hypoparathyroid?? + PLE/LYMPHANGIECTASIA

[TraceyAnn]

My poor Tucker had diarrhea for 2 weeks and was on flagyl, that's getting better, BUT, the vet ran labs, and his calcium level is 5.9, she said she thinks it's hypoparathyroid. She wants him to take .1 microgram of calcitrial, which only 1 pharmacy is willing to make the dose for his 7lb. size. I get it tomorrow. I gave him a 1/2 a tums last night and today till the script. is done, and he looks alittle better. Does anyone know the prognosis on this, anyone have this with their guys, is this just another nail in his coffin? I would appreciate any advice. Even alternative calcium ideas or places to purchase. I think the vet said this calcium could run $120.00 a month. I think that price is a extreme for calcium.
Thanks Tracey

[kalina82]

I would ask to be referred to an internal medicine specialist. low calcium level can be from other things too.

how was the phosphorous level? Is he showing any neurological signs? lethargy? increased water intake or urination?

[ArmaniMan]

Im so sorry you are having these issues, here is some information you may find helpful:

Please do not supplement without have a full thyroid panel as calcium alone will not determine thyroid issues so you really need a full 6 panel thyroid done by the vet. You can send the blood work to www.hemopet. com to jean dodds and have a second opinion done by her before doing anything.

Low calcium can be a symptom of alot of things like ple, lymphangiecstasia, epi so those are a few things to be concerned about in a dog having diarrhea as well.

As far as calcium sources: Tums are a source of calcium but bone meal is a better source of calcium.

What else is going on with this dog any symptoms?

What are you currently feeding? as that could be why calcium is low too, if its not a balanced diet.

[TraceyAnn]

Tuckers thyroid the vet said is only slightly low, she wasn't that worried. She is only concerned with the very low calcium. The diarrhea was checked and it had funky organisms in it, probably due to getting into compost in the garden, which is now fenced off. He's protein levels were low, vet said probably from the diarrhea. They also straight cathed him for urine, and it came up ok. His pancreatic enzymes were a little elevated. I gave him a 1/2 of a tums 2x already while waiting for this pharmacy to make his script. He is much better. Stronger, more alert, I originally thought he was acting strange from the flagyl, but it had to be from his calcium levels being so low. The pharmacy actually called me this morning to pick the flavoring Tucker would prefer, chicken,beef, or liver, and the price isn't 120.00, it's 64 ot 65.00. Much better. He goes this friday for repeat lab work, just to make sure things are improving. The food he eats is acana all day, then chicken breast and veggies in the evening, with nupro powder in it. He has been eating alot of sweet potatoes with his flagyl, thinking it would prevent stomach upset. I am now on a mission to find out all I can about hypoparathyroidism. Especially the prognosis. If anyone has any input, I would greatly appreciate it, Thanks alot, Tracey

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by TraceyAnn

Tuckers thyroid the vet said is only slightly low, she wasn't that worried. She is only concerned with the very low calcium. The diarrhea was checked and it had funky organisms in it, probably due to getting into compost in the garden, which is now fenced off. He's protein levels were low, vet said probably from the diarrhea. They also straight cathed him for urine, and it came up ok. His pancreatic enzymes were a little elevated. I gave him a 1/2 of a tums 2x already while waiting for this pharmacy to make his script. He is much better. Stronger, more alert, I originally thought he was acting strange from the flagyl, but it had to be from his calcium levels being so low. The pharmacy actually called me this morning to pick the flavoring Tucker would prefer, chicken,beef, or liver, and the price isn't 120.00, it's 64 ot 65.00. Much better. He goes this friday for repeat lab work, just to make sure things are improving. The food he eats is acana all day, then chicken breast and veggies in the evening, with nupro powder in it. He has been eating alot of sweet potatoes with his flagyl, thinking it would prevent stomach upset. I am now on a mission to find out all I can about hypoparathyroidism. Especially the prognosis. If anyone has any input, I would greatly appreciate it, Thanks alot, Tracey

WHOA hold on compost in the yard this could be fungal related you need to go read a thread on here and contact manolosmom as her dog ate fertilizer and had a fungal infection and due to diarhea protein will be off. They need to rule out fungal before giving your dog any steroids for ibd or anything like that. I would get to internal medicine specialist and ask about compost and fungal infection first off. I do not think this is thyroid related AT ALL. My dog has hypothyroid and her thyroid was t4free .38 and you can only determine thyroid by doing a full 6 panel thyroid but biggest indicator is t4free which normal for a yorkie is 1.0. Hemopet/Hemolife, HEMOPET a full animal blood bank, Diagnostic Laboratory, Adoption and Consultation - dr dodds is the expert on hypothyroid and why i went to her with my dog so i would get a second opinion on that .

