Breeders what do you think?

[BamaFan121s]

What SPECIFICALLY is it that makes a 'reproduction specialist' so much better than well seasoned vets? What SPECIFICALLY do they do that 'traditional vets' are apparently too stupid to figure out?

[SoCalyorkiLvr]

Would you go to a general practitioner or an ob-gyn if you were considering getting pregnant?

Again, I refer to this link for further study http://www.intl.elsevierhealth.com/e-books/pdf/974.pdf

This is what a Pre-Mating Evaluation should consist of:

Review of patients's complete medical and reproductive history
Evaluation of patient's body weight and possible obesity or malnutrition concerns addressed
Evaluation of pelvic capacity
Review of vaccination history
Detailed examination of genital system
Screening for specific problems
Bacterial investigation of the genital tract
Cytological and hormonal appraisal
Hemotological and biochemical appraisal
Genetic counseling
Evaluation of Pedigree for degree of Inbreeding
Monitoring of approach of ovulation with aid of progesterone profile and vaginal smears.

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by SoCalyorkiLvr

Would you go to a general practitioner or an ob-gyn if you were considering getting pregnant?

Again, I refer to this link for further study http://www.intl.elsevierhealth.com/e-books/pdf/974.pdf

This is what a Pre-Mating Evaluation should consist of:

Review of patients's complete medical and reproductive history
Evaluation of patient's body weight and possible obesity or malnutrition concerns addressed
Evaluation of pelvic capacity
Review of vaccination history
Detailed examination of genital system
Screening for specific problems
Bacterial investigation of the genital tract
Cytological and hormonal appraisal
Hemotological and biochemical appraisal
Genetic counseling
Evaluation of Pedigree for degree of Inbreeding
Monitoring of approach of ovulation with aid of progesterone profile and vaginal smears.

First off, these were all things my vet was able to do quite efficiently.
Second, you have no REAL experience with this and can only answer the question by siting whatever you pull off the internet. Hopefully, some of the BREEDERS who have actually used one will be able to answer this question. I see this come up over and over and over and I would like to know, once and for all, from someone who has done this FIRST HAND, what the big deal is.

[red98vett]

here we go again. ...I have a feeling lots of VETS and Breeders make pretty good teams......without any specialists involved...and Wendy did get some good answers from the breeders on here -

[JCarlson2004]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

First off, these were all things my vet was able to do quite efficiently.
Second, you have no REAL experience with this and can only answer the question by siting whatever you pull off the internet. Hopefully, some of the BREEDERS who have actually used one will be able to answer this question. I see this come up over and over and over and I would like to know, once and for all, from someone who has done this FIRST HAND, what the big deal is.

Good question. I'm also really curious to hear from an actual breeder who used a "reproduction specialists" why they're better then a vet.

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by red98vett

here we go again.

You got that right! I get so sick of seeing good breeders give advice only to have it criticized! It's one thing to make additional suggestions, but quite another to speak and act like it is the absolute GOSPEL of the breeding world. It's all one OPINION vs. another. In the end, hopefully those learning will have the sense to know who's advice to take!

[shyorkies]

Maybe Irene will see this thread and post to it.. She is the only person on this forum that I know uses a Reproductive Specialist and for that I give her a BIG pat on the back!

I do not have a Reproductive Specialist in my area and in a perfect world if I was able I would drive the 3 1/2-4 hours one way to see Irene's.. But that is just not possible on a everyday basis.. But if there was ever an issue that my vet and the orthopedic specialist we go to could not answer, I would make the trip.. I am very confident in my vets and like I have said from time to time, a good breed and a wonderful vet go hand in hand! JMHO..

[YorkieRini]

Are you guys serious? There is nothing wrong with suggesting a reproduction specialist. Those of you that don't use one should not get offended, be comfortable with the choices you make. To say disregard a specialist is silly. My regular vet happens to specialize in canine reproduction. Because I started with a RS I couldn't imagine not having one. Sorry, I don't believe for one minute that if a breeder had a vet that specialized in canine reproduction near them, they wouldn't use them. Unfortunately there are not many around. Vet's don't get offended. They know who to call when a matter arises that is out of their area of expertise.

