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10-03-2007, 07:05 AM | #1 |
YT Addict Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: West Chester, OH
Posts: 410
| Stressed out, what should I do? My vet just called. Two Fridays ago, I took my little Lucy in for a full panel of bloodwork and an Acid Bile Test prior to her spay, which is currently scheduled for October 11. Well, the vet called back and said that her blood work came back abnormal, and that Lucy was showing low protein levels and she wanted me to drop off an urine sample and also reschedule some of the bloodwork. Which I did. Her urine sample showed that she wasn't losing protein so that was good. This morning Lucy had some other blood work done and the vet just called me and said that her protein levels are a little higher and they say they are in normal range on their machine but not on the machine that they sent the last bloodwork. So that I had a couple of options. I could go ahead and get her spayed and hope that she comes out of the anthesia or I can have an X-Ray done which she said would basically just let her know if the liver is really small or if it is really large, but other than that wouldn't tell me anything. She said that I could also get an ultrasound performed which would probably cost about $500 and they might be able to tell me if her liver is fine. So now i"m not sure what to do. My sister just went through this and they performed a liver biopsy on her dog and he is fine. He was put under anthesia before they even knew this problem existed. Well I just am not sure what do to do. Her acid bile numbers pre was 14 and post was 15, which is elevated but she said usually numbers over 20 show a liver compromise but you can never be too careful. I'm so concerned and worried.
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10-03-2007, 07:11 AM | #2 |
Piper & Sebastian Donating Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: florida
Posts: 14,495
| I'd go with the vets recommendation. If she thinks she'll be ok I'd go for it. If not have the test done.
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10-03-2007, 07:15 AM | #3 |
And Rylee Finnegan Donating Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Metro Detroit, MI
Posts: 17,928
| You must be very frustrated. I'm sorry you're going through this. The post bile acid is fine. The pre is atleast 4 points high but that doesn't look concerning. Please be careful if they talk you into an ultrasound. I guess it depends on what they are looking for on it. If they want to see the size of the liver it might be okay. If they want to see specific problems with the liver (like shunts which I HIGHLY doubt since those numbers are WAY too low for that) you have to have an expert ultrasound reader and sometimes they mess up so it could be a waste of money. It all depends what they are looking at.
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10-03-2007, 08:09 AM | #4 |
Senior Yorkie Talker Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Fresno, CA
Posts: 179
| Kiwi's bile acid numbers were higher than yours, so we went ahead and drove to a pet nuclear medicine place where they did a scintography scan on her to see if she had a shunt. (She didn't! ) As far as I know, the scintography is the only for sure way to tell if there is a shunt or not (aside from surgery). I don't think ultrasounds can rule out a shunt 100% and $500 is a lot to spend for something that doesn't give you a for sure answer. Since your numbers are so low, it doesn't seem like a shunt is possible. It could be that your baby has MVD/HMD (but probably pretty mild)? In that case, I think it is probably safe to do the spay and while they are there, to do a liver biopsy to see how the liver is doing. But I would defintely talk to the vet about that and she how she/he feels about that. Only you can really decide if you are comfortable putting your baby through surgery right now. Good luck!
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10-03-2007, 09:48 AM | #5 |
YT Addict Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: West Chester, OH
Posts: 410
| Thanks for all of the advice. My sister also said that I probably shouldn't do the ultrasound because it's a lot of money. I think i might try and change her diet and have her blood work re-done in a month or so and if it comes back okay then I'll have her spayed. My vet wasn't like oh don't get her spayed but she said there is a risk that she won't come out of the anthesthia a higher risk than in most dogs i guess. So I think i might just try and change her diet. If a dog does have a compromised liver what kind of food should i be feeding her?
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10-03-2007, 09:58 AM | #6 |
And Rylee Finnegan Donating Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Metro Detroit, MI
Posts: 17,928
| It is hard to say what kind of food you should be feeding because there is no diagnosis. Those numbers are too low for me to think it is a shunt or MVD. I am definately not a vet though so who knows. It could be another problem but I don't know much about anything other than the two listed above. Dogs with shunts or MVD are fed Science Diet L/D (the kibble form of this is not something I would ever let Ellie eat), Avoderm Vegetarian (it is vegetarian with less protein than other foods), Natural Balance Vegetarian, Purina N/F, and Royal Canin Hepatic LS 14. Since the Royal Canin was more what I was looking for for Ellie I went with it. It is a good protein level for her. Well, I guess she is allergic to the corn in it and now gets homecooked so that is another option. It is best to talk to your vet and see how much protein they want her to have...
