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Old 06-13-2013, 08:49 AM   #1
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Question Are Morkies Really Better?

So my fiance and I have finally gotten moved and settled and all and he is ready to start looking for a puppy with me. He asked me what breed I wanted and I told him I want a Yorkie and he says "don't you mean a teacup morkie? You know mixed breeds are healthier and more well-behaved."

I tried telling him that from what I've seen in my research there are no "teacup" Yorkies/Maltese/Morkies and such as those are already toy breeds when bred to standard. He got really agitated with me over me referring to the "breed standard" and snapped about how we're not looking for a dog to show we just want a pet so breed standard doesn't matter and "it isn't like some small dogs grow to be more than about 7 pounds anyhow." I've seen people on here with purebred Yorkies that are over 10 pounds with some of them being closer to 15 which in my book that counts as a dog growing larger than you expected so... rude unwarranted comment on his part. And I'm worried if he goes looking for a "teacup" puppy he is going to end up buying from a puppy mill or less than reputable breeder.

So to win the "argument" about how clearly mixed breeds are better all around, he goes on google and reads off the first page he finds on why mixed breeds are better to me as if that random website was definitive. Sigh, men. I need some help convincing him that mixed breeds aren't magically healthier. (Unless they are??) Especially with morkies (or so I think?) since Maltese and Yorkies both have genetic predisposition for liver shunts, luxating patella and collapsing trachea so I would think 2 parents (regardless of breed) with those genes would produce a baby with those genes.

I also need help convincing him that it is REALLY important not to pick a puppy from some shady website. The one he is the most interested in right now has like 10+ different breeds on the sites (Ashland Virginia Pet Store & Small Breed Dogs | Pauleys Pups) and that good breeding does really make a big difference. I don't want to end up with some poor puppy from a puppy mill that grows up sickly with behavior issues and doesn't even look like the adorable Yorkies I've fallen in love with Edit: The reason for posting the website link is so people can see what I'm talking about with my concerns. He told me the reviews were all excellent but something about the site feels very "puppy mill" to me somehow.

Any help here is appreciated. It isn't about winning the argument for me (although it does peeve me a little that he assumes I'm an absolute idiot on all things dog related after the tons of time I've put into research). I've seen some people on here with morkies and other mixes so who knows maybe I'm the one who is wrong. If that is the case I can accept that.

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Old 06-13-2013, 09:04 AM   #2
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Well only bad breeders breed mixes and use the word teacup which means its very doubtful they do any health testing, don't care about there lines to know if Liver shunt, Collapsing trachea, ect is in them and if they do they wont breed that dog. A reputable breeder breeds to better the breed and sense "morkie" is not a breed you can't do that with them and with a mixed breed you never know what your going to get. If certain illnesses are in a dogs history they can pass them on no matter what breed they are and no mater what they are bred with. A lot of people will get there pure breed dog from a byb or a puppy mill and then that is what a lot of people see when they go to petsmart or a pet event, a poor breed or sickly looking dog and when you see enough of them you start to think well that breed must have issues when really it is how there bred. Every breed has its issues. I think he needs to look at puppy mills and see how terrible they really are to the parent dogs and maybe that will change his mind about looking for a good breeder. Make him watch the videos on this link http://www.yorkietalk.com/forums/gen...ppy-mills.html if watching these videos doesn't make him feel bad for the dogs in puppy mills and want to not buy from them and keep them in business then you have some bigger problems.
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Old 06-13-2013, 09:07 AM   #3
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I have 2 healthy Yorkies with great dispositions. Max is almost 5, Teddy 4. No signs of genetic defects.

Mixing 2 breeds does not guarantee the best of the breeds will end up in the puppies. Mixed breed superior health is a myth.

I would avoid buying from a puppy store at all costs. Good breeders do not sell to stores or through brokers. I took a quick look at the site, and those are not well bred puppies.
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Old 06-13-2013, 09:14 AM   #4
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I have 2 healthy Yorkies with great dispositions. Max is almost 5, Teddy 4. No signs of genetic defects.

Mixing 2 breeds does not guarantee the best of the breeds will end up in the puppies. Mixed breed superior health is a myth.

