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06-06-2006, 05:48 AM | #1 |
Donating YT 500 Club Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Seymour, Indiana
Posts: 1,384
| AKC Standards...I couldn't believe this!!...I called and found this out!!!! My daughter told me that her boyfriend's friend who does this all the time and she said that U can breed U're father and daughter, mother and son and it's okay to do this...Well wondering about this I called AKC and they said YES U can, they regeister litters all the time this way...The lady I spoke to did say it was inbreeding tho...Okay is this right? Do U all here do this? I just about fell out of my chair when I heard this...I wouldn't think this would be legal here for a breeder...Can U all help me to understand this? Is this right to do it? And how many of us buy inbreed AKC dogs and really don't know it unless we get their pedigree and see it on there? (I just went back on Tiffanie and Theodore 3 generation) And even when we do get their pedigree how do we know their not inbreed? Is it safe to do for our new puppies, what about the parents? Will it harm them...Will our puppies come out with birth defects? What's the risk? Please help me to understand? Hugs, Lee |
Welcome Guest! | |
06-06-2006, 08:42 AM | #2 |
YT Addict Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Tennessee
Posts: 460
| sometimes breeders will mate father back to the daughter to reduce the size of the puppies, but I'm not sure if works all the time, I don't do it myself. I like to use non related male & female. some breeders will line breed using dogs that are some what related but not closely related. |
06-06-2006, 08:43 AM | #3 |
No Longer a Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: South Florida
Posts: 8,577
| Akc I am surprised you find it illegal...there are NO illegal rules in what you can breed to what in the dog world...there are no rules period! If there were, we would have no puppymills. You have mistaken the AKC for a group that cares about the welfare of dogs..that is your first mistake. AKC is a profit making recording agency ...who I might add have lost millions trying to make registering rules..those rules are different then "what dog is bred to what.(breeding rules).AKC wants to make sure the stud owner has paid for the DNA recording, but they do not care of the stud is related to the dam, it can be his full sister. "Ain't reality a bitch? So what does this mean for the pet owner....DEAL WITH A REPUTABLE BREEDER...and I might add..linebreeding, is good breeding. Inbreeding is no longer necessary to produce type...and lethal in the hands of a novice. Last edited by YorkieRose; 06-06-2006 at 08:47 AM. |
06-06-2006, 08:52 AM | #4 |
Mom loves Gucci Donating Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: New York City
Posts: 6,427
| Wow, I didn't know about this. Thank for the info Pat and Lee. |
06-06-2006, 09:15 AM | #5 |
Donating YT 2000 Club Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: GA
Posts: 3,787
| Pat, I couldn't have said it better! P.S. If you inbreed - you can get really nice pups or if anything troubling is in the line - this too will show up ten fold. That is why Pat said it can be lethal for novice breeders to inbreed. T. |
06-06-2006, 09:57 AM | #6 |
Donating YT 4000 Club Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Portland Oregon
Posts: 4,405
| Pat I thought AKC was nonprofit Here is what the board minutes say THE AMERICAN KENNEL CLUB The American Kennel Club was founded in 1884. It operates the world’s largest registry of purebred dogs and is the nation’s leading not-for-profit organization devoted to the study, breeding, exhibiting, and advancement of purebred dogs. In 2005, the AKC sanctioned and regulated 18,542 competitive dog events. The AKC approves, sanctions, and regulates the events of its 584 member clubs. In addition, approximately 4,050 licensed and sanctioned clubs hold events under AKC Rules and Regulations.
__________________ Kimberly |
06-06-2006, 09:59 AM | #7 |
Donating YT 4000 Club Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Portland Oregon
Posts: 4,405
| this is also interesting from their site Responsible Breeding Steps 5 - Know Your Genetics A good breeder will have a basic understanding of the science of genetics. Everything about your prospective puppies-health, soundness, looks, temperament-will be determined by the genes passed on by their parents, and by their parents before them. Therefore, the selection of a mating pair should not be made on the basis of the dog's or bitch's looks (or temperament, or soundness, and so forth) alone, but should be based on an understanding of how the animal's genes contributed to its looks, and of how those genes are passed on and expressed. That is why it is essential to study the pedigrees of your mating pair. The more knowledge you have as you make your selection, the more likely you are to produce a litter with the qualities you desire. You must also be well-versed in the genetic problems that affect your breed. Genetic defects can occur in any breed and can affect any system in the body. Some genetic diseases may occur in many breeds, others occur in only one or a few breeds. The following is a brief explanation of how genetic defects may be inherited and expressed. Diseases that follow a dominant pattern of inheritance need only one abnormal gene. That is, if only one parent is affected, the condition will show up in each successive generation. Some individuals may be only mildly affected with the condition, making it difficult to detect. In such cases, the condition can mistakenly be thought to skip generations. Diseases that follow a recessive pattern of inheritance occur in homozygous individuals, meaning dogs with two abnormal genes. Dogs with one mutant and one normal gene are heterozygous, and they are carriers of the condition. They appear normal but can pass the abnormal gene to their offspring. Recessive mutant genes can be passed through many generations before emerging in the offspring of two dogs that carry the same genetic mutation. Polygenic disorders result from the cumulative action of a number of different genes. The exact number of genes involved and their individual functions are difficult to determine, and the pattern of inheritance tends to vary from family to family. Polygenic inheritance can sometimes mimic either dominant or recessive inheritance, and this feature may lead to erroneous conclusions regarding the type of underlying genetic abnormality. Chromosomal anomalies -- defects in chromosome number and structure-can also cause genetic diseases. Dogs normally have 39 pairs of chromosomes on which genes are located. Major abnormalities in chromosome number and structure can produce serious defects. Whether you inbreed, linebreed, or outcross may have an effect on the incidence of genetic disease in the offspring. Inbreeding is the mating of two individuals that are related through one or more common ancestors. The closest form of inbreeding involves parent-child and brother-sister matings. Linebreeding, a form of inbreeding, usually involves mating more distantly related dogs. The rate of polygenic and recessively inherited diseases tends to increase with inbreeding, because the chance that the two animals carry the same mutation is greater when the dogs are related. Outcrossing is the mating of two dogs of the same breed that are otherwise virtually unrelated.
