosper greatly with that method. Behavior modification teaches the dog a new, better, more rewarding way to react to former problem situations and the owner being skillful and determined enough to stay 3 steps ahead of his dog until he has managed to gain control the old, unwanted behavior in EVERY case. The dog changes his behavior in a specific situation because he's been properly motivated to want to change - for a reason. The best way is he expects a very positive reward for his new behavior. If he gets it wrong, we give him a negative frown, an "uh oh" to mark his miss and redirect him to the positive reaction we want and expect, with much gleeful praise and treats for getting it right during his retraining. It's up to his handler to know how to instill that motivation in his dog and can drive all positive behavior change. If a dog is not motivated to change his behavior, he won't or he won't for long. It's constant work until your dog LEARNS to respond to your directions by rote, automatically, unthinkingly. He never gives not responding correctly a thought; in fact he eventually, slowly LEARNS your way benefits him most. Once you attain that level of interaction, he begins to try to stay 3 steps ahead of YOU and automatically does what he's pretty sure you'll want from him, based on all your training and previous interactions, which he's studied like mad over the time he's spent with you; and boy, is that a state of nirvana when you eventually get there! I train dogs to love reacting positively to my requests immediately and w/out thinking about it and they all begin to outthink ME eventually, automatically behaving as I want just for the pleasure it gives them to make me proud. It is a learned skill and one that dog soon does from muscle memory. Automatically reacts as he thinks you'll like to every situation simply because his reward for doing so makes HIM happy. Takes about 3 years to get a problem dog there but it's doable and so worth it if one is so motivated. But it requires you being hyper alert to pre-think everything your dog might do in EVERY situation and physically step in front of him, block him with a frown on your face, an "uh oh" verbal feedback and reward his turning around, backing down every time he thinks of lunging or growling, biting at another dog or you. The turn around/back down warrants smiles, happy partying and treats right there in the middle of the living room, store or the street. Happy times! He's earned it! Soon, you'll see him catch himself as he knows the reward he's about to get will be far more rewarding than any charge he'll get from lunging at another dog. No, he'll be busy trying to prethink YOU. Usually dogs lunge or growl/bite out of fear, having decided the best defense is a good offense but they can unlearn that, be re-directed with enough positive determination by the handler, always thinking way ahead of how their dog might react and he begins to think you know everything about him, that it's just best to work to please you than cross you. His learned trust, fostered during the training/bonding process, in you sustains and grows with every win he gets and soon, he's obeying you before you give a request, an action you always reward with big praise and fun times during retraining. After he's learned it, the praise is more restrained as he doesn't need the big party anymore, his big reward is internal, in his own brain chemistry, the oxytocin his brain releases, a great feeling, by knowing he's pleased his team leader and works as one with you. Funny how that happens but it does, they just signal they don't need all the big party rewards, just your fond look or smile, a gentle nudge or touch. Even poorly obedience trained dogs can learn a new way and eventually change but as I always say, the trainer has to be more determined than the dog they are retraining. Few people are but if you are one of them, it's very rewarding to see that problem dog change over the years into a model citizen who trusts you beyond measure and wants nothing more than your pride in him, so much so that he prides himself in always behaving as he knows you'll approve of. But if our dogs are not perfection, it's okay as long as they don't scare, hurt or destroy things. None of us is perfect. Just know, if you are not more determined than your dog and willing and motivated to help him in EVERY instance, to prethink and outmaneuver him well ahead of his thinking of how he'll react, he'll likely not change much. Good luck if you wish to embark on this level of retraining. It's a lot of work, constant vigilance of your dog during the retraining and greatly rewarding to you both. Your dog may get addicted to all the pleasures of this type of retraining and push you for more!
__________________ Jeanie and Tibbe One must do the best one can. You may get some marks for a very imperfect answer: you will certainly get none for leaving the question alone. C. S. Lewis Last edited by yorkietalkjilly; 02-04-2020 at 12:06 PM. |
02-04-2020, 12:25 PM | #26 |
♥ Love My Tibbe! ♥ Donating Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: D/FW, Texas
Posts: 22,140
| P. S. Forgot to add that I usually produce a high-value treat paired with a happy request or anything the dog values highly to encourage the turn-around or back-down, thus directing his attention to the thing he wants and if he follows suit and complies, more rewards, smiles, praise, a stern frown and total blocking of unwanted behavior during early training if he's a bit slow on the uptake. Smart, properly motivated dogs choose the treat or the toy and the smiles over the other quickly and eventually learn there's no other way. The dog is NEVER punished or demeaned, verbally berated for getting it wrong, just blocked with unhappy faces, "uh oh" sounds and whatever body part or small pillow or whatever I have at the ready to encourage his wanting to get it right rather than wrong during early training. He soon learns I'm always and forever ahead of him and begins to rethink how he'll respond, quickly learning to love the good times vs. the other. Dogs hate to be outfoxed and they'll work hard to beat you to it once they get it.