I would avoid buying from a puppy store at all costs. Good breeders do not sell to stores or through brokers. I took a quick look at the site, and those are not well bred puppies.
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Old 06-13-2013, 09:33 AM   #5
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I see you are in VA. Guessing the Richmond area? It's a bit of a treck but Bentley's breeder is in Boones Mill, VA. Wonderful lady. Could not be happier with Bentley and his health and disposition. As a matter of fact one of his siblings went to a family in Richmond. Don't know if she has any litters at this point, but if you like send me an IM and I can share her e-mail address with you.

I would love to get another yorkie in the future and would love to get one from the same set of parents if possible.

Not knowledgeable on breeding but I would think there would be an increased risk of health problems with mixed breeds. I'm thinking genetic predispositions that each pure breed might be prone to.

Temperament, I may be in the minority here, but I think that is more learned than bread. I'm a big believer in that one. Bentley while rambunctious (any puppy is) is a sweetie. I believe that is the home type environment he was born into. Breeder's husband would have at least one puppy on his chest in the evening while watching TV when they were old enough to have time away from mom. This is my first dog, but I would say find a small breeder who keeps their dogs in a home environment with lots of human interaction. Odds are you will end up with a sweetheart.

I would say take your time. Do research. And be willing to turn down a dog two. Bentley and his breeder were not my first choice. I was about to get a different dog but got an odd feeling at the last minute. Then I found Bentley and the rest is history.

Keep in mind the perfect puppy is out there for you, you don't have to rush into it.
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Old 06-13-2013, 09:36 AM   #6
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Frankly, you can buy a very unhealthy Yorkshire Terrier. It is overbred by many many unscrupulous people who believe that as long as they can get a dog (any dog) really small, they can sell it. It is a shame and a travesty. It's gotten to the point that so many "pure bred" yorkies don't look like the breed standard any more.

On the other hand, you can purchase a really healthy and beautiful yorkshire terrier puppy at a competitive rate as well. You must understand that when buying any pure bred animal, that you FIRST BUY THE BREEDER. You don't find a breeder by looking at the adorable pictures on a website or even in person. You find a breeder based upon his/her knowledge and experience with the specific breed.

I would suggest that you consider a breeder who shows dogs. That doesn't mean you're purchasing a "show dog." Not every dog born from champions is itself a champion in the ring. Many times, show breeders have puppies that due to one flaw or another can't be shown. Those dogs will be adopted to pet owners - usually with a contract to spay/neuter. That's because the breeders don't want you to breed their animals. They cultivate specific lines that they've developed and only the best dogs will be bred/shown.

A dog purchased from a show breeder will likely be very very healthy and beautiful. It will also likely have a great temperment - which is needed for the show ring.

NEVER purchase a dog from a pet store or breeder that is only selling puppies - even mixed breeds. I read one entry somewhere lately where the person was describing a puppy mill as having puppies in cages on top of one another. The puppies peed & poo'd right through the crates and onto the dogs below. Those puppies could not be trained.

If you are inclined to purchase a "mix breed", I'd suggest you find a shelter dog. You'd probably get a better history about the background of a pup from a shelter than from a pet store.

You can find a great yorkie if you find a great breeder first.

Good luck. Tracey
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Old 06-13-2013, 09:37 AM   #7
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Just because you find something on the internet doesnt mean its true there are alot of opinion articles on the internet, show him this thread
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Old 06-13-2013, 09:44 AM   #8
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BTW, even an adoption at a shelter/rescue will cost money. The shelters/rescues assign fees to dogs to continue their work. If you find a puppy, it will likely cost significantly more than if you adopt an adult dog. Good luck.
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Old 06-13-2013, 09:49 AM   #9
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My Toby is a Morkie and he is a wonderful addition to this family. We fell in love with him and that is why we chose him rather than the sweet Yorkies that were also available. We have known the breeder for ten years and she is very reputable and treats her dogs and puppies like family. It is very very rare that she has Morkies. She never ever uses words like teacup. She is looking for a forever home for her puppies and she is interviewing you--it isn't just about someone showing up and giving her money for a puppy.
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Old 06-13-2013, 09:54 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by luvlee View Post
Frankly, you can buy a very unhealthy Yorkshire Terrier. It is overbred by many many unscrupulous people who believe that as long as they can get a dog (any dog) really small, they can sell it. It is a shame and a travesty. It's gotten to the point that so many "pure bred" yorkies don't look like the breed standard any more.

On the other hand, you can purchase a really healthy and beautiful yorkshire terrier puppy at a competitive rate as well. You must understand that when buying any pure bred animal, that you FIRST BUY THE BREEDER. You don't find a breeder by looking at the adorable pictures on a website or even in person. You find a breeder based upon his/her knowledge and experience with the specific breed.

