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Old 06-06-2010, 04:04 PM   #1
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Default How do I introduce a GSD to a Yorkie?

My brother has a German Shepherd that is 5 1/2 months old. My yorkie is 4 months old and she weighs only 3 1/2 lbs while he weighs over 50 lbs. They have the exact same amount of energy even though they are different sizes. We've had them both for about the same amount of time but when my yorkie came to me she was a tiny little puppy the size of my hand and so we did not let them get close to each other for fear the GSD would hurt her and because they were both in the process of getting all their shots.

We have tried to slowly get them acquainted with each other under supervision but letting them sniff each other and be in each others presence but after 5 minutes the GSD wants to play but it would be far too dangerous to allow that. She is terribly afraid of him and will roll onto her back in a submissive position. She is a very shy puppy when it comes to other dogs but she absolutely adores people.

My question is how do I go about getting them use to each other? I don't want her to fear other dogs. My GSD doesn't know his size and he will try to but his mouth over her head and will bite and snap if he gets too excited. Will I always have to keep them apart? I want them to become good friends without anyone getting hurt. Thanks in advance for any advice.
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Old 06-06-2010, 04:29 PM   #2
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He puts his mouth over her head and bites and snaps? That's a tragedy waiting to happen. I don't think hoping they can become good friends is realistic ..... or safe.
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Old 06-06-2010, 04:49 PM   #3
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Those are suppose to be two separate sentences. He bites and snaps when he gets excited but he's been trained to understand that biting is not appropriate.

I'm not hoping they will become good friends. I want them to be good friends and if they can't then at least tolerate each other. I would appreciate advice and not opinions. Kicking one dog out because he is too big is not an option. They are our family.
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Old 06-06-2010, 05:06 PM   #4
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Sounds like he's just playing biting just like our Yorkies do. I would just practice with
the two of them around each other, and teaching BOTH dogs boundaries and show them
what they allowed/not allowed to do. It's perfectly capable for a little dog and a big dog
to become great friends. As long as the GSD is not dog aggressive, or aggressive in general,
I think you will be fine. Show your Yorkie that when the GSD is around -- she gets a treat,
so she associates him with good and positive things. When the GSD is doing his
playful biting, gently take him away and say 'gentle' or any other word so he learns
what is acceptable and what is not. Basic training, if not done already, is always
a great step for both dogs to learn sit, stay, down, away, etc, so that if you think
things are getting out of hand, you can give them a command to obey.
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Old 06-06-2010, 05:13 PM   #5
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Those are suppose to be two separate sentences. He bites and snaps when he gets excited but he's been trained to understand that biting is not appropriate.

I'm not hoping they will become good friends. I want them to be good friends and if they can't then at least tolerate each other. I would appreciate advice and not opinions. Kicking one dog out because he is too big is not an option. They are our family.
There are many YT members who have large dogs in the same home as their Yorkies. However, Ladymom has been on YT long enough to read enough tragic stories of Yorkies being killed by their larger family members. It is a risk.

There was a story here not too long ago about one member who came home to a bloody, heartbreaking surprise. Even if you supervise closely, attacks can happen too quickly for you to stop.

The GSD needs professional training one way or the other. I have owned large dogs, and I firmly believe they need highly qualified trainers.
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Old 06-06-2010, 05:47 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lpham View Post
My GSD doesn't know his size and he will try to but his mouth over her head and will bite and snap if he gets too excited. Will I always have to keep them apart?
Quote:
Originally Posted by lpham View Post
Those are suppose to be two separate sentences. He bites and snaps when he gets excited but he's been trained to understand that biting is not appropriate.

I'm not hoping they will become good friends. I want them to be good friends and if they can't then at least tolerate each other. I would appreciate advice and not opinions. Kicking one dog out because he is too big is not an option. They are our family.
Asking if you will always have to keep them apart is asking for an opinion.

Running those two sentences together substantially changes the whole scenario you presented us with when you asked your question.