__________________ Jeanie and Tibbe One must do the best one can. You may get some marks for a very imperfect answer: you will certainly get none for leaving the question alone. C. S. Lewis |
02-04-2020, 01:01 PM | #27 |
♥ Love My Tibbe! ♥ Donating Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: D/FW, Texas
Posts: 22,140
| OHmygosh, these 2 babies are precious! You are indeed blessed with 2 little dolls; still, aren't they all? Such cutie pies. With little bits like these, retraining old, unwanted behavior is usually quite easy and so rewarding if you are motivated and determined to help your dog through his moments of poor judgment. Just stay 3 thoughts and moves ahead of them, project your problem-one's next moves and block, redirect to what you want so your baby comes out the winner of the encounter. Always end your interactions on a win for him. Lots of happy, high-pitched, happy praise for getting it right. He'll feed off that! Just out-terrier your terrier! It's the 115 lb. big old growler, teeth showing-fear-aggressive biter that can be a real challenge.
__________________ Jeanie and Tibbe One must do the best one can. You may get some marks for a very imperfect answer: you will certainly get none for leaving the question alone. C. S. Lewis |
02-05-2020, 10:50 AM | #28 |
Donating Yorkie Yakker Join Date: May 2007 Location: Winnipeg
Posts: 372
| Two days after being fixed and no change. I had bloodwork done and they are completely healthy. Poor Sam pooped this morning and had poop all over his bum. I couldn’t get near him to clean him. I had to use the hose outside. He was so upset and I feel terrible. He is going to see a behaviourist in March. In the meantime would the vet have a sedative that they could give him? Or would a ThunderShirt be worth a try? I think he was abused by a man before I got him. My mom told me she will take him if he doesn’t respond to the training. Last edited by dcapper; 02-05-2020 at 10:52 AM. |
02-05-2020, 11:55 AM | #29 |
I♥PeekTinkySaph&Finny Donating Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Baltimore, Maryland
Posts: 18,865
| For some immediate tools I would keep a halter and leash on both of them even in the house and that way you have something you can grab to separate both of them or to keep the one off of you when he attacks. Another thing you can try is taking a kind of a thick towel and wrap it around his neck gently but that will keep him from being able to turn to bite you. Always be calm working with him. Hope this helps. Exercise before attempting grooming may help to burn up some of his energy.
__________________ Kat Chloe Lizzy PeekABooTinkerbell SapphireInfinity |
02-05-2020, 12:05 PM | #30 | |
Donating YT 3000 Club Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: E.Stroudsburg, Pa.
Posts: 67,929
| Quote:
I agree, I believe this poor dog was beat and reason when you reach out for him he gets aggressive, protecting himself. It could have been by a man but, my family consists of mostly woman. When I had a pack of 3, my youngest one would go after the heels of any man that came near her. When repair men came in I had to lock her up. I believe it was the masculine voice and the tallness towering over her, there were 2 males in my family that she was ok with because she saw them a lot, she was use to soft woman voices. I bought her as a wee lil puppy so she wasn't abused. As for them being neutered, again in a earlier post I wrote do not expect overnight changes after they get neutered, everything takes time. You will see changes over time but not in 48 hours. These are rescues even if you paid money for them to some woman who no longer wanted them, they still come with baggage. A behaviorist will work with you and Sam, the trainer will show and tell you how to retrain Sam, you will have to work with Sam using the method the trainer told / showed you. Do not think the behaviorist comes in, sees what triggers Sam's aggression and fixes it, behavior problems has to be worked out of a dog, retrain him and this does not happen in a week or two, it all depends on the dog and the consistency of your training him during the week everyday. He will respond to training, but that is all up to you in being consistent, you have to put the time in, in retraining this poor little dog. I am glad to know that your mom will take him. Here is a poem, I hope it can help you understand what Sam is going through. Now that I'm all home, bathed, settled and fed, All nicely tucked in my warm new bed, I'd like to open my baggage lest I forget, There is so much to carry, so much to regret. Hmmmmm, Yes, there it is right on the top, Let's unpack Loneliness, Heartache and Loss, And there by my leash hides Fear and Shame, As I look on these things I tried so hard to leave, I still have to unpack my baggage called Pain. I loved them, the others, the ones who left me, But I wasn't good enough; for they didn't want me. Will you add to my baggage? Will you help me unpack? Or will you just look at my things and take me right back? Do you have the time to help me unpack? To put away my baggage, To never repack? I pray that you do; I'm so tired, you see. But I do come with baggage; will you still want me?
__________________ Joan, mom to Cody RIP Matese Schnae Kajon Kia forever in my A House Is Not A Home Without A Dog Last edited by matese; 02-05-2020 at 12:07 PM. | |
Bookmarks |
|
|
Thread Tools | |
| |
|
|
SHOP NOW: Amazon :: eBay :: Buy.com :: Newegg :: PetStore :: Petco :: PetSmart