I would suggest that you consider a breeder who shows dogs. That doesn't mean you're purchasing a "show dog." Not every dog born from champions is itself a champion in the ring. Many times, show breeders have puppies that due to one flaw or another can't be shown. Those dogs will be adopted to pet owners - usually with a contract to spay/neuter. That's because the breeders don't want you to breed their animals. They cultivate specific lines that they've developed and only the best dogs will be bred/shown.

A dog purchased from a show breeder will likely be very very healthy and beautiful. It will also likely have a great temperment - which is needed for the show ring.

NEVER purchase a dog from a pet store or breeder that is only selling puppies - even mixed breeds. I read one entry somewhere lately where the person was describing a puppy mill as having puppies in cages on top of one another. The puppies peed & poo'd right through the crates and onto the dogs below. Those puppies could not be trained.

If you are inclined to purchase a "mix breed", I'd suggest you find a shelter dog. You'd probably get a better history about the background of a pup from a shelter than from a pet store.

You can find a great yorkie if you find a great breeder first.

Good luck. Tracey

awesome post
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Old 06-13-2013, 09:55 AM   #11
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My Toby is a Morkie and he is a wonderful addition to this family. We fell in love with him and that is why we chose him rather than the sweet Yorkies that were also available. We have known the breeder for ten years and she is very reputable and treats her dogs and puppies like family. It is very very rare that she has Morkies. She never ever uses words like teacup. She is looking for a forever home for her puppies and she is interviewing you--it isn't just about someone showing up and giving her money for a puppy.

Can I ask if she's a reputable breeder why she would be selling or breeding morkies, serious question?
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Old 06-13-2013, 10:00 AM   #12
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In a word, no. Morkies are not healthier than pure bred dogs. I have no issue with mixed breed dogs. I love all dogs! I do take issue with anyone who intentionally breeds designer dogs for many reasons, so I believe your gut is correct! It sounds like you really just need to find a good way to educate your fiance, so he understands the bigger picture like you do.

For a long time, I had heard "mutts" are healthier too, so I understand it's probably something he has heard for years. I guess you can play the google game too. If you google "hybrid vigor myth in dogs," you will find plenty of pages that speak to exactly what you were saying. Mixing two dogs doesn't mean you will end up with a healthier dog at all. In fact, you could end up with the worst of both breeds. You might find it interesting to note that the man in Australia who originated the Labradoodle now wishes he never done so, because he believes it helped start the designer dog craze, which was never his intention.

I am very pro-rescue now, and for the longest time I did not understand the point of dog shows...and then one day after reading enough it finally clicked. A dog show is a way to get approval for breeding stock. Because I believe my (way off standard) dogs are the cutest in the world, does not mean they should be bred. You can imagine how difficult it would be to look at one's own dogs through an objective eye. So in theory, a reputable breeder shows their dogs, gains approval for their breeding stock, does health testing on their dogs, and breeds with the goal of the "perfect" Yorkshire Terrier in mind. With so many unwanted dogs in the USA, it only seems logical to me that breeding should be done with a distinct purpose and goal in mind, and that should not be money! Your post makes me think you have grown to love the yorkie breed through your research (welcome to the club! ). Sadly, simply seeking out any old yorkie breeder isn't nearly enough to guarantee you will likey end up with a dog who has those characteristics. It's also important to note that just because someone breeds two championed show dogs that all of their offspring will be show quality dogs. Maybe one or two will be, and here is where the pets who have all the qualities of a show dog (to the untrained eye) are found. Maximo (posted above) has two great pups that are a great example of pet yorkies who closely resemble the standard.

Someone who is breeding morkies or other mixed breeds is doing so with no "goal" in mind. There is no morkie standard, and morkies can look like everything from yorkies with maltese coloring to maltese with yorkie coloring and everything in between. You really don't have much of an idea of what you are going to get when you are mixing two breeds together. I would be very surprised to find of any breeder that mixes breeds who is doing health testing as well. You are certainly not going to find a dog in a pet store that came from a breeder that does health testing. And yes, it is a proven fact that 99% of dogs in pet stores came from puppy mills. I also think a great test is to imagine the kind of person who would breed their dogs an then ship the puppies off (frequently at ages way too young to even be separated from the mother) to the first person who had a credit card to pay for them. A reptuable breeder will always take a dog back if you can no longer care for it for any reason, will offer a health guarantee, and should generally be there to answer any questions you have as you share your life with one of their pups. Additionally, a reputable and responsible breeder will want to make sure that their puppies are not bred, whereas there are no restrictions placed on pet store puppies, which are most certainly poorly bred, are likey to have many health issues, so you can see how quicky it can escalate to where we have so many poorly bred animals with health issues. It is a vicious cycle.