If you reread my post, no where did I suggest "kicking one dog out". I just said it was unrealistic to expect them to become "good friends" in answer to your question. That answer was based on your statement that "My GSD doesn't know his size and he will try to but his mouth over her head and will bite and snap if he gets too excited."
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Old 06-06-2010, 05:48 PM   #7
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There are many YT members who have large dogs in the same home as their Yorkies. However, Ladymom has been on YT long enough to read enough tragic stories of Yorkies being killed by their larger family members. It is a risk.

There was a story here not too long ago about one member who came home to a bloody, heartbreaking surprise. Even if you supervise closely, attacks can happen too quickly for you to stop.

The GSD needs professional training one way or the other. I have owned large dogs, and I firmly believe they need highly qualified trainers.
I do agree; it is a risk. For sure. But I've always read a few stories of little dogs killing each other while no one was home as well, including 2 Yorkies. I think it works (big dog/little dog combos) more than not work, but of course you're going to read on the internet more about the bad things than the good things, because that's generally why people come to the internet, when there is a problem, so when reading this forum, you will read more problems than good things in general, just because it's a place people seek medical and training advice. I think you have to know your dog well (both little and large) and just be smart about things. If the dogs don't live together 24/7, I wouldn't leave them alone unsupervised. My grandma's large Lab is great with Jackson and he loves her, but because he's only been around her about 8-10 times or so, and never left alone with her, I wouldn't leave them alone unsupervised even though they've always 100% gotten along.

I believe that all dogs, large and small, need good training because, in all honesty, I meet alot more nice well behaved large dogs than small dogs, because their owners know the large dogs usually get blamed, lol. A 100lb GSD that is lunging at the end of its leash barking at other dogs while on a walk is going to get a lot more grief and criticism than a 4lb yorkie doing the same thing, and I think both situations need to be handled the same.

I totally think it's realistic for them to become friends, but you'd have to explain he mouthing and biting a little more. Is it aggressive or playful? That makes a huge difference. Also, my friends Yorkie, Nala, is on her back 90% of the time at the dog park, lol. She loves everybody... it's just what she does. She's just really submissive. But she has a blast at the dog park (we go in small dog section) but she's still always on her back. It's just the way she feels comfortable.

BTW-- this is not directly aimed at you Maximo! I'm just posting this as a general statement for this thread, even though slightly O/T.
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Old 06-06-2010, 06:06 PM   #8
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I do agree; it is a risk. For sure. But I've always read a few stories of little dogs killing each other while no one was home as well, including 2 Yorkies. I think it works (big dog/little dog combos) more than not work, but of course you're going to read on the internet more about the bad things than the good things, because that's generally why people come to the internet, when there is a problem, so when reading this forum, you will read more problems than good things in general, just because it's a place people seek medical and training advice. I think you have to know your dog well (both little and large) and just be smart about things. If the dogs don't live together 24/7, I wouldn't leave them alone unsupervised. My grandma's large Lab is great with Jackson and he loves her, but because he's only been around her about 8-10 times or so, and never left alone with her, I wouldn't leave them alone unsupervised even though they've always 100% gotten along.

I believe that all dogs, large and small, need good training because, in all honesty, I meet alot more nice well behaved large dogs than small dogs, because their owners know the large dogs usually get blamed, lol. A 100lb GSD that is lunging at the end of its leash barking at other dogs while on a walk is going to get a lot more grief and critism than a 4lb yorkie doing the same thing, and I think both situations need to be handled the same.

BTW-- this is not directly aimed at you Maximo! I'm just posting this as a general statement for this thread, even though slightly O/T.
Not O/T at all, and Maximo knows you aren't talking about him, lol.

I agree with you on all points in this post. My 2 young, male Yorkies are never left alone together -- not because I think they will attack each other (although anything is possible), rather because they get each other going too fast and jumping off things and crashing into things and wrestling. When no one is here to slow them down, I separate them with xpens. (I have multiple xpens connected to make large play areas).

I would still recommend that any owner of a GSD enroll in advanced training classes, especially if the dog is going to share a home with a tiny Yorkie. If I invested in a good GSD, I would want the dog to have the best training.
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Old 06-06-2010, 06:11 PM   #9
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Not O/T at all, and Maximo knows you aren't talking about him, lol.

