Are there always definate symptoms of liver shunt - YorkieTalk.com Forums

wiggles moma · 03-23-2011, 05:20 PM

Our baby may have liver shunt, it may be epilepsy. Atleast those are the only 2 things they say it can be. Has anyone had these symptoms? 4 nights ago, our 2 pound yorkie had a seizure, very bad one. Since then over the next 3 days even while in hospital for 2 days had continued having them often even on meds. she also has no other symptoms of liver shunt. However now today she is back to normal but she is still on valium and prednesone. If anyone has had this problem please let me know. Pray for epilepsy.

107barney · 03-23-2011, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wiggles moma

Our baby may have liver shunt, it may be epilepsy. Atleast those are the only 2 things they say it can be. Has anyone had these symptoms? 4 nights ago, our 2 pound yorkie had a seizure, very bad one. Since then over the next 3 days even while in hospital for 2 days had continued having them often even on meds. she also has no other symptoms of liver shunt. However now today she is back to normal but she is still on valium and prednesone. If anyone has had this problem please let me know. Pray for epilepsy.

I'm sorry your little one had seizures

My Teddy has epilepsy so I know what it is like to have your dog suffer from a severe seizure.
We first ruled out all medical causes of Teddy's seizures and we did blood work and bile acids testing. His were all normal and that pointed more to something like epilepsy. We saw a neurologist who did testing and Teddy was finally diagnosed.

Did your vet do a bile acids test? Also, if liver shunt is suspected, it is best to get this baby to an internal medicine specialist right away. I'll also ask the moderator to move your post to the sick and injured forum so you get more responses.

concretegurl · 03-23-2011, 05:55 PM

Elvis is epileptic (he has cluster seizures) when he first had them the vet's first concern was if he had come in contact with anything, the second was liver shunt...he had multiple testings done before epilepsy was determined, it's my understanding epilepsy is often only diagnoses after everything but neurological issues are ruled out, then you may get a referral to a neurologist..we got back the LS testing (bile acid and some do ultra sound/xrays also) relatively quickly but the vet insisted on test for it twice at separate times to be sure.
Go here immediately even if its not epilepsy be sure to not give you dog anything that can induce or trigger seizures in the mean time-very important. We had a HUGE rosemary bush in the yard and had to remove it...and still have to continual be sure of his diet and exposures.

http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/

http://www.canine-epilepsy.net
.

AprilLove · 03-23-2011, 05:58 PM

I'm sorry about your baby

Soo tiny
Are the vets/specialists doing testing to rule out shunt and or epilepsy? Sending hugs and good thoughts that they get her back to health quickly!

PS: if you post this in the sick and injured forum, you will probably get a lot of feedback with those who have been through the same, hugs!

wiggles moma · 03-23-2011, 06:00 PM

Wiggles has all blood work within normal ranges but our vet wont do live bile test till no seizures for 10 days we are so scared. Thank you so much for all your suggestions, and I will repost in the sick forum.

belleeast · 03-23-2011, 07:30 PM

when my tiki weighed 2 lbs ,she had a seizure caused by a puppy flea & tick collar. i had cut it down to fit her but it was still too strong for little body needless to say no more flea collars. very scary, will pray for your little one.

kjc · 03-23-2011, 07:43 PM

If the seizures are bc of Liver Shunt, Lactulose will help clear the toxins quickly from her system, and stop the seizures quicker than valium. Ask your vet about it, as it is prescription medication.

In a dog that is seizing due to toxins from LS, Lactulose can be administered rectally in an enema. The instructions are on the label. The worst side effect from Lactulose is diarrhea, and if your dog does not have LS, the Lactulose won't hurt her.

Also, prednisone can cause inaccurate results in a BAT (Bile Acid Test).

lillymae · 03-23-2011, 08:05 PM

How old is your baby ? Did your baby recently have vaccinations ?
AAI, Chiari & GME can all have same symptoms as Liver Shunt.

kjc · 03-23-2011, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lillymae

How old is your baby ? Did your baby recently have vaccinations ?
AAI, Chiari & GME can all have same symptoms as Liver Shunt.

