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Old 03-15-2011, 09:38 PM   #1
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Exclamation Puppy Mills and BYB's--> What Would YOU Do?

Just want to take a second to thank everyone for their warm welcome. Also thank you to all of my friends here on YT. If you are not a friend, please do not hesitate... befriend me! ( I need all the help I can get)

Change of pace here:

Everyone knows that Puppy Mills and BYB's (Back-yard Breeders) are HORRIBLE and SELFISH individuals. My question here is more "What Would You Do."

What Would You Do If...

You fell in love with a puppy and talked to the breeder, perhaps even seen a few pictures of the facility and after paying a deposit and finally traveling to see the kennel you realize it was all a facade. The facility that you seen pictures of were not theirs or was just a small piece of a much bigger picture. But on your visit you have that same sweet little puppy that you originally fell in love with staring at you with its tail wagging and ready to be yours forever! The little furbutt does not know the difference between a caring owner and home and a dump!
>Would you leave with the puppy and consider it a rescue?
>Report them?
>Leave the puppy and get more involved with your local shelter?
>Just leave the puppy?
>A combination of these things?
>None of these or something completely different?

This is more of just a poll of opinions...not to be taken to the offensive and I am not judging anyone! Me personally, I am not sure if I could leave the little one behind and in a sense punish both the "breeder" and the puppy . I would most likely take the dog and report the person. I rather have the pup and know it is in a good home regardless that there may be some type of health issue. But, I would make it my personal vendetta to ensure that the person responsible gets prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law!

Thanks Everyone!
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Old 03-16-2011, 12:39 AM   #2
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Welcome! Glad you are enjoying this site.

As to your question..... I believe the right answer is to NOT buy the puppy no matter how cute. It is not a rescue because once you put money in the hands of a greeder, you become part of the problem. They just continue to abuse the poor sire and dam, who has probably never set foot outside her cage unless it was to show customers when she had puppies still nursing. Giving any money to these people just contributes to the problem and ensures the cycle of abuse will continue. If we really want to do our part to discourage BYB and mills, we have to stand strong and at least NOT participate in their disgusting business. I know it is hard to leave a little one you love at first sight at a place you feel is inadequate but there are thousands of puppies around the country that are in horrid conditions. We can't buy them all and it really is better to make sure none of your money is funneled to these people. That is our best weapon against them outside of the legal system. Definately report all unsafe and unsanitary conditions both to the kennel club they are using to register their litters and the local animal protective services. If there is direct abuse going on, you can call the police as well.

This is why it is SO important to thoroughly research the breeder before ever looking at the pups. I found that was the only way I could consistently resist. First time out the door, I too bought a pup that was not really what I wanted. But she was so CUTE! The lady was actually selling her due to medical problems so was not the original breeder. (I later wondered if she was really selling the pup because she could see that she wqas not going to be in standard.) I did find out the original breeder was somewhere between a BYB and puppymill. She had a cement building out behind her house full of cages * did not care much about the breed standard. I still loved the pup the rest of her life but I made sure next time I really knew as much as I could about the breeder before I went to look at puppies. All puppies are adorable, lovable and just begging for attention! You just have to ask yourself if you are willing to be a partner in crime with a BYB or mill owner or if you are going to maintain higher standards and find a GOOD breeder.
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Old 03-16-2011, 01:12 AM   #3
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It breaks my heart to say this as I will be honest and say if someone was in person with me and offering a pup I knew was in that position I can't say for certain I wouldn't give them a couple hundred to save one pup-I hope I would be strong enough to remember this in that moment...and do all of the above you mentioned, which is much of what I am already doing now.

IF WE DON'T BUY THEM THEY WON'T BREED THEM. Buying a pup from a pup mill, BYB, Greeder, or otherwise irresponsible individual (brokers are the worse scum out there IMO) anyways BUYING A PUP IS NOT RESCUING A PUP...yes you save that one pup but because you supported such practices you just condemned their parents, siblings to a life of torture. We can protest all day long but the reality is the mighty dollar speaks more than our words or actions-well the action is to refuse to financially support this industry-not one pup mill does this if it is not profitable...BYB may do free to good home-but I don't believe that's the overall reality based on my experience.

I found out the hard way I supported a Greeder in getting my Elvis. long story short she offered me a replacement pup for Elvis considering the issues...sent me pics of pups in cages outdoors and in gross conditions...i forwarded those pics to the local animal control...
I adopted my Scoobers from the pound as a rescue-he is a Schnorkie a designer breed I love Schnorkies-the reality is 90%+ of designer breed dogs are bred by pup mills...his chip was registered to a breeder...who had several hundred dogs registered!


What can we do...speak out, turn them in, post everywhere, tell people as long as you are honest in facts (not just saying you believe this or that but you know this or that) then you are not slandering. DO NOT FINANCIALLY SUPPORT IRRESPONSIBLE BREEDING PRACTICES.