Low calcium, low cholesterol, and low protein can be tied to lymphangiecstasia, ple or epi. A dog with these issues will have diarrhea. But if this all started after the compost incident you need to rule out a fungal infection asap. What to ask about is histoplasmosis so ask your vet if that can be a possibility.

Hypothyroid dogs can be over weight, sluggish, have a stinky odor about them due to sebaceous gland excretion, skin issues and loss of hair - not diarrhea and not low calcium as my dog does not have low calcium and she is hypothyroid and on soloxine for it as well

http://www.petplace.com/dogs/hypothy...ogs/page1.aspx

[dwerten]

Histoplasmosis in Dogs

pm manolosmom she knows all about this

Her dogs blood work was perfect though

what did they say the funky organisms were? There is a $200 fecal through antech which goes over everything including clostridium so maybe that will give you more answers

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by dwerten

WHOA hold on compost in the yard this could be fungal related you need to go read a thread on here and contact manolosmom as her dog ate fertilizer and had a fungal infection and due to diarhea protein will be off. They need to rule out fungal before giving your dog any steroids for ibd or anything like that. I would get to internal medicine specialist and ask about compost and fungal infection first off. I do not think this is thyroid related AT ALL. My dog has hypothyroid and her thyroid was t4free .38 and you can only determine thyroid by doing a full 6 panel thyroid but biggest indicator is t4free which normal for a yorkie is 1.0. Hemopet/Hemolife, HEMOPET a full animal blood bank, Diagnostic Laboratory, Adoption and Consultation - dr dodds is the expert on hypothyroid and why i went to her with my dog so i would get a second opinion on that .

Low calcium, low cholesterol, and low protein can be tied to lymphangiecstasia, ple or epi. A dog with these issues will have diarrhea. But if this all started after the compost incident you need to rule out a fungal infection asap. What to ask about is histoplasmosis so ask your vet if that can be a possibility.

Hypothyroid dogs can be over weight, sluggish, have a stinky odor about them due to sebaceous gland excretion, skin issues and loss of hair - not diarrhea and not low calcium as my dog does not have low calcium and she is hypothyroid and on soloxine for it as well

Hypothyroidism in Dogs

Just want you to understand the OP said hypoparathyroid not hypothyroid, there's a difference between the parathyroid glands and the thyroid gland. The parathyroid glands are located behind the thyroid, and control the amount of calcium in the blood.

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

Just want you to understand the OP said hypoparathyroid not hypothyroid, there's a difference between the parathyroid glands and the thyroid gland. The parathyroid glands are located behind the thyroid, and control the amount of calcium in the blood.

ok thanks so would that not show up on a thyroid panel though? Here is what i pulled up for hypoparathyroid from a vet website

Structure and Function of the Endocrine System in Dogs

I just think with that compost thing prior I would ask more questions

My bad as sometimes people post things spelled wrong so since hypothyroid runs in this breed more so than hypoparathyroid as have not heard of a yorkie having this just assumed but you know what they say about assuming lollll

[megansmomma]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

Just want you to understand the OP said hypoparathyroid not hypothyroid, there's a difference between the parathyroid glands and the thyroid gland. The parathyroid glands are located behind the thyroid, and control the amount of calcium in the blood.

You are correct about the Parathyroid glands being located behind the thyroid. There are 4 pole to a parathyroid gland and you need at least 1 to function. If they are not functioning properly they will leech calcium from other parts of the body ie bones and can also cause kidney stones. In humans many times there is a growth on one of the 4 glands that is holding on to and leeching the calcium. I'm not sure how that would apply to a dog. Are they suspecting a growth? What do they think the underlying cause of this to be?

