Why can't we stop puppymills!!!! - YorkieTalk.com Forums

SnowWa · 10-28-2006, 04:06 PM

Puppymills are out there. They are recognizable, and they are growing in number. And, people know where they are. Why isn't there an agency that can't just walk in and close them down????? Why!! Knowing where they are and what they are - why are they allowed to just continue to operate? Why aren't there laws that can close these places down "tomorrow!"

Sometimes I think if hundreds of thousands of people would write their congressmen over and over again asking for laws that would close down puppymills immediately - maybe something would get done.

We all talk about them all the time. We hate them. But nothing ever gets done. I think we are largely responsible for this. It's the puppymills that are the crux of the problem in our country - the real problem (not the pet stores) - and for some reason, they are allowed to operate.

This country is filled with millions of animals lovers and a lot of these people have a lot of time and a lot of money - and still nothing is ever done. If our legal system or government doesn't have the money or employees to solve this problem, why can't we do something about it themselves. I know hundreds of good, upright citizens who would volunteer their time to help solve this problem and help close these places down. If given the right to do so, they would become educated, visit facilities that are suspected of being puppymills, and make decisions regarding their right to continue operating. If they are deemed to be puppymills, they should be closed down - "immediately." And - I'm sure donations from rich people and a lot of smaller donations from less well off people - would help a lot. (There are probably court costs involved - perhaps this is what keeps so many places from being closed down).

So - instead of talk - talk - talking all the time -- isn't there something we can do or organize that would help bring an end to puppymills. Can't we organize and start writing our congressmen (over and over again). Can't we send petitions from all over the country to our congressmen. Can't we organize and work harder to close these places down. All the talk in the world does nothing. And - we do a lot of this.

What sort of ideas do you have? Are you willing to organize and fight this problem? There are forums all over the Internet for animal lovers that could be approached. Many different breeds have their own forums - I am sure there are hundreds of thousands of people on the Internet and walking the streets that feel the same way we do. Why can't we get together and make a concerted effort to put a stop to puppymills in our country. I really believe we could.

We need to find out how many of us are willing to do more than just talk. We need people who are willing to step up and take leadership roles in this effort. We need to find out why these places aren't being closed down. We need to organize and address these issues. Is it money? Is it manpower? Is it a lack of organization? What are the real reasons these facilities are allowed to continue to operate?

Talk is cheap and it accomplishes nothing! I wish we could all step outside the box and not think of ourselves as Yorkie owners - but rather as a group who wants to stop animal abuse wherever it exists. I think we need to help initiate rules and regulations and laws that will put a stop to puppymills.

I know a lot of you feel the same way I do - and I know there are hundreds of thousands of people who feel like we do -- I think it's important for us to do more than talk and be willing to step up to the plate and really try and do something about it. Why can't we all get together and make a real statement - and stay with it until something gets done???

The more thought I give this - the more work I realize may be involved - but we can do it.....

We need ideas - leadership - and involvement from all of us - as well from the other hundreds of thousands of people who feel like we do.

Wouldn't you be proud to be part of a group that can finally stop the existence of puppymills. I would.

What do the rest of you think? What are your ideas? What are you willing to do?

Thanks - Carol Jean

TLC · 10-28-2006, 04:10 PM

I am willing to be part of the solution. I don't have much money or time, but I am willing to use the little I have to help.

JeanieK · 10-28-2006, 04:59 PM

Before anything can be done the laws have to be changed.

And you are right it takes organization and lobbying.

Possibly a good place to start would be Kennel Clubs. But before you can send out information, ylou have to gather it. Get facts and statistics. So you can present your case with some good solid evidence.

Also get to get news media involved to get as much coverage as possible.

I'm just brainstorming here.

The department of agricuture is the governing body, and they set the standards, so it's necessary to get a copy of their regulations, so we know what we're talking about.

The puppy millers know all the rules and just how far they can push them.
The worst part is that the regulations not only allow the animals to be caged, but they actully encourage it. And they have animal experts that will testify that the animals don't care if they have never known anything different.

If PETA and the SPCA haven't been able to do anything I'm not sure how much good we can do, except to picket with protest signs.

TLC · 10-28-2006, 05:04 PM

Unfortunately I do agree...BUT there is NOT enough attention at how horrible the living condition really are!

I think that exposure is something that the people of the United States need to see. I wish we could get a bunch of celebs. on board...they could show how disgusting the conditions are..