If size is going to to be an issue, perhaps you and your fiance could consider adopting an adult dog that is full grown? Even the best of breeders cannot guarantee size (only give their best guess). It is the only way to make certain you'll end up with a dog the size you desire. Likewise, if you or he really likes the idea of a morkie, the shelters and rescues are full of these cuties. Looking at an adult morkie gives you an idea of how they'll end up appearance wise too since they often change quite dramatically from their apperance as a puppy.

That website sends up a lot of red flags for me, and I would run far, far away from anyone who advertises teacups.

Kudos to you for doing your research ahead of time. I did not, and I have a poorly bred (very adorable) 5 year old yorkie with some health issues that are both financially and emotionally taxing. Even if money is no object, I can't tell you how hard it is emotionally to watch a dog you love so much suffer. One I educated myself I chose to adopt. My other pup is a puppy mill rescue (obviously poorly bred), so it is a shame she was used only to make puppies while living in a rabbit hutch in deplorable conditions, when she never should have been bred to begin with, not to mention she is an awesome little dog with a fun personality once she finally gained the confidence to come out of her shell. No doubt her puppies were probably sold in pet stores. A reputable rescue will have done a full vetting on any dog ready for adoption to make sure they are in excellent health, or they will be sure to let you know of any current or likely future health issues that would need to be addressed so the surprises are limited.

Sorry that was so long. Good luck!
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Old 06-13-2013, 10:04 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by luvlee View Post
Frankly, you can buy a very unhealthy Yorkshire Terrier. It is overbred by many many unscrupulous people who believe that as long as they can get a dog (any dog) really small, they can sell it. It is a shame and a travesty. It's gotten to the point that so many "pure bred" yorkies don't look like the breed standard any more.

On the other hand, you can purchase a really healthy and beautiful yorkshire terrier puppy at a competitive rate as well. You must understand that when buying any pure bred animal, that you FIRST BUY THE BREEDER. You don't find a breeder by looking at the adorable pictures on a website or even in person. You find a breeder based upon his/her knowledge and experience with the specific breed.

I would suggest that you consider a breeder who shows dogs. That doesn't mean you're purchasing a "show dog." Not every dog born from champions is itself a champion in the ring. Many times, show breeders have puppies that due to one flaw or another can't be shown. Those dogs will be adopted to pet owners - usually with a contract to spay/neuter. That's because the breeders don't want you to breed their animals. They cultivate specific lines that they've developed and only the best dogs will be bred/shown.

A dog purchased from a show breeder will likely be very very healthy and beautiful. It will also likely have a great temperment - which is needed for the show ring.

NEVER purchase a dog from a pet store or breeder that is only selling puppies - even mixed breeds. I read one entry somewhere lately where the person was describing a puppy mill as having puppies in cages on top of one another. The puppies peed & poo'd right through the crates and onto the dogs below. Those puppies could not be trained.

If you are inclined to purchase a "mix breed", I'd suggest you find a shelter dog. You'd probably get a better history about the background of a pup from a shelter than from a pet store.

You can find a great yorkie if you find a great breeder first.

Good luck. Tracey
Great post and much more succinct than I was!

One of my dogs is a puppy mill rescue (and it's not even one of the worst I've seen), but here is an album of where she lived before the mill was busted and the dogs taken to surrounding rescues: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?...0575982&type=3
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Old 06-13-2013, 10:09 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by TresCutePiggies View Post
In a word, no. Morkies are not healthier than pure bred dogs. I have no issue with mixed breed dogs. I love all dogs! I do take issue with anyone who intentionally breeds designer dogs for many reasons, so I believe your gut is correct! It sounds like you really just need to find a good way to educate your fiance, so he understands the bigger picture like you do.

For a long time, I had heard "mutts" are healthier too, so I understand it's probably something he has heard for years. I guess you can play the google game too. If you google "hybrid vigor myth in dogs," you will find plenty of pages that speak to exactly what you were saying. Mixing two dogs doesn't mean you will end up with a healthier dog at all. In fact, you could end up with the worst of both breeds. You might find it interesting to note that the man in Australia who originated the Labradoodle now wishes he never done so, because he believes it helped start the designer dog craze, which was never his intention.

