Why I positive train my girl.

[Yorkie Mum]

I am what is called a crossover trainer.
I started by listening to an old long time trainer that thought well dogs where out to take over the world( alpha and dominance) and we had to be tough and make them.
I was raised that way as well, so I started with my girl that why.
Big mistake.
My girl had had a rough start with an owner that at 9 months old could not handle her.
Thoughts are that she has hurt and also lacked social interaction and grow a ton of fears. As well a bad gene pool and BYB breed.
I made it worse and then watching her one day and listening to the trainer saying be tougher. It clicked she is an 8 pound dog I am yanking around a room. What am I proving that I can make her and scare her into doing that which I want her to do.
I do not do that to my human kids. Why would I do it to my girl.
So I got to work on finding a different way.
My vet is a clicker trainer and in the process of becoming a behaviorist.
She gave me guidance and a short list of books and I got to work on it.
I have read a ton more books than she sent me out to read and I have attended a seminar. Lucy and I are going to attend another one here very soon.
I am far from knowing it all and I am far from having all the answers if I did I could fix the issues my girl is having after being tossed to the ground and bit by a pit bull but I do know that not letting her think it out for herself is not the way to go. That forcing her through this will make her crash.
We under estimate our fur kids if we do not let them think for them selfs and allow them to learn things at their own pace.
My girl is far from perfect but she is well mannered and was a good recall as long as there is not a strange man or dog around.
If I had stayed with the yank, yell and make them way she be a long time gone.
The pit bull that rolled her be dead to and she is not as I pushed hard the owner and the law enforcement guys to get her into training with my vet.
We can train from love and kindness and respect. These guys have a soul and a brain. They will work better and be more willing to work if we let them use it.
This is from my favorite site it is called On Punishment. BY Bob Baily as I understand it he is a founder of Clicker method.

http://www.clickersolutions.com/arti...eflections.htm

So you know I am not a pure clicker trainer I toss in luring once and a while as it works as well, it is gentle and hands off I am willing to try it.

So that is why I am the way I am.
I do not expect others to follow my way. I just thought I would share why I feel as strongly as I do about aggression and working with dogs that are testy in a positive and respectful way.
Aggressive dogs are very smart and when you help turn themselves around it is amazing to see. The love they send your way will blow your socks off.
There is nothing like a cuddle on your lap from a girl that never liked it before.
Or watching her kiss a know person just cause she wants to.
Or sit in a strange mans lap cause he has treats and she figured out he is safe.
To watch her life light go on and her trust that she is safe.
I am working with her now to get her to calm down again after the pit attack and we will get it.
Thanks for reading. Sorry this is so long.

Joy

[FirstYorkie]

Great post, Joy!

I'll tell you why I'm a "positive trainer": because it works!!!

I, too, listened in the past to the old-time experts who insisted that dogs must be "broken" and "dominated" to make them obey. Never again. It just isn't necessary.

Joey isn't the first dog that I've clicker-trained. I've used clicker-training to teach other dogs to do tricks. Joey IS the first dog I've had for whom clicker-training is a way of life. Positive training isn't just for tricks. It's for problem-solving as well. I'll say it again: positive training is a way of life.

It's knowing that positive reinforcement works MUCH better than negative reinforcement. It's knowing that our dogs want to please us. It's knowing they don't have to be "broken" or dominated. They just have to be shown in a very clear manner what pleases us. Behavior that is rewarded will increase in frequency. Period. It's knowing that it's much easier to teach a dog what to do than to teach him what not to do. It's knowing that to stop an inappropriate behavior, train a different, incompatible behavior.

Clicker training uses a clicker (or a word or sound) to mark the exact second that the dog is doing something right. The dog then gets a reward. Often, the reward is food. But, it can be anything that the dog finds rewarding. A game of tug or fetch. A belly rub. A chance to "go sniff".

My dog doesn't obey me because he's afraid of the consequences of not obeying. He obeys me because there's something in it for him, too. I'm much happier having that kind of relationship and I've got to believe that he is, too!

[Juliealfies mum]

Hi I have spoken to Joy on this subject before and Im trying really hard with Alfie with positive clicker training as I sid before He is great but with strangers is un predictable . We are trying to let him bark at first then when he is quiete click and treat and say quiete this seems to be working but he sometimes switches off ! He also goes mad when the car stops , so Im looking for ideas with this I try to say quite good boy and click when he is quiete but he gets so exited , so any tips for this. Thanks Julie

[livingdustmops]

Excellent Post and thank you for taking the time to write your thoughts down...Hopefully people will read yours and First Yorkie's post and it will click ( ) with the people reading the post.

