luxated pattela and breeding

[karen24]

If a Yorkie has a Luxated Pattela, even a mild case, would a reputable breeder use this dog for breeding? Is it so prevalent in the breed that one would disregard a mild case or does any grade of diagnosis for this disorder end the dogs breeding days?

[MauiGirl]

According to this article a dog with LP should not be used for breeding, due to a strong genetic link especially in small dogs. I'm sure others with more experience and knowledge will share more information.

Luxating Patella: A Knee Problem in Dogs

[Lovetodream88]

A dog with LP should not be bred so no a reputable breeder would not breed a dog with LP.

[KazzyK810]

Originally Posted by Lovetodream88

A dog with LP should not be bred so no a reputable breeder would not breed a dog with LP.

A breeder that thinks this is ok, probably lets alot else slide as well. They are not breeding for the betterment of the breed, they are breeding to make $$$.

[MyFairLacy]

Luxating patellas are a poly genetic problem with some environmental factors as well. It's a major issues in toy breeds, but I don't think it will ever be completely eradicated even if only breeding dogs with normal patellas. There are different grades of luxating patellas. Grade 3-4 are usually severe enough to require surgery, sometimes grade 2. Grade 1 usually does not have much affect on the dog's quality of life and will not require surgery unless it worsens.

I test all of my dogs' patellas and send results in to OFA. I wish more breeders would test and publicize results but attitudes such as what I've read above keep many breeders from doing this. I wasn't going to comment on this thread, but I think you all need to realize that patellas are not a all or none, black and white issue. I will say that most breeders I know strive for all normal patellas but don't usually have an issue breeding a dog with a grade 1. Grade 2 and above are usually not good candidates for breeding. I think it's also important to see what your dog produces. Parents can be normal but produce puppies with patellas bad enough to require surgery, and those parents would then need to be eliminated from a breeding program. Good luck finding a breeder who is being HONEST and has only bred dogs with all normal patellas...if someone tells you this then they either just started breeding, don't test, or aren't being honest.

My puppy contract covers luxating patellas that require surgery....I hope all of my puppies have good patellas but I know the fact is that even if I only breed normal parents, I could still get puppies that have loose patellas....there is just no guarantee. Breeders are not God. I always say that you just have to test for what you can and do your best to breed and produce healthy dogs, and if a problem arises, then do the right thing and try to stop it. That's what a reputable breeder is to me. I would be devastated to produce a puppy with a health issue, and I do all I can to produce healthy dogs, And think I have a contract that protects me and the buyer and is fair.

My advice when looking for a breeder is ask about health testing they do. I admire breeders who test and are honest about any health issues they have, as long as they can also tell you what they did or are doing to eliminate those issues. Make sure they have a fair contract and health guarantee. Find a breeder you trust and are comfortable with.

[gemy]

Originally Posted by karen24

If a Yorkie has a Luxated Pattela, even a mild case, would a reputable breeder use this dog for breeding? Is it so prevalent in the breed that one would disregard a mild case or does any grade of diagnosis for this disorder end the dogs breeding days?

Karen you have posted in another thread, and I understand given how that thread went totally off topic why you posted here.


A mild one knee case of LP given all other health and structure coat and color etc are very good would not stop, nor should stop a reputable breeder from breeding.


And yes LP is very very prevalent in this breed and in many other toy breeds.


I think the key here is to ask your breeder if the pups have been evaluated for LP and what are the results? But as I posted in your other thread there are many more health tests that need to be done.


BATS testing of breeding pairs really and truly need to be done. And I would request a BATS of the puppy I was interested in, why?, because two clear dogs can produce a puppy with liver problems.


Because the breeder has disclosed to you the sire has one loose knee, you are quite rightly seeking information on what that means.


I do so hope that I have answered your questions. But in terms of puppy and puppy buying you do need to ask all the health questions and not just *one*.

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by MyFairLacy

Luxating patellas are a poly genetic problem with some environmental factors as well. It's a major issues in toy breeds, but I don't think it will ever be completely eradicated even if only breeding dogs with normal patellas. There are different grades of luxating patellas. Grade 3-4 are usually severe enough to require surgery, sometimes grade 2. Grade 1 usually does not have much affect on the dog's quality of life and will not require surgery unless it worsens.

I test all of my dogs' patellas and send results in to OFA. I wish more breeders would test and publicize results but attitudes such as what I've read above keep many breeders from doing this. I wasn't going to comment on this thread, but I think you all need to realize that patellas are not a all or none, black and white issue. I will say that most breeders I know strive for all normal patellas but don't usually have an issue breeding a dog with a grade 1. Grade 2 and above are usually not good candidates for breeding. I think it's also important to see what your dog produces. Parents can be normal but produce puppies with patellas bad enough to require surgery, and those parents would then need to be eliminated from a breeding program. Good luck finding a breeder who is being HONEST and has only bred dogs with all normal patellas...if someone tells you this then they either just started breeding, don't test, or aren't being honest.