The OP has 2 threads, here's the 2nd one:

http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/sic...-symptons.html

Her doggie is 2lbs at 3 years old... no vacs mentioned.

yorkiesincommon · 03-24-2011, 06:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wiggles moma

Our baby may have liver shunt, it may be epilepsy. Atleast those are the only 2 things they say it can be. Has anyone had these symptoms? 4 nights ago, our 2 pound yorkie had a seizure, very bad one. Since then over the next 3 days even while in hospital for 2 days had continued having them often even on meds. she also has no other symptoms of liver shunt. However now today she is back to normal but she is still on valium and prednesone. If anyone has had this problem please let me know. Pray for epilepsy.

I am so sorry for the struggle you & your little one are experiencing. One thing that has helped me is asking for a known vet of the YT members in your area who have had similar experiences. Often getting the right diagnosis is a matter of getting your baby to someone who really knows his or her stuff. YT members are from all over and are glad to assist you in finding the best vets for you. I hope your struggles resolve themselves soon and bless you for walking with your little one through this. Mary from sunny Florida

Lorraine · 03-24-2011, 06:20 AM

Various things can cause a seizure believe it or not, even parasite infection, ie worms coccidia giardia. Make sure it isn't one of these but your vet would need to screen/treat if that is the case.
If seizuring from LS, I would suspect I would also see the other symptoms such as head pressing, circling, anorexia. One symptom is not enough to be sure of LS.
Also, Bile Acids can be high due to other causes than liver shunt. If they are high and LS is still suspected, ultra sound and especially a colour doplar can give you a proper diagnosis. Never go with just the BA result. Even sulpha meds for treating coccidia can give a high BA reading just for one example.

morkiecalvin · 03-24-2011, 06:22 AM

My Calvin had no symptons prior to being diagnosed with a liver shunt. He went in to be neutered and the vet did the pre-op blood work and his levels were high. He was actually surprised that he didnt have any symptons because his levels were so high. He didnt have any seizures until about a week before his surgery.

wiggles moma · 03-24-2011, 06:06 PM

How is he now? Are you able to manage. What is his prognosis? Its wonderful to meet people going thru this.

lillymae · 03-24-2011, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wiggles moma

How is he now? Are you able to manage. What is his prognosis? Its wonderful to meet people going thru this.

Lol, this is your thread & we are all asking about your dog, how is he ?

morkiecalvin · 03-25-2011, 02:30 AM

Thank you for asking. He is fine. He came through the surgery like a trooper. He just had his six month follow-up and his levels are still elevated. The vet said it could be one of two things: first that his major shunt hasnt closed all the way (which he says is unlikely) and second that he has micro vascular shunts (which isnt uncommon). He has to stay on the prescription food and lactulose and be retested in a year. The vet said that most dogs do fine on the prescription food and lactulose. He has gained over a pound a half since his surgery. He looks great and seems great!

03-23-2011, 05:20 PM	#1
wiggles moma Yorkie Talker Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: cobden, il usa Posts: 14	Are there always definate symptoms of liver shunt Our baby may have liver shunt, it may be epilepsy. Atleast those are the only 2 things they say it can be. Has anyone had these symptoms? 4 nights ago, our 2 pound yorkie had a seizure, very bad one. Since then over the next 3 days even while in hospital for 2 days had continued having them often even on meds. she also has no other symptoms of liver shunt. However now today she is back to normal but she is still on valium and prednesone. If anyone has had this problem please let me know. Pray for epilepsy.

03-23-2011, 05:55 PM	#3
concretegurl Between♥Suspensions Donating Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Vaissades Posts: 7,979	Elvis is epileptic (he has cluster seizures) when he first had them the vet's first concern was if he had come in contact with anything, the second was liver shunt...he had multiple testings done before epilepsy was determined, it's my understanding epilepsy is often only diagnoses after everything but neurological issues are ruled out, then you may get a referral to a neurologist..we got back the LS testing (bile acid and some do ultra sound/xrays also) relatively quickly but the vet insisted on test for it twice at separate times to be sure. Go here immediately even if its not epilepsy be sure to not give you dog anything that can induce or trigger seizures in the mean time-very important. We had a HUGE rosemary bush in the yard and had to remove it...and still have to continual be sure of his diet and exposures. http://www.canine-epilepsy-guardian-angels.com/ http://www.canine-epilepsy.net . __________________ Shan & 8 kids now! Last edited by concretegurl; 03-23-2011 at 05:59 PM.