I am very pro-rescue now, and for the longest time I did not understand the point of dog shows...and then one day after reading enough it finally clicked. A dog show is a way to get approval for breeding stock. Because I believe my (way off standard) dogs are the cutest in the world, does not mean they should be bred. You can imagine how difficult it would be to look at one's own dogs through an objective eye. So in theory, a reputable breeder shows their dogs, gains approval for their breeding stock, does health testing on their dogs, and breeds with the goal of the "perfect" Yorkshire Terrier in mind. With so many unwanted dogs in the USA, it only seems logical to me that breeding should be done with a distinct purpose and goal in mind, and that should not be money! Your post makes me think you have grown to love the yorkie breed through your research (welcome to the club! ). Sadly, simply seeking out any old yorkie breeder isn't nearly enough to guarantee you will likey end up with a dog who has those characteristics. It's also important to note that just because someone breeds two championed show dogs that all of their offspring will be show quality dogs. Maybe one or two will be, and here is where the pets who have all the qualities of a show dog (to the untrained eye) are found. Maximo (posted above) has two great pups that are a great example of pet yorkies who closely resemble the standard.

Someone who is breeding morkies or other mixed breeds is doing so with no "goal" in mind. There is no morkie standard, and morkies can look like everything from yorkies with maltese coloring to maltese with yorkie coloring and everything in between. You really don't have much of an idea of what you are going to get when you are mixing two breeds together. I would be very surprised to find of any breeder that mixes breeds who is doing health testing as well. You are certainly not going to find a dog in a pet store that came from a breeder that does health testing. And yes, it is a proven fact that 99% of dogs in pet stores came from puppy mills. I also think a great test is to imagine the kind of person who would breed their dogs an then ship the puppies off (frequently at ages way too young to even be separated from the mother) to the first person who had a credit card to pay for them. A reptuable breeder will always take a dog back if you can no longer care for it for any reason, will offer a health guarantee, and should generally be there to answer any questions you have as you share your life with one of their pups. Additionally, a reputable and responsible breeder will want to make sure that their puppies are not bred, whereas there are no restrictions placed on pet store puppies, which are most certainly poorly bred, are likey to have many health issues, so you can see how quicky it can escalate to where we have so many poorly bred animals with health issues. It is a vicious cycle.

If size is going to to be an issue, perhaps you and your fiance could consider adopting an adult dog that is full grown? Even the best of breeders cannot guarantee size (only give their best guess). It is the only way to make certain you'll end up with a dog the size you desire. Likewise, if you or he really likes the idea of a morkie, the shelters and rescues are full of these cuties. Looking at an adult morkie gives you an idea of how they'll end up appearance wise too since they often change quite dramatically from their apperance as a puppy.

That website sends up a lot of red flags for me, and I would run far, far away from anyone who advertises teacups.

Kudos to you for doing your research ahead of time. I did not, and I have a poorly bred (very adorable) 5 year old yorkie with some health issues that are both financially and emotionally taxing. Even if money is no object, I can't tell you how hard it is emotionally to watch a dog you love so much suffer. One I educated myself I chose to adopt. My other pup is a puppy mill rescue (obviously poorly bred), so it is a shame she was used only to make puppies while living in a rabbit hutch in deplorable conditions, when she never should have been bred to begin with, not to mention she is an awesome little dog with a fun personality once she finally gained the confidence to come out of her shell. No doubt her puppies were probably sold in pet stores. A reputable rescue will have done a full vetting on any dog ready for adoption to make sure they are in excellent health, or they will be sure to let you know of any current or likely future health issues that would need to be addressed so the surprises are limited.

Sorry that was so long. Good luck!

but it was long and really informative, I wish everyone thought like this
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Old 06-13-2013, 10:13 AM   #15
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Just because you find something on the internet doesnt mean its true there are alot of opinion articles on the internet, show him this thread

I was having a moment and looked for the link to a thread in your post, but you were referring to the thread we're posting on!!! Lordy, I can be so special sometimes!

If you want a yorkie, keep showing him this site. The breeder section would be a good place to go- see if there's any pups available. The picture section is also good to show him. The pups in that section are soo stinking cute! He couldn't possibly resist all that cuteness going on there!
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