If a pet store you love starts offering these pups, don't shop there anymore, if your neighbor is a BYB or a mini pup mill-turn them in! It only takes people ignoring, blindly financially supporting, or turning the other way for this sickening treatment of animals to thrive. Many people on here think I'm overly down on both Petsmart and Petco...they sell chinchillas from chin farms-the same as pup mills I will NEVER financially support either of those stores because they continue to support chin farms...that's my stand, along with my rescue work and non prof work , letter writing-which does little, but my boycott and spreading the word seems to be the most effective.
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Old 03-16-2011, 01:23 AM   #4
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I can't find the article (i think it was from the SPCA) but I want to mention it anyways in case someone else has it and can post it.

For every pup purchased from a pup mill three will die in that mill on average
; either from breeding complication, illness associated with substandard conditions, or general neglect-the loss of life doesn't matter when you can just mass produce, even basic veterinary care isn't done when it's not cost effective, period. Let's be real most pup mills are filthy because they can't be asked to put in effort to clean or hire a minimum wager to clean up...water isn't even given let along food or exercise-it's not cost effect...how can we financially support that?

So every time I see an add for a pup I know is from a pup mill I imagine the other three that will die...that just stuck in my head...I no longer see a pup and say "awhhh how cute" my stomach turns over the thought of the three on average I'll never see...
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Old 03-16-2011, 02:57 AM   #5
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Rescuing pups from bad breeders just helps keep them in business. We have to make wise buying decisions. Buying from pet stores and bybs just keeps them in business so they can take on or produce more pups. If more people were concienious about where they were buying pups there would only be reputable breeders to buy from
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Old 03-16-2011, 03:34 AM   #6
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you should never buy the puppy of course people have stated that but knowing what I know I can say that I probably would not leave the pup behind I would know it was wrong but I dont know that i could stop myself
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Old 03-16-2011, 04:55 AM   #7
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That's exactly why I stay out of pet stores and researched my breeder before ever going to see the pups.

My friends and I always used to stop in this pet store when we were in a particular town and they had the cutest Yorkie. I went back several times and she was still there. But they would only tell me that their breeder was from Missouri (pet shop was in WV) and would give me no further information.

It killed me, but I walked away and found a small scale breeder closer to home.

I would not condemn someone for feeling sorry for a pup and buying it; but I do believe that if we all refuse to support poor breeders and/or puppymills, then they would eventually go away.
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Old 03-16-2011, 06:21 AM   #8
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I don't think I would be able to leave the puppy there either although I know it's wrong to get a puppy from a puppy mill I could never see a sad face and walk away. I guess I'm just a mush.
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Old 03-16-2011, 06:39 AM   #9
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I know in my heart, I can never go near a pet store that sells yorkies, hold them love on them, can't look at breeder's on line anymore, because it that face looked at me, I'm not sure I could walk away. After all I have learned on YT, I would like to think I could...ugh.

I often think of getting a companion for Zhoie who is now 2yrs, but to tell the truth, I never make it a past step one (thinking of it) because with all I now know, I can no longer trust my own judgement. I know what I would like a reputable breeder, does all the testing etc. But, I'm not confident I would be able to find them, so I keep avoiding it.

Ideally, it would be wonderful if a reputable YT breeder contacted me, could provide the family tree, testing results.....but that's not going to happen.......hence, no companion.

What I'm saying is, since I can't trust my own judgement any longer, I would rather not support at all. At least, I will know I didn't hurt the cause further.
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Old 03-16-2011, 06:40 AM   #10
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I know in my heart, I can never go near a pet store that sells yorkies, hold them love on them, can't look at breeder's on line anymore, because it that face looked at me, I'm not sure I could walk away. After all I have learned on YT, I would like to think I could...ugh.

I often think of getting a companion for Zhoie who is now 2yrs, but to tell the truth, I never make it a past step one (thinking of it) because with all I now know, I can no longer trust my own judgement. I know what I would like a reputable breeder, does all the testing etc. But, I'm not confident I would be able to find them, so I keep avoiding it.

Ideally, it would be wonderful if a reputable YT breeder contacted me, could provide the family tree, testing results.....but that's not going to happen.......hence, no companion.

What I'm saying is, since I can't trust my own judgement any longer, I would rather not support at all. At least, I will know I didn't hurt the cause further.
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Old 03-16-2011, 06:46 AM   #11
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Sorry...double post...ooops. Having issues today, ugh.
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Old 03-16-2011, 07:38 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lexi43 View Post
I don't think I would be able to leave the puppy there either although I know it's wrong to get a puppy from a puppy mill I could never see a sad face and walk away. I guess I'm just a mush.
That's why I can't go to the shelters or look at Petfind anymore. I want to take them all home.