I agree with you on all points in this post. My 2 young, male Yorkies are never left alone together -- not because I think they will attack each other (although anything is possible), rather because they get each other going too fast and jumping off things and crashing into things and wrestling. When no one is here to slow them down, I separate them with xpens. (I have multiple xpens connected to make large play areas).

I would still recommend that any owner of a GSD enroll in advanced training classes, especially if the dog is going to share a home with a tiny Yorkie. If I invested in a good GSD, I would want the dog to have the best training.
Totally agree! GSD's need extensive training and socialization, moreso than other breeds, but I think alot of Yorkies would benefit from these classes as well lol. I had a GSD growing up and she only lived to be 4 years old because she attacked a worker than came onto our property unexpected and we didn't lock her up, she had to be put down that day. I was devasted and now knowing what we know about them and dogs in general, she could have been an amazing dog and I still miss her.

Jackson is an only dog at our regular house but sometimes we will spend up to 2 nights at my dads home and we leave all 3 of the dogs loose in free roam but they all just sleep when we're not home, LOL. We do have the upstairs gated off because that's where the 2 cats 'live' lol. He used to do the same thing when my moms dog was still alive and lived with us. So we've been lucky, they don't get into things when we're not home. When we ARE home-- a whole 'nother story.
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Old 06-06-2010, 06:18 PM   #10
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Totally agree! GSD's need extensive training and socialization, moreso than other breeds, but I think alot of Yorkies would benefit from these classes as well lol. I had a GSD growing up and she only lived to be 4 years old because she attacked a worker than came onto our property unexpected and we didn't lock her up, she had to be put down that day. I was devasted and now knowing what we know about them and dogs in general, she could have been an amazing dog and I still miss her.

Jackson is an only dog at our regular house but sometimes we will spend up to 2 nights at my dads home and we leave all 3 of the dogs loose in free roam but they all just sleep when we're not home, LOL. We do have the upstairs gated off because that's where the 2 cats 'live' lol. He used to do the same thing when my moms dog was still alive and lived with us. So we've been lucky, they don't get into things when we're not home. When we ARE home-- a whole 'nother story.
OMG! That is so sad. I'm so sorry for you.

You have proved you are an excellent trainer with Jackson. I bet you could train a GSD today. For the OP, time is critical and there isn't enough of it at this point to adequately learn to train a GSD at home. Seek out a pro to help make your GSD the best dog he/she can be.
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Old 06-06-2010, 07:02 PM   #11
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I think that even being friends, accidents can happen. It took quite awhile before Bear (80lbs) was very patient with the Yorkies getting around his face. He would air snap. He is a gentle spirit and that is how he would show his annoyance. He is very tolerant with them, he is just more laid back. But the other day when DH was getting the boys (Baxter and Bear) ready for their walk, Bear was unusually excited and in the process of jumping around came extremely close to crushing one of the girls. Had I not seen and been standing right there to push his hip as he was landing he would have put his weight directly on
Baby's exposed tummy. (She fluctuates between 5 1/2 - 6 1/2 lbs) he would have done serious internal damage or death. DH was there, if I had not been, that would have been considered close supervision. So, we are all on big happy family, that always puts the girls in an xpen when we are not there to closely monitor, that never lets the 'kids' all play together without close supervision.
BTW, Bear jumping is unusual and not allowed in the house...LOL, don't know what came over him, he was being ordered down when it happened.
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Old 06-06-2010, 07:14 PM   #12
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I do agree; it is a risk. For sure. But I've always read a few stories of little dogs killing each other while no one was home as well, including 2 Yorkies. I think it works (big dog/little dog combos) more than not work, but of course you're going to read on the internet more about the bad things than the good things, because that's generally why people come to the internet, when there is a problem, so when reading this forum, you will read more problems than good things in general, just because it's a place people seek medical and training advice. I think you have to know your dog well (both little and large) and just be smart about things. If the dogs don't live together 24/7, I wouldn't leave them alone unsupervised. My grandma's large Lab is great with Jackson and he loves her, but because he's only been around her about 8-10 times or so, and never left alone with her, I wouldn't leave them alone unsupervised even though they've always 100% gotten along.

