Microvascular Dysplasia help and info - YorkieTalk.com Forums

silyjillie · 11-18-2009, 11:21 PM

Hey everyone! I haven't been on as much lately, I hope you're all doing good.

Last week we took Meeko in for his semi-annual check up and his blood work came back with a slightly elevated alp levels. The vet called after getting the results in and had us do an acid bile test. He said the difference from before and after the food they gave him was 51. He said that he'd be very concerned if it was 100 or over. Since is was half the amount, it wasn't a liver shunt. He suggested not changing his diet and to continue doing what I'm doing now and we'll retest him in 6 months. We also went over the different symptoms to keep an eye out for and to call him if I noticed any changes in his behavior.

Meeko just turned 2 years old 3 weeks ago. He's extremely hyper and playful and I haven't noticed any of the symptoms at all. I know that a lot of proteins are bad but, as far as food what should I do. Right now he's eating Natural Balance Sweet Potato and Duck. It's guaranteed analysis says it's crude protein amount is 21.0% minimum. Is that too much? If so, what amount should I look for? As far as treats, he eats cheese, peanut butter, fruits and vegetables and bully sticks. I've stopped giving him bully sticks because that's all protein.

I'd just like as much information as possible and about the protein % he should be getting. Thanks in advance!!!

dwerten · 11-19-2009, 03:48 AM

my dog has mvd as well with no symptoms she is on purina ha low protein hydrolized soy diet. It is the ALT that was high for your dog not ALP. You need to know the pre and post bile acid numbers. Sounds like your vet is very sharp btw. I am impressed as i know alot about this as on liver shunt/mvd group. Your vet is correct over 100 is usually a shunt and your dog would have some symptoms either bladder stones, head pressing, seizures, picky eater, spaced out after eating etc.

My dog has pre 3 and her three posts were 73,54 now 26 on low protein diet. 25 and below is normal. 21% is not bad if your dog is not having symptoms it is 22% or below and if having symptoms 18% and below so your vet is right no need to adjust diet but watch the protein count. You may want to do natural balance fish and sweet potato as fish is a more digestible protein and liver compromised dogs need to be on a highly digestible protein. But honestly if no symptoms, etc i would just keep doing what you are doing. They just need to be careful when doing anesthesia or giving meds. However my dog is on temarilp a steroid and her liver is doing fine and she is on soloxine for hypothyroid so I really would not stress too much about as your vet isn't concerned and neither am I

My dog is now 5 1/2 and still no issues.

if you want to keep the liver cleansed you can juice zucchini and celery together put pulp on food and juice and that is a natural cleans of liver by using zucchini and celery cleanses the urinary tract. I would not use milk thistle or sam-e as i do not supplement with these either since she has no symptoms and her blood work is fine however my girl did not have a high ALT just high post bile acid tests

Ellie May · 11-19-2009, 05:07 AM

Good vet.

I wouldn't totally agree that below 100 means no shunt though. While there is "probably" no shunt, a dog with bile acids of 51 could still have one. If that is the postprandial number, Ellie's came back about the same and her vet wanted it rechecked it one month after changing to a low protein diet and supplementing.

The 21% protein for an asymptomatic dog isn't a big deal. The problem is the type of protein may not be the bet for him. But then we get into how far does the vet want you to take this and should his diet be watched extremely closely, etc.

Patti · 11-19-2009, 05:37 AM

Cali has mild MVD diagnosed after bile acid test of 0/90 and on retest 0/48 or close. The specialist told me that generally under 100 is indicitive of MVD over a possible shunt. An ultrasound showed no shunt so we did a liver biopsy during her spay and it came back as mild MVD, no treatment necessary. I do watch her protein intake and found a lot of treats are high in protein so I keep her on a very restricted diet. I just came up with keeping her intake at 21% or less, but that was just something I decided. Hope your baby remains asymptomatic.

Hannah3183 · 11-19-2009, 08:34 AM

We believe mine has mild mvd too with a slightly elevated alt 1 pt outside the normal range and post biles at 44.7. Her only symptom has been that she threw up alot. Now she will throw up about once a month and it's about a teaspoon size.

I've been feeding her Royal Canin Hepatic LS 14 and she has done great on it. I tried many of the lower protein diets with fish etc and they just didn't agree with her. This has been the only thing she can keep down.

I would definately cut out the bully sticks. Mine loved those too but they are too high in protein. I just give her a nylabone now and apple bits with no skin for treats. She gets a chicken pill pocket with her Denosyl and Hepato Support supplements, but that's it.