[Yorkie Mum]

Originally Posted by Juliealfies mum

Hi I have spoken to Joy on this subject before and Im trying really hard with Alfie with positive clicker training as I sid before He is great but with strangers is un predictable . We are trying to let him bark at first then when he is quiete click and treat and say quiete this seems to be working but he sometimes switches off ! He also goes mad when the car stops , so Im looking for ideas with this I try to say quite good boy and click when he is quiete but he gets so exited , so any tips for this. Thanks Julie

Well he has got that he gets a treat when he does something right.
He just has to figure out what the right is.
So try click for the quiet no words non. it could be he is hyped up with the words the click is enough.
Pass him his treat.
If he gets excited pause a second after the click but not long. as click means a treat and see if he can stop. Remember no words.
If he pauses give him his first treat and then a few more.
but if he does not just give the one.
what we want him to do is try and figure out why he got a bonus.

If that does not kick in ask him to sit before you give a treat.
a sit means he can not be going crazy as his butt is on the ground.
But make sure he gets the treat as a click means he most get one.

Joy

[Yorkie Mum]

Originally Posted by FirstYorkie

Great post, Joy!

I'll tell you why I'm a "positive trainer": because it works!!!

I, too, listened in the past to the old-time experts who insisted that dogs must be "broken" and "dominated" to make them obey. Never again. It just isn't necessary.

Joey isn't the first dog that I've clicker-trained. positive training is a way of life.

Thank you it was late when I posted this so hoped it read well.

Yes it does work and I am happy I found it.
My girl is the first I have ever clicker trained but not the first dog I have trained. My timing still is not great.

For me positive is becoming the way for me.
I used to get rattled when others posted rough training not so much anymore.
Now I can leave it alone and walk way till I can post a calmer response.

Only thing gets me going now is dogs are little wolves and anything Alpha.
I have to pull out a brown paper bag as I tend to hyper ventilate.

But since I found a great little book by a Canadian Trainer called.
Dominance Theory and Dogs by James O’Heare.
And the articles at Clicker solutions in the last few days on Dominance and Social Behavior Issues.
Not going to let that get me either or at least I am going to try.

Joy

[Paisleypup]

Thank you for writing on this important subject, Joy. I have obedience trained dogs before using food reward method and found it very positive in results. The clicker method is something that I would like to know much more about. It makes sense, I know that with horses that the "horse whisperer" method of training is becoming well know and a gentle touch works even with a 1000 lb animal. Not many people think about dogs needing the same type of humane treatment. Please send me any info that you have regarding this method using clickers. Just by coincidence I was checking out my local dog clubs events pages today and found a local trainer that advertises 'clicker' method, so I'll call her... I'll go to the site you provided also, but please pm with anything else you or any of you here can help me with. So much of YT is geared toward breeders, this is great. We need more of these threads!!!!!

[Yorkie Mum]

Originally Posted by Paisleypup

Thank you for writing on this important subject, Joy. I have obedience trained dogs before using food reward method and found it very positive in results. The clicker method is something that I would like to know much more about. It makes sense, I know that with horses that the "horse whisperer" method of training is becoming well know and a gentle touch works even with a 1000 lb animal. Not many people think about dogs needing the same type of humane treatment. Please send me any info that you have regarding this method using clickers. Just by coincidence I was checking out my local dog clubs events pages today and found a local trainer that advertises 'clicker' method, so I'll call her... I'll go to the site you provided also, but please pm with anything else you or any of you here can help me with. So much of YT is geared toward breeders, this is great. We need more of these threads!!!!!

Thank you for the click and list is sent.
Horse whispering is very much working with a horse in operant conditioning and positive.
Clicker came into being because someone wanted to teach Killer whales and well you can not bet them or be rough as they sink to the bottom and they will kill them selves. They will how ever work for you with fish and clickers till the jump out ot the water.

Joy

[Paisleypup]

This is amazing to me! I went to the webpages you listed and there is a WEALTH of information there. I am going to pursue this. Thanks again, stay in touch.

[Yorkie Mum]

Originally Posted by Paisleypup

This is amazing to me! I went to the webpages you listed and there is a WEALTH of information there. I am going to pursue this. Thanks again, stay in touch.

It is amazing to me to still. I wonder sometimes as I post or read or look at my girl just where we have been and are going too.
Watch out life for you just changed.
You need anything Pm me or post.

Joy

[SoCalyorkiLvr]

GREAT THREAD! So positive. I have been clicker trained for 5 years now and have done it with 5 dogs. It works!!