I believe that all dogs, large and small, need good training because, in all honesty, I meet alot more nice well behaved large dogs than small dogs, because their owners know the large dogs usually get blamed, lol. A 100lb GSD that is lunging at the end of its leash barking at other dogs while on a walk is going to get a lot more grief and criticism than a 4lb yorkie doing the same thing, and I think both situations need to be handled the same.

I totally think it's realistic for them to become friends, but you'd have to explain he mouthing and biting a little more. Is it aggressive or playful? That makes a huge difference. Also, my friends Yorkie, Nala, is on her back 90% of the time at the dog park, lol. She loves everybody... it's just what she does. She's just really submissive. But she has a blast at the dog park (we go in small dog section) but she's still always on her back. It's just the way she feels comfortable.

BTW-- this is not directly aimed at you Maximo! I'm just posting this as a general statement for this thread, even though slightly O/T.
I absolutely agree that large breeds needs professional training but that goes for small dogs as well. I was at the petstore the other day and two elderly ladies had a chihuahua inside their cart and admitted to the cashier that their chihuahua will bite someone that it doesn't know when the cashier asked if their dog was nice.

When he bites her, its a soft bite that makes me know that he is aware of his bite inhibition but I still don't trust him because to him she is a dog that he can play with and unfortunately he does not know how rough is too rough. He also tends to use his paw to push her which is something that he gets reprimanded for. She barks at him when she knows he is being held back which I think causes the GSD to get more excited. The ironic thing is that when we take him to the dog park, he is afraid of dogs that are larger than him. He is a high-energy breed but my yorkie has a reputation with her vet and everyone else that knows her as being a hyper puppy hard to calm them down since they are both always excited and active. I really don't know how to go about doing this because I'm introducing a big puppy to a little puppy and everything I have read has been about introducing an older dog to a younger dog or vice versa.

He in general is a very good dog and all I want to do is set them both up for success. When we do the "training excercises" they are always 10 minutes or less (because the GSD gets too excited). I always have my bf and brother present with me when we do exercises like this for fear something could go wrong. I think my GSD gets upset when she is in his "room" (where we have his crate) because that is what he has established as his territory. She is crated in the bedroom with me because I had read somewhere online it is best to keep dogs in separate rooms when you first get them. My GSD was the first to join us and a month later I adopted my yorkie. We are moving to a new apartment in a week and a half so they will both be in a completely new environment so will that make any difference in how they acclimate to each other? I'm sure it will be a setback in potty training with my yorkie.

@ Ladymom: When I asked if I would have to keep them separated, I really wasn't asking for an opinion. Copying and pasting a sentence out of context and saying it mandates an opinion makes it look like that but my next sentence in my original post was gratitude for any advice that would be meaningful to my situation. What you had to say only made me feel like there was no hope for having my dogs coexist peacefully...which was why I said kicking one dog out was not an option for me because you said it was an unrealistic expectation.

They do live together and we definitely never leave any of them unsupervised since they are both puppies and like to explore and get their mouths on anything and everything. When we have to leave they are both crated in their own crates for their own safety and my peace of mind. It really is true that large breed dogs get more criticism than a small dog. I've had so many situations when walking my GSD and people back away from him in fear because he is such a large puppy and people have asked me if he bites based on breed stereotypes. We struggled to find an apartment because of the GSD because it is a restricted breed at so many apartments. I blame it on ignorance and poor handling on the owner's part.

I definitely appreciate all the advice and tips.