Good luck. I know it's really tough at first but once you get everything figured it, it's pretty smooth sailing. This board and the yahoo group helped me tremendously.

silyjillie · 11-19-2009, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dwerten

It is the ALT that was high for your dog not ALP.

On the blood work paper, the ALT results are in the normal range. It's the Alkaline Phosphatase that's the high one. It was 131. The ALT was only 22 (normal range being 12-118)

dwerten · 11-19-2009, 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by silyjillie

On the blood work paper, the ALT results are in the normal range. It's the Alkaline Phosphatase that's the high one. It was 131. The ALT was only 22 (normal range being 12-118)

ok how far out of normal?

dwerten · 11-19-2009, 09:40 PM

here is the info on ALP being high and it is tied to liver disease

so i would juice the zucchini and celery due to this being high. My dd did not have high alp or high alt

Alkaline Phosphatase

silyjillie · 11-20-2009, 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dwerten

ok how far out of normal?

It says normal is 5-131

silyjillie · 11-20-2009, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by silyjillie

It says normal is 5-131

His ALP numbers were 190, normal being 5-131. sorry I think mixed the numbers up early

ArmaniMan · 11-20-2009, 09:33 AM

Thanks for posting this question...

I am in the same boat I think... my Chloe's levels are high and an ultrasound found no shunt, so far she has no symptoms either... we are going to do a liver biopsy during spay to diagnose MVD for sure.

All of this information is very helpful!

salome184 · 11-20-2009, 04:57 PM

Hi, my puppy just got diagnosed with MVP last week. He is a 7 month old adorable Yorkie. The amount of protein they are allowed to eat is 18 percent or less daily. I have done a lot research. My puppy has no symptoms or so I don't think. I am not sure. He threw up today for the first time twice-bile and foam and although he has been walking with me 3.5 miles daily and playing with my 2 year old niece for 4 hours a day, running around the house, I still think he is more sleepy than usual. However, the running around with my niece is new, he wasn't going to my sister's house before and we weren't walking that much. So i am totally confused. Now that I know about his diagnosis, I attribute everything to this. I always think he is getting sick and his liver is getting worst. I am so worried.

11-18-2009, 11:21 PM	#1
silyjillie YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Delray Beach, FL Posts: 1,060	Microvascular Dysplasia help and info Hey everyone! I haven't been on as much lately, I hope you're all doing good. Last week we took Meeko in for his semi-annual check up and his blood work came back with a slightly elevated alp levels. The vet called after getting the results in and had us do an acid bile test. He said the difference from before and after the food they gave him was 51. He said that he'd be very concerned if it was 100 or over. Since is was half the amount, it wasn't a liver shunt. He suggested not changing his diet and to continue doing what I'm doing now and we'll retest him in 6 months. We also went over the different symptoms to keep an eye out for and to call him if I noticed any changes in his behavior. Meeko just turned 2 years old 3 weeks ago. He's extremely hyper and playful and I haven't noticed any of the symptoms at all. I know that a lot of proteins are bad but, as far as food what should I do. Right now he's eating Natural Balance Sweet Potato and Duck. It's guaranteed analysis says it's crude protein amount is 21.0% minimum. Is that too much? If so, what amount should I look for? As far as treats, he eats cheese, peanut butter, fruits and vegetables and bully sticks. I've stopped giving him bully sticks because that's all protein. I'd just like as much information as possible and about the protein % he should be getting. Thanks in advance!!! __________________ Jill, Meeko's Mom

11-19-2009, 05:07 AM	#3
Ellie May And Rylee Finnegan Donating Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Metro Detroit, MI Posts: 17,928	Good vet. I wouldn't totally agree that below 100 means no shunt though. While there is "probably" no shunt, a dog with bile acids of 51 could still have one. If that is the postprandial number, Ellie's came back about the same and her vet wanted it rechecked it one month after changing to a low protein diet and supplementing. The 21% protein for an asymptomatic dog isn't a big deal. The problem is the type of protein may not be the bet for him. But then we get into how far does the vet want you to take this and should his diet be watched extremely closely, etc. __________________ Crystal, Ellie May (RIP), Rylee Finnegan, and Gracie Boo🐶