Brookef18 · 10-29-2006, 05:36 AM

How to stop a puppy millActions anyone can take
[LIST=1][*]Get your facts straight. Know at least approximately how many breeds are raised at the facility, whether or not it is clean, if the dogs run together or are housed separately, whether the dogs have regular preventative and necessary veterinary care, and whether the operators sell to pet stores, brokers, laboratories, or the general public.[*]If possible, get a friend to accompany you to the suspect business for your safety and to corroborate your observations[*]Make notes about the conditions when you return home and be prepared to send those notes to the appropriate officials. Be prepared for bureaucracy to grind slowly and to restate your observations several times. Observations, not heartache, not hysteria, not an emotional outburst.[*]Contact your local humane society and health departments and describe the conditions you have seen as specifically and unemotionally as possible. The humane society can act in cases of abuse and neglect (which in Ohio means lack of food and shelter) and the health department can deal with threats to public health from fecal contamination, dead dog bodies, etc.[*]Contact: Dr. Valencia D. Colleton
US Department of Agriculture,
2568-A Riva Road, Suite 302
Annapolis, MD 21401- 7400
(410) 962-7463
to find out whether or not the breeder has a Class A or Class B license (a necessity if the facility sells to pet stores, brokers, or laboratories and makes more than $500 annually from such sales). The USDA will be interested if the breeder has a license and is not following the guidelines for housing, sanitation, and veterinary care or if the breeder is not licensed and grosses more than $500 per year selling puppies wholesale. If these conditions are not met, USDA can by law do nothing. No matter how much your sensibilities are offended by the plight of overcrowded, undernourished neglected puppies, they can do nothing.[*]Contact: American Kennel Club Inspections and Investigations Department
51 Madison Avenue
New York, NY 10010
(212) 696-8208
If the breeds are AKC recognized and the breeder advertises AKC registered puppies. AKC will be interested if dogs are constantly running together, especially if dogs of different breeds are housed together and the business also sells mixed breed puppies, for this may indicate that record keeping regulations are being violated.
AKC is a purebred registry and can deal only with record keeping and identification transgressions; they can suspend violators from further registration of purebred dogs, but they cannot prevent them from breeding and selling puppies. [More on the AKC][*]If the dogs are UKC registered, contact: United Kennel Club
100 East Kilgore Road
Kalamazoo, MI 49001-5598
(616) 343-9020 Popular UKC breeds that are not also AKC recognized are American Pit Bull Terrier, and Jack Russell Terrier.[/LIST]Raising and selling dogs is a business for profit for many people. There should be no stigma attached to earning money by selling dogs; problems arise when the dogs are poorly bred, housed in poor conditions, denied proper medical care, are sick when sold, or are advertised falsely.
Just what is a puppy mill?
Norma Bennett Woolf

JeanieK · 10-29-2006, 06:31 AM

[QUOTE=Brookef18]to find out whether or not the breeder has a Class A or Class B license (a necessity if the facility sells to pet stores, brokers, or laboratories and makes more than $500 annually from such sales). The USDA will be interested if the breeder has a license and is not following the guidelines for housing, sanitation, and veterinary care or if the breeder is not licensed and grosses more than $500 per year selling puppies wholesale. If these conditions are not met, USDA can by law do nothing. No matter how much your sensibilities are offended by the plight of overcrowded, undernourished neglected puppies, they can do nothing.
QUOTE]

This paragraph does not make sense. Did anyone else have troublle understanding it.

What I got out of it is the USDA can do NOTHING Whether they are licensed or not and no matter what the conditions.

Obviously this is what the problem is. No one can do anything unless you can prove Neglect, abuse, or health hazard.

The fact that these poor animals are living in horrible conditions means NOTHING.

JeanieK · 10-29-2006, 06:37 AM

So then what is the purpose of licensing?????????????

To make sure that your facility is initially set up with cages and a separate kitchen in a separate building. And then that's it???????????? You can do what you want?????????

Brookef18 · 10-29-2006, 01:06 PM

[quote=JeanieK]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brookef18

to find out whether or not the breeder has a Class A or Class B license (a necessity if the facility sells to pet stores, brokers, or laboratories and makes more than $500 annually from such sales). The USDA will be interested if the breeder has a license and is not following the guidelines for housing, sanitation, and veterinary care or if the breeder is not licensed and grosses more than $500 per year selling puppies wholesale. If these conditions are not met, USDA can by law do nothing. No matter how much your sensibilities are offended by the plight of overcrowded, undernourished neglected puppies, they can do nothing.
QUOTE]

This paragraph does not make sense. Did anyone else have troublle understanding it.

What I got out of it is the USDA can do NOTHING Whether they are licensed or not and no matter what the conditions.

Obviously this is what the problem is. No one can do anything unless you can prove Neglect, abuse, or health hazard.

The fact that these poor animals are living in horrible conditions means NOTHING.