[BamaFan121s]

Irene~I did not mean it that way girl! I was just stating that I don't think it is absolutely neccessary if you have a vet that can perform the same research. It seems like alot of times they are portrayed as and absolute necessity, not a benefit if they are needed/available.

[SoCalyorkiLvr]

For the record....I never criticized anyone's advice. It was my suggestion that was criticized. (see post #13)

I also believe that people will read and make up their own minds as to what advice they wish to follow.

I believe Robbie has used one as well and there is at least one other breeder who uses one that I cannot remember the name of.

You can certainly search the threads to see what Irene has said which is basically that she considers her canine reproductive specialist an irreplaceable part of her team and her breeding program. She wouldn't be a breeder w/o one is what I believe she has inferred.

I respect that greatly and I respect those breeders who do not have one close by and have had to rely on a general vet that they trust.

I just know that when we are giving advice to first time, inexperienced breeders, it just makes sense to refer them to the best possible resources doesn't it?

[SoCalyorkiLvr]

Thanks Irene~

I was writing my response and posted before I saw that you had already posted. I hope you don't mind the way I summarized what I believed to be your thoughts on the use of a specialist.

[whispersmom2]

I have seen 6 pound females who should not be bred. Why? because they have 2-3 pounds of fat on a 3-4 pound size frame. A good mentor can judge very well, whether or not your bitch should be bred.
How level is the topline? How wide is her pelvis? And we all know about the knees, hips, heart, head and skull, bite,, etc.
I know this will thread will be another one of those that we will have to agree to disagree on and the discussions by experienced, long-time breeders, novices and pet owners who never bred will go on. Because one person uses a RS and most of us do not, will not change. My vet can handle every problem or situation I have with breeding and I will continue to use them. I guess it depends on how much confidence you have in your vet and your vet has in you to make the right choices before breeding your pet or breed-quality bitch..JMHO

[YorkieRini]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

Irene~I did not mean it that way girl! I was just stating that I don't think it is absolutely neccessary if you have a vet that can perform the same research. It seems like alot of times they are portrayed as and absolute necessity, not a benefit if they are needed/available.

That wasn't aimed at you Misty. It was a general statement. People seem to get offended. I don't go around saying ..'WHAT!! you don't use a specialist?". I really don't concern myself what others do with their programs. I have my own to worry about.

[gymbo68]

I think it is important to remember that these type of specialist are not that prevelent in Middle America- so to make that claim "that it is worth the effort and expense if you care about your girl"-- is insulting and should not have been said- it may not be possible for some people....all too often people think that because something is available to them it is everywhere- but I would be hard pressed to find a repo specialist around here....I imagine they exist but if I had a good vet and was comfortable with them, there is absolutely nothing wrong with using them.

[feminvstr]

This is what a Pre-Mating Evaluation should consist of:

Review of patients's complete medical and reproductive history
This is an automatic by ANYONES VET!
Evaluation of patient's body weight and possible obesity or malnutrition concerns addressed
Vets have very accurate scales and knowledge of obesity or malnutrition
Evaluation of pelvic capacity
All vets do this with an xray and a diameter measuring tool
Review of vaccination history
All vets have the capibility to UNDERSTAND vaccination history
Detailed examination of genital system
Details of this nature are NOT necessary unless the bitch is symptomatic
Screening for specific problems
This is encompassed within all the previously gathered results.
Bacterial investigation of the genital tract
This is merely a swab test
Cytological and hormonal appraisal
This is blood draw and is usually sent out to a specialist for evaluation.
Hemotological and biochemical appraisal
This is blood panel testing and is very routine
Genetic counseling
This is a mentoring or knowledgable breeder issue plain and simple. A vet or specialist would have to be taught each bitches genetic background in her pedigree. DNA only exist for proof of parentage at this point.
Evaluation of Pedigree for degree of Inbreeding
Again a mentoring/Breeder question and most capable for evaluating not a vet or specialist.
Monitoring of approach of ovulation with aid of progesterone profile and vaginal smears
Blood draws once again by a vet and a specialist is consulted if needed.

The best method in breeding as in anything, if there is a need for a specialist one is consulted. These evaluations listed above do not require a specialist to be preformed accurately.