11-19-2009, 05:37 AM	#4
Patti Donating YT 30K Club Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Illinois Posts: 35,509 Blog Entries: 6	Cali has mild MVD diagnosed after bile acid test of 0/90 and on retest 0/48 or close. The specialist told me that generally under 100 is indicitive of MVD over a possible shunt. An ultrasound showed no shunt so we did a liver biopsy during her spay and it came back as mild MVD, no treatment necessary. I do watch her protein intake and found a lot of treats are high in protein so I keep her on a very restricted diet. I just came up with keeping her intake at 21% or less, but that was just something I decided. Hope your baby remains asymptomatic. __________________ Cali Pixie Roxie : RIP Nikki; RIP Maya;RIP my sweet Dixie girl 1/17/08 http://callipuppyscastle.bravehost.com/index.html

11-19-2009, 03:48 AM	#2
dwerten BANNED! Join Date: May 2007 Location: USA Posts: 11,073	my dog has mvd as well with no symptoms she is on purina ha low protein hydrolized soy diet. It is the ALT that was high for your dog not ALP. You need to know the pre and post bile acid numbers. Sounds like your vet is very sharp btw. I am impressed as i know alot about this as on liver shunt/mvd group. Your vet is correct over 100 is usually a shunt and your dog would have some symptoms either bladder stones, head pressing, seizures, picky eater, spaced out after eating etc. My dog has pre 3 and her three posts were 73,54 now 26 on low protein diet. 25 and below is normal. 21% is not bad if your dog is not having symptoms it is 22% or below and if having symptoms 18% and below so your vet is right no need to adjust diet but watch the protein count. You may want to do natural balance fish and sweet potato as fish is a more digestible protein and liver compromised dogs need to be on a highly digestible protein. But honestly if no symptoms, etc i would just keep doing what you are doing. They just need to be careful when doing anesthesia or giving meds. However my dog is on temarilp a steroid and her liver is doing fine and she is on soloxine for hypothyroid so I really would not stress too much about as your vet isn't concerned and neither am I My dog is now 5 1/2 and still no issues. if you want to keep the liver cleansed you can juice zucchini and celery together put pulp on food and juice and that is a natural cleans of liver by using zucchini and celery cleanses the urinary tract. I would not use milk thistle or sam-e as i do not supplement with these either since she has no symptoms and her blood work is fine however my girl did not have a high ALT just high post bile acid tests

11-19-2009, 08:34 AM	#5
Hannah3183 Senior Yorkie Talker Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Nashville Posts: 169	We believe mine has mild mvd too with a slightly elevated alt 1 pt outside the normal range and post biles at 44.7. Her only symptom has been that she threw up alot. Now she will throw up about once a month and it's about a teaspoon size. I've been feeding her Royal Canin Hepatic LS 14 and she has done great on it. I tried many of the lower protein diets with fish etc and they just didn't agree with her. This has been the only thing she can keep down. I would definately cut out the bully sticks. Mine loved those too but they are too high in protein. I just give her a nylabone now and apple bits with no skin for treats. She gets a chicken pill pocket with her Denosyl and Hepato Support supplements, but that's it. Good luck. I know it's really tough at first but once you get everything figured it, it's pretty smooth sailing. This board and the yahoo group helped me tremendously.

11-19-2009, 09:40 PM	#8
dwerten BANNED! Join Date: May 2007 Location: USA Posts: 11,073	here is the info on ALP being high and it is tied to liver disease so i would juice the zucchini and celery due to this being high. My dd did not have high alp or high alt Alkaline Phosphatase

11-20-2009, 09:33 AM	#11
ArmaniMan I ♥ Armani & Chloe Donating Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Upstate NY Posts: 3,895	Thanks for posting this question... I am in the same boat I think... my Chloe's levels are high and an ultrasound found no shunt, so far she has no symptoms either... we are going to do a liver biopsy during spay to diagnose MVD for sure. All of this information is very helpful!

11-20-2009, 04:57 PM	#12
salome184 YorkieTalk Newbie! Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: New York Posts: 6	Hi, my puppy just got diagnosed with MVP last week. He is a 7 month old adorable Yorkie. The amount of protein they are allowed to eat is 18 percent or less daily. I have done a lot research. My puppy has no symptoms or so I don't think. I am not sure. He threw up today for the first time twice-bile and foam and although he has been walking with me 3.5 miles daily and playing with my 2 year old niece for 4 hours a day, running around the house, I still think he is more sleepy than usual. However, the running around with my niece is new, he wasn't going to my sister's house before and we weren't walking that much. So i am totally confused. Now that I know about his diagnosis, I attribute everything to this. I always think he is getting sick and his liver is getting worst. I am so worried.