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by dwerten

ok thanks so would that not show up on a thyroid panel though? Here is what i pulled up for hypoparathyroid from a vet website

Structure and Function of the Endocrine System in Dogs

I just think with that compost thing prior I would ask more questions

My bad as sometimes people post things spelled wrong so since hypothyroid runs in this breed more so than hypoparathyroid as have not heard of a yorkie having this just assumed but you know what they say about assuming lollll

Thyroid problems are more prevalent than parathyroid problems in humans as well. Last I read, they didn't know that much about the parathyroid, and how they actually work, or what their relationship is with the thyroid, maybe that's changed now, but from what I understand, doing the thyroid panel test gives you no information on the parathyroid, it's a completely different gland with a completely different function. The thyroid gland regulates metabolism at a cellular level, and the parathyroid, regulates how much calcium is in the blood. With humans, parathyroids have been thought to be involved with "some" types of kidney stones, not sure this would crossover to dogs, as from my understanding the stones in dogs usually form in the bladder, not the kidneys.

Megansmama, I see we were posting at the same time!

[dwerten]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

Thyroid problems are more prevalent than parathyroid problems in humans as well. Last I read, they didn't know that much about the parathyroid, and how they actually work, or what their relationship is with the thyroid, maybe that's changed now, but from what I understand, doing the thyroid panel test gives you no information on the parathyroid, it's a completely different gland with a completely different function. The thyroid gland regulates metabolism at a cellular level, and the parathyroid, regulates how much calcium is in the blood. With humans, parathyroids have been thought to be involved with "some" types of kidney stones, not sure this would crossover to dogs, as from my understanding the stones in dogs usually form in the bladder, not the kidneys.

Megansmama, I see we were posting at the same time!

Ok thanks so much as have not seen this ever in dogs so seemed odd to me too

I can check with Jean Dodds on this as well as now it has me real curious.

I am more concerned though with the compost being prior to this occuring and diarhea and organisms found in fecal. I would attribute more to that and loss of protein etc to the diarrhea as not abnormal in breed to have loss of protein with intestinal issues and seems to be more common than hypoparathyroid I would think but could be wrong

[megansmomma]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

Thyroid problems are more prevalent than parathyroid problems in humans as well. Last I read, they didn't know that much about the parathyroid, and how they actually work, or what their relationship is with the thyroid, maybe that's changed now, but from what I understand, doing the thyroid panel test gives you no information on the parathyroid, it's a completely different gland with a completely different function. The thyroid gland regulates metabolism at a cellular level, and the parathyroid, regulates how much calcium is in the blood. With humans, parathyroids have been thought to be involved with "some" types of kidney stones, not sure this would crossover to dogs, as from my understanding the stones in dogs usually form in the bladder, not the kidneys.

Megansmama, I see we were posting at the same time!

Parathyroid is measured in with a blood draw for PTH levels (parathryoid hormone levels) and that is how they can tell if the parathyroid is producing the correct amount of the hormone as well as the amount of calcium in the blood. At least that is what is done with humans.

The parathyroid is something that I have a lot of hands on experience with since this involves my career. I am not sure how it would all relate to animals but I could discuss this on a human level.

Many times post op human's with dementia that is onset from a parathyroid issue will regain their mental capacities following surgery. Much science and medicine is based on animals.

What did the Vet say would be the complications from the hypo-parathyroid issue?

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by megansmomma

Parathyroid is measured in with a blood draw for PTH levels (parathryoid hormone levels) and that is how they can tell if the parathyroid is producing the correct amount of the hormone as well as the amount of calcium in the blood. At least that is what is done with humans.

The parathyroid is something that I have a lot of hands on experience with since this involves my career. I am not sure how it would all relate to animals but I could discuss this on a human level.

Many times post op human's with dementia that is onset from a parathyroid issue will regain their mental capacities following surgery. Much science and medicine is based on animals.

What did the Vet say would be the complications from the hypo-parathyroid issue?

Oh that's interesting, especially the dementia aspect.

In her original post the OP said that the vet said that "calcium level is 5.9, she said she thinks it's hypoparathyroid." Hypo usually means slow, so I guess that means a slow working parathyroid that isn't producing enough calcium in the blood. The OP wanted to about alternative calcium, as the type she was told to buy was very expensive. I do know that you have to be careful about the type, as some is not absorbed as well as others, or it must be in some type of combination, for best absorption. According to her second post the pharmacy came up with a better price now.