My puppy contract covers luxating patellas that require surgery....I hope all of my puppies have good patellas but I know the fact is that even if I only breed normal parents, I could still get puppies that have loose patellas....there is just no guarantee. Breeders are not God. I always say that you just have to test for what you can and do your best to breed and produce healthy dogs, and if a problem arises, then do the right thing and try to stop it. That's what a reputable breeder is to me. I would be devastated to produce a puppy with a health issue, and I do all I can to produce healthy dogs, And think I have a contract that protects me and the buyer and is fair.

My advice when looking for a breeder is ask about health testing they do. I admire breeders who test and are honest about any health issues they have, as long as they can also tell you what they did or are doing to eliminate those issues. Make sure they have a fair contract and health guarantee. Find a breeder you trust and are comfortable with.

Maybe the problem is that no breeder takes the time to explain things like that to others? Without given the right information that you can not just google and find or read a book and find and no one tries to educate people about it then how are they supposed to know? It's assumed there just jerky nasty posters when in fact they/we/me are not educated in that. I would love to hear some of the other breeders of yorkies on the subject but I'm guessing this is some guarded thing? There is certain things you can not learn no matter how many books or websites you read. I don't mind learning. I have talked with a few reputable breeders about breeding a female every heat and that it's not necessarily a bad thing and there are facts to back it up. I was thrilled a breeder took the time to explain it to me because a lot of well respected breeders don't they just say nope your wrong throw a few confusing facts in and move on. I also think it's better to hear it from a breeder who works with actual yorkies not just a general breeder or one who has never bred yorkies because it's easier to believe someone who knows first hand about it. Yorkies are say far different from like a lab or a Great Dane.

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by gemy

Karen you have posted in another thread, and I understand given how that thread went totally off topic why you posted here.


A mild one knee case of LP given all other health and structure coat and color etc are very good would not stop, nor should stop a reputable breeder from breeding.


And yes LP is very very prevalent in this breed and in many other toy breeds.


I think the key here is to ask your breeder if the pups have been evaluated for LP and what are the results? But as I posted in your other thread there are many more health tests that need to be done.


BATS testing of breeding pairs really and truly need to be done. And I would request a BATS of the puppy I was interested in, why?, because two clear dogs can produce a puppy with liver problems.


Because the breeder has disclosed to you the sire has one loose knee, you are quite rightly seeking information on what that means.


I do so hope that I have answered your questions. But in terms of puppy and puppy buying you do need to ask all the health questions and not just *one*.

This one was posted before her other thread became an argument.

[MyFairLacy]

Originally Posted by Lovetodream88

Maybe the problem is that no breeder takes the time to explain things like that to others? Without given the right information that you can not just google and find or read a book and find and no one tries to educate people about it then how are they supposed to know? It's assumed there just jerky nasty posters when in fact they/we/me are not educated in that. I would love to hear some of the other breeders of yorkies on the subject but I'm guessing this is some guarded thing? There is certain things you can not learn no matter how many books or websites you read. I don't mind learning. I have talked with a few reputable breeders about breeding a female every heat and that it's not necessarily a bad thing and there are facts to back it up. I was thrilled a breeder took the time to explain it to me because a lot of well respected breeders don't they just say nope your wrong throw a few confusing facts in and move on. I also think it's better to hear it from a breeder who works with actual yorkies not just a general breeder or one who has never bred yorkies because it's easier to believe someone who knows first hand about it. Yorkies are say far different from like a lab or a Great Dane.

Good I'm glad you're open to hearing what we had to say. I do agree that higher grade luxating patellas are a painful and serious issue and one all good breeders should want to avoid. It's just not as easy as only breeding perfect parents.

[Lovetodream88]

Originally Posted by MyFairLacy

Good I'm glad you're open to hearing what we had to say. I do agree that higher grade luxating patellas are a painful and serious issue and one all good breeders should want to avoid. It's just not as easy as only breeding perfect parents.

This is not meant to sound crappy but a serious question, why does it seem this is something not really talked about by breeders or something they don't want to talk about? I think most people could also understand that it's hard to just take the word of a breeder of larger dogs not yorkies it's not offense to Gemy or breeders of other dogs on here.

[gemy]

Originally Posted by Lovetodream88

This one was posted before her other thread became an argument.

Well the information I posted is still valid

[karen24]

All opinions are valid and certainly offered for the best intentions, I am appreciative of all information and comments.

After reading all comments, I better understand the issues, have new questions for the breeder(s), and will continue to research this and other genetic issues.

I am taking this decision very seriously and will seek out the best breeder with the best puppy to purchase and love.

Thank you all.

[chickensmith]

Originally Posted by karen24

All opinions are valid and certainly offered for the best intentions, I am appreciative of all information and comments.

After reading all comments, I better understand the issues, have new questions for the breeder(s), and will continue to research this and other genetic issues.

I am taking this decision very seriously and will seek out the best breeder with the best puppy to purchase and love.

Thank you all.

cannot wait to see what your journey brings you!

[gemy]

Karen what a lovely post - so thoughtfull. I certainly wish you great joy in your new puppy once you find him or her!

[Lovetodream88]

After pming with Gemy it really is more then just does the breeder have LP it's about how bad, did the parents have it, did the siblings have it and such.