03-23-2011, 05:58 PM	#4
AprilLove My Three Hearts Donating Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Wrapped around their paws :-) Posts: 7,190	I'm sorry about your baby Soo tiny Are the vets/specialists doing testing to rule out shunt and or epilepsy? Sending hugs and good thoughts that they get her back to health quickly! PS: if you post this in the sick and injured forum, you will probably get a lot of feedback with those who have been through the same, hugs! __________________ MaryKay AprilLove Wubs Moosie R.I.P. Bailey & BitsyRoo Last edited by AprilLove; 03-23-2011 at 05:59 PM.

03-23-2011, 06:00 PM	#5
wiggles moma Yorkie Talker Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: cobden, il usa Posts: 14	Wiggles has all blood work within normal ranges but our vet wont do live bile test till no seizures for 10 days we are so scared. Thank you so much for all your suggestions, and I will repost in the sick forum. Last edited by wiggles moma; 03-23-2011 at 06:04 PM.

03-23-2011, 07:43 PM	#7
kjc I♥PeekTinkySaph&Finny Donating Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Baltimore, Maryland Posts: 18,866	If the seizures are bc of Liver Shunt, Lactulose will help clear the toxins quickly from her system, and stop the seizures quicker than valium. Ask your vet about it, as it is prescription medication. In a dog that is seizing due to toxins from LS, Lactulose can be administered rectally in an enema. The instructions are on the label. The worst side effect from Lactulose is diarrhea, and if your dog does not have LS, the Lactulose won't hurt her. Also, prednisone can cause inaccurate results in a BAT (Bile Acid Test). __________________ Kat Chloe Lizzy PeekABooTinkerbell SapphireInfinity

03-23-2011, 07:30 PM	#6
belleeast Yorkie Talker Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: illinois Posts: 12	when my tiki weighed 2 lbs ,she had a seizure caused by a puppy flea & tick collar. i had cut it down to fit her but it was still too strong for little body needless to say no more flea collars. very scary, will pray for your little one.

03-23-2011, 08:05 PM	#8
lillymae YT 3000 Club Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Idaho Posts: 4,544	How old is your baby ? Did your baby recently have vaccinations ? AAI, Chiari & GME can all have same symptoms as Liver Shunt.

03-24-2011, 06:20 AM	#11
Lorraine Donating YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Abbotsford, BC Posts: 2,060	Various things can cause a seizure believe it or not, even parasite infection, ie worms coccidia giardia. Make sure it isn't one of these but your vet would need to screen/treat if that is the case. If seizuring from LS, I would suspect I would also see the other symptoms such as head pressing, circling, anorexia. One symptom is not enough to be sure of LS. Also, Bile Acids can be high due to other causes than liver shunt. If they are high and LS is still suspected, ultra sound and especially a colour doplar can give you a proper diagnosis. Never go with just the BA result. Even sulpha meds for treating coccidia can give a high BA reading just for one example. __________________ Lorraine www.loribenyorkies.com Canada

03-24-2011, 06:22 AM	#12
morkiecalvin Senior Yorkie Talker Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Roseland, NJ Posts: 104	My Calvin had no symptons prior to being diagnosed with a liver shunt. He went in to be neutered and the vet did the pre-op blood work and his levels were high. He was actually surprised that he didnt have any symptons because his levels were so high. He didnt have any seizures until about a week before his surgery.

03-24-2011, 06:06 PM	#13
wiggles moma Yorkie Talker Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: cobden, il usa Posts: 14	How is he now? Are you able to manage. What is his prognosis? Its wonderful to meet people going thru this.

03-25-2011, 02:30 AM	#15
morkiecalvin Senior Yorkie Talker Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Roseland, NJ Posts: 104	Thank you for asking. He is fine. He came through the surgery like a trooper. He just had his six month follow-up and his levels are still elevated. The vet said it could be one of two things: first that his major shunt hasnt closed all the way (which he says is unlikely) and second that he has micro vascular shunts (which isnt uncommon). He has to stay on the prescription food and lactulose and be retested in a year. The vet said that most dogs do fine on the prescription food and lactulose. He has gained over a pound a half since his surgery. He looks great and seems great!