To the OP, if this is a suppliment that will be needed for a long time, you might be able to find better prices on the web, they can contact your doctor if a prescription is needed. I wonder if the diarrhea could cause a low calcium test result?

[TraceyAnn]

I don't remember the name of the funky organism, the vet was looking for giarda? originally, but that was negative, she said she normally sees one or two bad things on the screen, but he had multiple ones, that's why she said instead of 10 days of flagly she wants him on for 14 days. After she was so pleased with his breathing issues and 1lb weight loss, she realized he turned 7 years old and wanted a senior lab package done, I agreed since I put everyone on a grain free diet, I was curious about any lab changes. He took his 1st pill, and that night no diarrhea, that lasted 2 days, but then he was looking ill, so I looked up flagly side effects, and he had almost all less common ones, pawing at the mouth, GI upsets, which then the diarrhea at night returned, just one loose stool at night and one during the day. He would perk up during the day, but then look ill about 2 hours after eve. meal and dose. THEN the phone call came that his labs were messed up and she was concerned about the calcium. I think it was 6.8, she said you can seizure at 6, then we repeated it, and it was 5.8, she said give some tums till I can get the pharmacy to make the correct dose. She said hypoparathyroid oftem comes from thyroid surgery and the parathyroid is accidentally removed or damaged. But Tucker doesn't fit that bill. Something's going on with this para thing, because she said she has another dog or two with it, but they are different breeds. Tucker came from a bad bad place in texas, we all know from who, he was sold as is due to a parrot jaw, and I was afraid someone would buy him and he would starve because of the jaw. He always gets into things, everytime we think the yard is stripped of anything he could put in his mouth, he shocks me by bringing in a stone or something. At the present time there is no diarrhea, and I picked his beef flavored calcium up and he had one dose. I can't wait till friday's lab work. He will need routine labs to see where he's at with the calcium. Vet said too much is harmful also. I think it's hard on the kidneys. I think, I am reading and hearing so much I'm confused. But again any input is greatly appreciated. Tracey

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by TraceyAnn

I don't remember the name of the funky organism, the vet was looking for giarda? originally, but that was negative, she said she normally sees one or two bad things on the screen, but he had multiple ones, that's why she said instead of 10 days of flagly she wants him on for 14 days. After she was so pleased with his breathing issues and 1lb weight loss, she realized he turned 7 years old and wanted a senior lab package done, I agreed since I put everyone on a grain free diet, I was curious about any lab changes. He took his 1st pill, and that night no diarrhea, that lasted 2 days, but then he was looking ill, so I looked up flagly side effects, and he had almost all less common ones, pawing at the mouth, GI upsets, which then the diarrhea at night returned, just one loose stool at night and one during the day. He would perk up during the day, but then look ill about 2 hours after eve. meal and dose. THEN the phone call came that his labs were messed up and she was concerned about the calcium. I think it was 6.8, she said you can seizure at 6, then we repeated it, and it was 5.8, she said give some tums till I can get the pharmacy to make the correct dose. She said hypoparathyroid oftem comes from thyroid surgery and the parathyroid is accidentally removed or damaged. But Tucker doesn't fit that bill. Something's going on with this para thing, because she said she has another dog or two with it, but they are different breeds. Tucker came from a bad bad place in texas, we all know from who, he was sold as is due to a parrot jaw, and I was afraid someone would buy him and he would starve because of the jaw. He always gets into things, everytime we think the yard is stripped of anything he could put in his mouth, he shocks me by bringing in a stone or something. At the present time there is no diarrhea, and I picked his beef flavored calcium up and he had one dose. I can't wait till friday's lab work. He will need routine labs to see where he's at with the calcium. Vet said too much is harmful also. I think it's hard on the kidneys. I think, I am reading and hearing so much I'm confused. But again any input is greatly appreciated. Tracey

Oh wow, it sounds like it was a good thing she caught it if seizure can be produced at 6. I don't know much about it, usually they have trouble with the parathyroids if there is some type of neck injury, I'm not sure what else can cause it. Don't know if it could be related to him picking up stones, and some type of injury occurred. The body has to be in such a delicate balance, one thing off can screw up everything. What's parrot jaw?