__________________ Kimberly |
06-06-2006, 10:12 AM | #8 | |
Donating YT 4000 Club Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Portland Oregon
Posts: 4,405
| Quote:
http://www.sloughi-international.com/linebreeding.htm
__________________ Kimberly | |
06-06-2006, 12:55 PM | #9 |
YT 2000 Club Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: USA
Posts: 2,992
| Not only with dogs - but with horses and other animals - reputable, very knowledgeable, and very experienced breeders have successfully inbred these animals for a long time. They are aware of their animal's pedigrees generations back - and inbred only very exceptional animals. ------------------------------------------------------ ***** It's somewhat interesting that people would be concerned about this (if it is being done by reputable, knowledgeable breeders) when all sorts of people are breeding hundreds of little Yorkies all the time that should never be bred at all....Yorkies that are too small, too large ... Yorkies with a mirad of physical and congenital defects, and many other health problems - as well as Yorkies with far-from-standard physical appearances. (The cute, darling little pets that a lot of us have are little Yorkies that shouldn't be bred - but are being bred all the time.) Inbreeding two near-perfect, healthy, animals whose pedigrees are well known (by an experienced knowledgeable breeder) is far better than what a lot of people are doing all the time. ----------------------------------------------- Feminvstr -- Thank you for your post about the AKC. They are a responsible organization that is absolutely necessary for those of us who enjoy owning, breeding, and showing purebred dogs. They are not a police force. They are a registry and an organization that promotes and fosters many events and other programs that so many of us enjoy. Carol Jean |
06-06-2006, 03:24 PM | #10 | |
YT 2000 Club Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Missouri
Posts: 2,394
| Quote:
You are right ...you have to find a REPUTABLE BREEDER. A dog registered AKC does not always mean quaility. I have not been to fond of AKC since I found out they were in Goodwin Missouri and patting the Hunte's Corp on the back for what a outstanding business they have..and we all know the Hunte's Corp is the biggest puppy broker there is and promoting puppymills.... | |
06-06-2006, 04:20 PM | #11 |
No Longer a Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: South Florida
Posts: 8,577
| Akc AKC is the best of the best..IMO...I back them and want AKC dogs..but I still do not like they way they do things... why do they go to commerical breeders conventions, Huntt Corp as mentioned trying to lure the commerical breeder back if they make NO money from them..I would say."good riddens"..let all the mass breeders go elsewhere... Do they want revenue from millers to support their programs and continue the AKC...few commerical breeders who supply pet shops now support AKC..it is not in their best interest to do so...but AKC wants them back??? I do not like two faced people or organizations... PS...I read in a Yorkie book that in Germany you must get permission from the German KC to breed a litter..they ahd to approve the parents..I know that will never float in the US..and I do not know if it is still a fact...but I am getting to the point that it makes sense to me.. |
06-06-2006, 04:27 PM | #12 |
YT 2000 Club Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Alabama
Posts: 2,225
| inbreeding well i think that's gross. pets/yorkies should be treated viewed just as humans and well enough said . yuck! poor dogs! |
06-06-2006, 06:59 PM | #13 |
Donating YT 2000 Club Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: GA
Posts: 3,787
| IMO - AKC is the best of what we have. They do try to police, but too hard to do it all. All my dogs are AKC and I prefer it, since I like to show. Dog clubs including mine are the ones that put on the shows and then follow AKC regulations in order that others and myself may show and hopefully get points on their dogs. We do the leg work, hours of set up and put down at these shows not including all the work that goes into a show before the weekend begins. I have never seen an AKC rep yet at the shows nor seen them doing any of the work. But they provide the avenue in order to obtain points. And for that I am thankful. I have also learned that if PAWS was approved - AKC would have been the one to monitor the rules and fines. So who would have been able to keep the cash from the fines? Yes, inbreeding is good - but only if ones is aware of the pedigree and has many many years of experience and knowledge with the breed standard and the dogs. T. |
06-06-2006, 07:14 PM | #14 |
BANNED! Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Illinois
Posts: 1,681
| The AKC is a good registry but they can not govern the whole breeding communitys to better any breed. Thats why its so important you find a breeder you feel comfortable with, has some knowledge in the breed and truly tries to better the breed. There are many areas in a certain breed to work on.....health, outword appearances, personality. I think serious breeder try to work on them all. Thru history I ve read in breeding the 'cream of the crop' is acceptable. I outcross breed but would inbred if with research and matches looked right. Right now I wouldnt do it though. I just dont have the matches or enough knowledge. Im learning. Breeding is very hard work. Breeding is an art. You either make a stick dog or a pecoso |
06-07-2006, 03:57 PM | #15 |
No Longer a Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: South Florida
Posts: 8,577
| breeding YES....breeding is an art..you said it to a tee! Anyone can paint a picture or breed a litter..but the results speak volumes as to the talent of the "artist"... |
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