Sorry I got this info from a wed site I was on another thread... Here's the address so you can look if y ou want.

http://www.canismajor.com/dog/stopmill.html

10-28-2006, 04:06 PM	#1
SnowWa YT 2000 Club Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: USA Posts: 2,992	Why can't we stop puppymills!!!! Puppymills are out there. They are recognizable, and they are growing in number. And, people know where they are. Why isn't there an agency that can't just walk in and close them down????? Why!! Knowing where they are and what they are - why are they allowed to just continue to operate? Why aren't there laws that can close these places down "tomorrow!" Sometimes I think if hundreds of thousands of people would write their congressmen over and over again asking for laws that would close down puppymills immediately - maybe something would get done. We all talk about them all the time. We hate them. But nothing ever gets done. I think we are largely responsible for this. It's the puppymills that are the crux of the problem in our country - the real problem (not the pet stores) - and for some reason, they are allowed to operate. This country is filled with millions of animals lovers and a lot of these people have a lot of time and a lot of money - and still nothing is ever done. If our legal system or government doesn't have the money or employees to solve this problem, why can't we do something about it themselves. I know hundreds of good, upright citizens who would volunteer their time to help solve this problem and help close these places down. If given the right to do so, they would become educated, visit facilities that are suspected of being puppymills, and make decisions regarding their right to continue operating. If they are deemed to be puppymills, they should be closed down - "immediately." And - I'm sure donations from rich people and a lot of smaller donations from less well off people - would help a lot. (There are probably court costs involved - perhaps this is what keeps so many places from being closed down). So - instead of talk - talk - talking all the time -- isn't there something we can do or organize that would help bring an end to puppymills. Can't we organize and start writing our congressmen (over and over again). Can't we send petitions from all over the country to our congressmen. Can't we organize and work harder to close these places down. All the talk in the world does nothing. And - we do a lot of this. What sort of ideas do you have? Are you willing to organize and fight this problem? There are forums all over the Internet for animal lovers that could be approached. Many different breeds have their own forums - I am sure there are hundreds of thousands of people on the Internet and walking the streets that feel the same way we do. Why can't we get together and make a concerted effort to put a stop to puppymills in our country. I really believe we could. We need to find out how many of us are willing to do more than just talk. We need people who are willing to step up and take leadership roles in this effort. We need to find out why these places aren't being closed down. We need to organize and address these issues. Is it money? Is it manpower? Is it a lack of organization? What are the real reasons these facilities are allowed to continue to operate? Talk is cheap and it accomplishes nothing! I wish we could all step outside the box and not think of ourselves as Yorkie owners - but rather as a group who wants to stop animal abuse wherever it exists. I think we need to help initiate rules and regulations and laws that will put a stop to puppymills. I know a lot of you feel the same way I do - and I know there are hundreds of thousands of people who feel like we do -- I think it's important for us to do more than talk and be willing to step up to the plate and really try and do something about it. Why can't we all get together and make a real statement - and stay with it until something gets done??? The more thought I give this - the more work I realize may be involved - but we can do it..... We need ideas - leadership - and involvement from all of us - as well from the other hundreds of thousands of people who feel like we do. Wouldn't you be proud to be part of a group that can finally stop the existence of puppymills. I would. What do the rest of you think? What are your ideas? What are you willing to do? Thanks - Carol Jean __________________ http://tinypic.com/ipxhmb.jpg A Yorkie is worth a thousand words.

10-28-2006, 04:10 PM	#2
TLC Slave to My Rug-Rats Donating Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Long Island Posts: 7,247	I am willing to be part of the solution. I don't have much money or time, but I am willing to use the little I have to help. __________________ Adopt Donate Foster www.yorkie911rescue.com

10-28-2006, 05:04 PM	#4
TLC Slave to My Rug-Rats Donating Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Long Island Posts: 7,247	Unfortunately I do agree...BUT there is NOT enough attention at how horrible the living condition really are! I think that exposure is something that the people of the United States need to see. I wish we could get a bunch of celebs. on board...they could show how disgusting the conditions are.. __________________ Adopt Donate Foster www.yorkie911rescue.com