Last edited by lpham; 06-06-2010 at 07:18 PM.
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Old 06-07-2010, 05:33 AM   #13
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I think that even being friends, accidents can happen. It took quite awhile before Bear (80lbs) was very patient with the Yorkies getting around his face. He would air snap. He is a gentle spirit and that is how he would show his annoyance. He is very tolerant with them, he is just more laid back. But the other day when DH was getting the boys (Baxter and Bear) ready for their walk, Bear was unusually excited and in the process of jumping around came extremely close to crushing one of the girls. Had I not seen and been standing right there to push his hip as he was landing he would have put his weight directly on
Baby's exposed tummy. (She fluctuates between 5 1/2 - 6 1/2 lbs) he would have done serious internal damage or death. DH was there, if I had not been, that would have been considered close supervision. So, we are all on big happy family, that always puts the girls in an xpen when we are not there to closely monitor, that never lets the 'kids' all play together without close supervision.
BTW, Bear jumping is unusual and not allowed in the house...LOL, don't know what came over him, he was being ordered down when it happened.
Nana, you make an important point: serious injury can occur even with non-aggressive behavior. I'm glad your Baby was not hurt.
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Old 06-07-2010, 06:34 AM   #14
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To the OP: Try visiting the "brothers and sisters" section of this forum and reading some of the threads, then private message some of the owners. They should be willing to offer advice or share their experiences.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lpham View Post
@ Ladymom: When I asked if I would have to keep them separated, I really wasn't asking for an opinion. Copying and pasting a sentence out of context and saying it mandates an opinion makes it look like that but my next sentence in my original post was gratitude for any advice that would be meaningful to my situation. What you had to say only made me feel like there was no hope for having my dogs coexist peacefully...which was why I said kicking one dog out was not an option for me because you said it was an unrealistic expectation.
Come now, this is too much protest. You asked:
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Originally Posted by lpham View Post
My GSD doesn't know his size and he will try to but his mouth over her head and will bite and snap if he gets too excited. Will I always have to keep them apart? I want them to become good friends without anyone getting hurt. Thanks in advance for any advice.
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It really is true that large breed dogs get more criticism than a small dog. I've had so many situations when walking my GSD and people back away from him in fear because he is such a large puppy and people have asked me if he bites based on breed stereotypes. We struggled to find an apartment because of the GSD because it is a restricted breed at so many apartments. I blame it on ignorance and poor handling on the owner's part.
Winston Churchill advised keeping an open mind, but not so open that our brains fall out. If you were given the choice of being attacked by Vern Troyer or Mike Tyson, which would you choose? Having personal experience being bitten by many dogs, from GSDs to Shihtzus, I'll go up against the Shihtzu any day.

I agree all dogs of all sizes need training and should be well-behaved, well-socialized. However, even dog-passionate experts like Cesar Millan will tell you that some breeds pose a greater risk to causing greater injury than others.

Apartment owners and management aren't discriminating against certain breeds out of ignorance. They are advised by insurance actuaries who carefully study real statistics. Some people will argue that statistics are skewed by inaccurate reporting. I refer you to my first paragraph.

You cannot be offended by people being afraid of your GSD. My family had a gorgeous 80+ pound Airedale and it's another breed that the average person doesn't run up to and swoon over and beg to pet. Airedales are playful clowns, but they were also bred to be aggressive working dogs. If you are going to properly train a dog, you have to respect the breed and its capabilities.

I'll leave you with one more personal experience: I used to dogsit my neighbor's GSD, who has passed on. This male was highly trained, very mellow, and he had grown up with a toy dog. One day, he was on the porch, off leash, when a woman walked her toy poodle past the house. The GSD shot out to the street and grabbed the poodle in his mouth and shook it until the GSD's owner managed to tear them apart. Luckily, the poodle survived. Things happen. The only solution is unwavering vigilance and taking precautions.
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Old 06-07-2010, 08:03 AM   #15
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As someone who has both GSD and yorkies, they do NOT play together, hangout together or sleep together, they are kept separate. My German Shepherds though well behaved are 1 and 2 years old and still love to play. My male is over 100 pounds if he were to pounce on one of the yorkies, though in play, the results could be devistating. This may not always be the case, I got my first yorkie when my German Shepherd Dreivon was 5 years old. Drevion was my K-9 and very well trained. Your brothers GSD is 5 months and no where near where he should be in his training to be allowed near a tiny dog.
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