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10-03-2007, 03:03 PM | #7 |
Donating YT 3000 Club Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: USA
Posts: 7,178
| Natural Balance Vegetarian, Avoderm Vegetarian (dry only b/c canned is too high in protein), anything that is 21% protein or less (if she is asymptomatic), and no red meat (ie. venison, beef, lamb). Stick to chicken or vegetarian foods for now with 21% or less until you get a definitive diagnosis. Then, you can better decide what your dog should be eating long-term. Also, it's best to try to stay away from turkey and duck as well...
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10-11-2007, 06:26 AM | #8 |
And Rylee Finnegan Donating Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Metro Detroit, MI
Posts: 17,928
| Innova or something else? Okay, sorry for the delay. I had to finish cooking Ellie's breakfast. The Innova is much lower in protein then I thought. It is comparible to Canidae. If you are only feeding kibble you will probably be okay. The canned is what is way to high in protein. Any puppy food with less protein than Innova and Canidae probably makes garbage food. So, maybe you should stick with Innova, just never canned. Missing Link: what kind are you using?
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10-11-2007, 07:10 AM | #9 |
YT Addict Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: West Chester, OH
Posts: 410
| Okay great, yeah I thought it only had 26% and I am feeding the kibble so I'm glad that I'm feeding her something that isn't too high in protein. As far as the Missing Link goes I am just using the regular old Missing Link Canine Formula...they only had that kind and the Feline kind at the pet store that I was shopping at...Do you think that's okay?
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10-11-2007, 07:21 AM | #10 |
And Rylee Finnegan Donating Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Metro Detroit, MI
Posts: 17,928
| Well, I wouldn't say that the Innova is a good option to feed. I would say it is an okay option since your vet insists on puppy food so you don't have much of a choice. Missing Link: Be careful with this one. It has liver in it which isn't a good option for liver compromised dogs. I would personally stop since Innova is all in one anyway. That is just my opinion. If you feel like you need to use Missing Link, consider the vegetarian kind (available through KV Vet Supply online). There isn't any liver in it. I probably still wouldn't do it though since it has brewers yeast in it and I have heard that that somehow isn't a good option for the liver. I am hoping Yorkieluv will see this and correct me if I'm wrong...
__________________ Crystal, Ellie May (RIP), Rylee Finnegan, and Gracie Boo🐶 Last edited by Ellie May; 10-11-2007 at 07:23 AM. |
10-11-2007, 07:30 AM | #11 |
YT Addict Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: West Chester, OH
Posts: 410
| OH really...wow thanks for letting me know this I had no idea, the vet suggested a supplement like that. I just emailed my vet and asked her to send me what Lucy's blood results were so I can see how abnormal they were. I guess I will stop using the Missing Link and just stick with the Innova...yeah I'm not sure why she wants her on puppy food, maybe she thought she had Low Protein Levels because I was feeding her the All Life Stages...I don't know. I'm very confused about all of this liver stuff. I thought high protein count was supposed to indicate a liver problem and she has Low protein levels but ti could still be a liver issue?
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10-11-2007, 07:48 AM | #12 |
And Rylee Finnegan Donating Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Metro Detroit, MI
Posts: 17,928
| Haha I wish I knew but I don't. The vet probably wants her on a puppy food still since those bile acid numbers are not really elevated much. Have you joined the liver shunt group on yahoo? They might be able to help you.
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10-11-2007, 08:11 AM | #13 |
YT Addict Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: West Chester, OH
Posts: 410
| no i haven't. I had the link once because my sister was going through this with her yorkie. But I have misplaced it. Do you happen to know where I would be able to find it?
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10-11-2007, 08:27 AM | #14 |
And Rylee Finnegan Donating Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Metro Detroit, MI
Posts: 17,928
| I don't have the link handy but you can go to yahoo groups. The site is probably groups.yahoo.com. Then just type liver shunt into the search. It should come up.
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10-11-2007, 08:40 AM | #15 |
YT Addict Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: West Chester, OH
Posts: 410
| okay great thanks
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