10-29-2006, 05:36 AM	#5
Brookef18 Donating YT 1000 Club Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Cape Cod Ma Posts: 1,855	I found this.. it might help? How to stop a puppy millActions anyone can take [LIST=1][]Get your facts straight.* Know at least approximately how many breeds are raised at the facility, whether or not it is clean, if the dogs run together or are housed separately, whether the dogs have regular preventative and necessary veterinary care, and whether the operators sell to pet stores, brokers, laboratories, or the general public.[]If possible, get a friend to accompany you to the suspect business* for your safety and to corroborate your observations[]Make notes about the conditions when you return home and be prepared to send those notes to the appropriate officials. Be prepared for bureaucracy to grind slowly and to restate your observations several times. Observations, not heartache, not hysteria, not an emotional outburst.[]Contact your local humane society and health departments and describe the conditions you have seen as specifically and unemotionally as possible. The humane society can act in cases of abuse and neglect (which in Ohio means lack of food and shelter) and the health department can deal with threats to public health from fecal contamination, dead dog bodies, etc.[]Contact:* Dr. Valencia D. Colleton US Department of Agriculture, 2568-A Riva Road, Suite 302 Annapolis, MD 21401- 7400 (410) 962-7463 to find out whether or not the breeder has a Class A or Class B license (a necessity if the facility sells to pet stores, brokers, or laboratories and makes more than $500 annually from such sales). The USDA will be interested if the breeder has a license and is not following the guidelines for housing, sanitation, and veterinary care or if the breeder is not licensed and grosses more than $500 per year selling puppies wholesale. If these conditions are not met, USDA can by law do nothing. No matter how much your sensibilities are offended by the plight of overcrowded, undernourished neglected puppies, they can do nothing.[]Contact:* American Kennel Club Inspections and Investigations Department 51 Madison Avenue New York, NY 10010 (212) 696-8208 If the breeds are AKC recognized and the breeder advertises AKC registered puppies. AKC will be interested if dogs are constantly running together, especially if dogs of different breeds are housed together and the business also sells mixed breed puppies, for this may indicate that record keeping regulations are being violated. AKC is a purebred registry and can deal only with record keeping and identification transgressions; they can suspend violators from further registration of purebred dogs, but they cannot prevent them from breeding and selling puppies. [More on the AKC][]If the dogs are UKC registered, contact:* United Kennel Club 100 East Kilgore Road Kalamazoo, MI 49001-5598 (616) 343-9020 Popular UKC breeds that are not also AKC recognized are American Pit Bull Terrier, and Jack Russell Terrier.[/LIST]Raising and selling dogs is a business for profit for many people. There should be no stigma attached to earning money by selling dogs; problems arise when the dogs are poorly bred, housed in poor conditions, denied proper medical care, are sick when sold, or are advertised falsely. Just what is a puppy mill? Norma Bennett Woolf __________________ Brooke (Chewy's and Sadie's Mom) visit us on dogster dogster.com/dogs/700047

10-29-2006, 06:31 AM	#6
JeanieK Donating YT 12K Club Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Council Bluffs Iowa Posts: 12,552	[QUOTE=Brookef18]to find out whether or not the breeder has a Class A or Class B license (a necessity if the facility sells to pet stores, brokers, or laboratories and makes more than $500 annually from such sales). The USDA will be interested if the breeder has a license and is not following the guidelines for housing, sanitation, and veterinary care or if the breeder is not licensed and grosses more than $500 per year selling puppies wholesale. If these conditions are not met, USDA can by law do nothing. No matter how much your sensibilities are offended by the plight of overcrowded, undernourished neglected puppies, they can do nothing. QUOTE] This paragraph does not make sense. Did anyone else have troublle understanding it. What I got out of it is the USDA can do NOTHING Whether they are licensed or not and no matter what the conditions. Obviously this is what the problem is. No one can do anything unless you can prove Neglect, abuse, or health hazard. The fact that these poor animals are living in horrible conditions means NOTHING. Last edited by JeanieK; 10-29-2006 at 06:34 AM.

10-28-2006, 04:59 PM	#3
JeanieK Donating YT 12K Club Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Council Bluffs Iowa Posts: 12,552	Before anything can be done the laws have to be changed. And you are right it takes organization and lobbying. Possibly a good place to start would be Kennel Clubs. But before you can send out information, ylou have to gather it. Get facts and statistics. So you can present your case with some good solid evidence. Also get to get news media involved to get as much coverage as possible. I'm just brainstorming here. The department of agricuture is the governing body, and they set the standards, so it's necessary to get a copy of their regulations, so we know what we're talking about. The puppy millers know all the rules and just how far they can push them. The worst part is that the regulations not only allow the animals to be caged, but they actully encourage it. And they have animal experts that will testify that the animals don't care if they have never known anything different. If PETA and the SPCA haven't been able to do anything I'm not sure how much good we can do, except to picket with protest signs.

10-29-2006, 06:37 AM	#7
JeanieK Donating YT 12K Club Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Council Bluffs Iowa Posts: 12,552	So then what is the purpose of licensing????????????? To make sure that your facility is initially set up with cages and a separate kitchen in a separate building. And then that's it???????????? You can do what you want?????????