As hard as it is, I would walk away from the BYB/Mill. It's easy to justify it in your mind as a rescue, but the reality is that you are rewarding bad breeding practices.
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Old 03-16-2011, 09:30 PM   #13
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Lightbulb Wow...

Quote:
Originally Posted by FlDebra View Post
Welcome! Glad you are enjoying this site.

As to your question..... I believe the right answer is to NOT buy the puppy no matter how cute. It is not a rescue because once you put money in the hands of a greeder, you become part of the problem. They just continue to abuse the poor sire and dam, who has probably never set foot outside her cage unless it was to show customers when she had puppies still nursing. Giving any money to these people just contributes to the problem and ensures the cycle of abuse will continue. If we really want to do our part to discourage BYB and mills, we have to stand strong and at least NOT participate in their disgusting business. I know it is hard to leave a little one you love at first sight at a place you feel is inadequate but there are thousands of puppies around the country that are in horrid conditions. We can't buy them all and it really is better to make sure none of your money is funneled to these people. That is our best weapon against them outside of the legal system. Definately report all unsafe and unsanitary conditions both to the kennel club they are using to register their litters and the local animal protective services. If there is direct abuse going on, you can call the police as well.

This is why it is SO important to thoroughly research the breeder before ever looking at the pups. I found that was the only way I could consistently resist. First time out the door, I too bought a pup that was not really what I wanted. But she was so CUTE! The lady was actually selling her due to medical problems so was not the original breeder. (I later wondered if she was really selling the pup because she could see that she wqas not going to be in standard.) I did find out the original breeder was somewhere between a BYB and puppymill. She had a cement building out behind her house full of cages * did not care much about the breed standard. I still loved the pup the rest of her life but I made sure next time I really knew as much as I could about the breeder before I went to look at puppies. All puppies are adorable, lovable and just begging for attention! You just have to ask yourself if you are willing to be a partner in crime with a BYB or mill owner or if you are going to maintain higher standards and find a GOOD breeder.


That was very insightful and thoughtful...I can tell that you have really learned from your experience with your first puppy. You put it into a perspective i had not thought about. I realize the importance of finding a great breeder with plenty of references, tested bloodlines, and the time and devotion that comes with whelping a litter...I am just a really sensitive person you can say, so I would probably end up crying my way out the kennel and coming back with authorities!

I too, (now) see the reason behind remaining firm despite the cute little face staring at you!
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Old 03-16-2011, 09:51 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by concretegurl View Post
I can't find the article (i think it was from the SPCA) but I want to mention it anyways in case someone else has it and can post it.

For every pup purchased from a pup mill three will die in that mill on average
; either from breeding complication, illness associated with substandard conditions, or general neglect-the loss of life doesn't matter when you can just mass produce, even basic veterinary care isn't done when it's not cost effective, period. Let's be real most pup mills are filthy because they can't be asked to put in effort to clean or hire a minimum wager to clean up...water isn't even given let along food or exercise-it's not cost effect...how can we financially support that?

So every time I see an add for a pup I know is from a pup mill I imagine the other three that will die...that just stuck in my head...I no longer see a pup and say "awhhh how cute" my stomach turns over the thought of the three on average I'll never see...
I am sure plenty of us here can agree that it would be difficult to turn our back on the pup...so don't feel bad about it and thank you so much for your honesty.

You definitely made some great points as well as the poster before you. Spreading the word is like fire in the wind...it is bound to spread and continue to grow. I applaude you for doing as much as you can and boycotting these places. (Petco, PetSmart, etc.) I must admit that I did not know very much about the chin farms. Maybe it is because I am in Tallahasse, but they don't sell animals like that here...just your parakeets, bunnies, and mice. But that information does reinforce what I feel about them anyway, they completely take the caring owners wallets for granted by hiking up their price more than 50%...I have bought from them many times before until I began to bargain shop. Many things I have bought for Niko was more than doubled there. (I can go on and on about them, but I have decided to take my business to jefferspet.com, and places like this!) Thank you so much for the insight and as the saying goes, I learned something new today!)

Keep up your great work and thank you for being so firm with your stand against the idiots of the world.
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Old 03-16-2011, 10:19 PM   #15
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Love Let's Make Mush...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhetts_mama View Post
That's why I can't go to the shelters or look at Petfind anymore. I want to take them all home.


As hard as it is, I would walk away from the BYB/Mill. It's easy to justify it in your mind as a rescue, but the reality is that you are rewarding bad breeding practices.
I suppose we are all mushy, because I have a horrible time going to shelters. Most times I leave in tears from the sad stories and faces . I would stop by just to show them love...had to stop because I was just driving myself crazy with the guilt.
Sometimes, I would feel guilty because us HUMANS can be so cruel...to dolphins, dogs, and even our own kind...and those are just examples!

So let's get mushy!
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